Box X Or Bartacker Advice

[suem]

If this has been asked before I apologize. I'm doing quite a lot of sewing involving straps and handles, right now I do the x type box stitching to hold the strap on for strength manually on my patcher or my other leather machine. This takes a lot of time, I could get more done if it was a bit more automated and thus take on larger jobs with a more tight delivery schedule.

Yes I've seen the 5000+ dollar computerized tackers, wish I could hit the lottery and buy one. Yes I've also seen used ones in the 2500.00 range, still a bit tight for the beer budget.

I'm certain that someone had box x tackers before computers came about .... I've seen a few older singers advertised as box x machines but I'm not having luck findout what they can do etc.

I've heard there are machines that use cams instead of a computer...that is ideal to me, no worries about sensitive electronics in the florida humidity (not to mention static electricity in the winter).

So I need the advice of the experienced on what sort of box x machines are out there that are not computerized and what their capabilities are and some idea of what I may be able to buy one for. I am doing primarily one and two inch strap material, heavy nylon and leather, may have a need for 4 inch straps in the future.

So what's out there? Can I please get some manufacturer names and model numbers...I just have no clue what search words to use in google not finding much under box x, or box tacker.

All help appreciated.

[Wizcrafts]

Suem;

I've seen those x tacker machines you are looking for. They are cam driven, just like a bartacker. They were/are made by Singer, Brother, Juki and others. The Singer model you want is a 269x...series. For instance, the Singer 269x999 produces two boxed criss-cross patterns: 1/2" x 1 1/4" and 3 1/4" x 1-3/4"

Machines like this are plentiful since the closure of many textile and garment plants in the USA. Most industrial sewing machine dealers who sell to a variety of markets (not just to leathercrafters) have several tacking machines sitting on shelves, collecting dust. They were made to tack all day long, not sit and die. Call a dealer (e.g. 866-362-7397) and see if he has an old Singer X pattern tacker in stock. If the pattern dimensions are close to what you want, and the price is affordable, grab it.

Oh, when you find your tacker and bring it home, put it far away from the spouse. They produce a wonderful racket, with a super loud CLANG at the end of the cycle!

[crazyguy]

Hello,

Is there a list out there that describe what each of the models of the Singer 269 do?

I have passed on several in the craigs list in the past pure for lack of information. The owners never seem to know wht they do!

Thanks!

[Wizcrafts]

Hello,

Is there a list out there that describe what each of the models of the Singer 269 do?

I have passed on several in the craigs list in the past pure for lack of information. The owners never seem to know wht they do!

Thanks!

I guess that info can be found by searching the Simanco.com database on the model 269 machines. Or, ask dealers who sold them and still have some in stock. I gave you a phone number for one dealer who undoubtedly has various bartackers on his shelves.

[suem]

Suem;

I've seen those x tacker machines you are looking for. They are cam driven, just like a bartacker. They were/are made by Singer, Brother, Juki and others. The Singer model you want is a 269x...series. For instance, the Singer 269x999 produces two boxed criss-cross patterns: 1/2" x 1 1/4" and 3 1/4" x 1-3/4"

Oh, when you find your tacker and bring it home, put it far away from the spouse. They produce a wonderful racket, with a super loud CLANG at the end of the cycle!

No spouse, just a big iguana who would probably just turn around and stare at me and the offending noise for a minute and go back to sleep. So is it hard to set these up or is it just a matter of popping in cams? I assume the parts are available as well?

Edited May 23, 2011 by suem

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

No spouse, just a big iguana who would probably just turn around and stare at me and the offending noise for a minute and go back to sleep. So is it hard to set these up or is it just a matter of popping in cams? I assume the parts are available as well?

269W machines are dead as a doornail. I have over 30 that need need to be thrown away. Good machine design, next to impossible to service. My father is an expert on repair and service of the 269W machines. Just try to get him to work on one! And that's the other problem, is finding somoene to work on these.

Better to look at Singer 68/69 class machies, 3/4X3/4 56 stich patterns are most common. We sell these 'conversions' custom cam for less than the $2,500 used as is, so buyer beware.

[ELeBlanc]

Greg: I'm looking at what is described as a pair of Jado and Freeman Box X conversions. Are these yours? They look like the Singer 68.Should I have any hesitations? I don't think they have been used in years. Lousy picture but all that I have.

Edited February 10, 2017 by ELeBlanc
added photo

[Uwe]

I have a few old-school Box-X machines (and a pile of cam disks) that I'm dreading to work on. The only one I have any real confidence in is this Singer 68, which seems to be in nice, functional condition, but I know very little about them:

 

For reference just to see what's out there and for rough price guidance, I occasionally visit Miami Sewing Machine's website:

http://www.miamisewing.com/specials/tacker.htm

I've never dealt with Miami Sewing and can't really say if they're "worthy", but at least they put their inventory online with pictures and a price.On the plus side, they're a day trip away from the Tampa area, which avoids costly shipping of these complex, apparently hard to repair, heavy and fragile machines.

Edited February 10, 2017 by Uwe

[gottaknow]

On 6/1/2011 at 7:02 AM, Gregg From Keystone Sewing said:

269W machines are dead as a doornail. I have over 30 that need need to be thrown away. Good machine design, next to impossible to service. My father is an expert on repair and service of the 269W machines. Just try to get him to work on one! And that's the other problem, is finding somoene to work on these.

Better to look at Singer 68/69 class machies, 3/4X3/4 56 stich patterns are most common. We sell these 'conversions' custom cam for less than the $2,500 used as is, so buyer beware.

I keep a couple of 269's around if we need some additional production. They can humble a lot of good mechanics. I'm old, so the first factory I worked in had about 15 of them. I don't mind working on them, better than the 2 Reece PWX42 pocket welt machines. I do like the simple design of the 68/69's. We use several in or luggage factory. I totally agree with Gregg on not buying a 269. 

Regards, Eric 

[Constabulary]

Eric or Gregg do guys you have experience with programmable bar tack machines? I often sew different sizes of box stacks from 1/2" up to 2" most of the time with 138 thread. I still can do it with the 111 but its a quite annoying job.

[gottaknow]

5 hours ago, Constabulary said:

Eric or Gregg do guys you have experience with programmable bar tack machines? I often sew different sizes of box stacks from 1/2" up to 2" most of the time with 138 thread. I still can do it with the 111 but its a quite annoying job.

I have several pattern tackers. The most user friendly are the Brother 438 series. I also have the Juki 1900 series which are very reliable. I'm buying 4 new Jukis this year, but I haven't seen them yet. I also have some now antique Mitsubishi's (1980's) that still work fine, but getting new pattern chips programmed is an issue. We set all of our labels with a new Brother pattern tacker which we can program ourselves. Each label size requires a different clamp setup which are about $700 each, and we have 6 different labels. The older Brother 438 has a very tired servo that doesn't like webbing very much, and goes into error. It will do lighter stuff all day. Buyer beware on any used electronic tacker. 

Regards, Eric 

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

12 hours ago, ELeBlanc said:

Greg: I'm looking at what is described as a pair of Jado and Freeman Box X conversions. Are these yours? They look like the Singer 68.Should I have any hesitations? I don't think they have been used in years. Lousy picture but all that I have.

Jado Sewing is alive and well making these up these Singer 68 class conversion pattern tackers to order, for sure.  Frank Friedman & Sons, Inc./Gellman are long gone, and a lot of their cam patterns were taken over by Jado as well.

All I can tell you that when these machines are converted, they are built from cam up.  These machines are really only going to do what the cam is cut for, so if the actual pattern is not what you are looking for, it's not at all like you can go out, have a new cam cut, swap it out, and start to do something different.  These machines do not work like that.

The nice thing about these type of machines is that they are very capable of sewing heavier threads and materials, think of like cargo nets with a box cross pattern for example, or a WW pattern for a seatbelt.  

 

[ELeBlanc]

thanks for the quick response to a 5 year old thread.

[Constabulary]

Eric, I however cannot afford a new one but you never know what you come across . I narrowed down to Brother BAS 311 but, well, that was just an idea... I of course have my eyes open but you never know what you will find...

So you would generally say do not buy a used programmable tacker?

I really would love to have a Singer 68/69 but on my side of the pond I most likely will not find the cam discs need. And switching them is probably a too big challenge for me so thats why I had the idea with a programmable x Box tacker...

Maybe not the best idea....

[gottaknow]

3 hours ago, Constabulary said:

Eric, I however cannot afford a new one but you never know what you come across . I narrowed down to Brother BAS 311 but, well, that was just an idea... I of course have my eyes open but you never know what you will find...

So you would generally say do not buy a used programmable tacker?

I really would love to have a Singer 68/69 but on my side of the pond I most likely will not find the cam discs need. And switching them is probably a too big challenge for me so thats why I had the idea with a programmable x Box tacker...

Maybe not the best idea....

The problem with an electronic unit, is you have no idea what shape the drive unit is in. For my tired Brother, it will do two layers of heavy webbing, but not three. Two years ago it would do three. Even with testing, if it's been in a factory, they are run 40 hours a week. That's a lot of cycles on a ten year old machine. My Brother 311 is new, and all we sew on it is labels on one layer of wool. Find one like that and you'd be ok. My 438 has spent most of its life doing heavy webbing on tactical gear. You just don't know what you're going to get. 

Regards, Eric