Gun Belt question...

[jt1]

Ready to make my first Concealed carry gun belt, This will be double thick using two straps of sewn 8/10 oz, the question is should I glue them up flat or round approximating the waist size of the user, or does it not make a difference?

Thanks...

Edited May 4, 2009 by jt1

[ABC3]

jt1;

There are several ways to make a concealed belt - it seems there is no one right way to do it. I for one, cut the two straps, groove the stitch line in both belt & liner, punch the holes in the tip & the buckle slot as well as the chicago screws. Then dye just the belt not the liner. Let dry over night.Then glue both liner & belt together & let dry. Then stitch.

I hope this helps alittle. There are members on the forum that str much better than I. Maybe they will chime in & offer some real advice.

[Shorts]

It's really up to you how you want to do it.

If you stitch it straight it will eventually break in and conform to the user.

Or you can radius the belt a couple different ways and that will probably produce a comfy belt right away rather than needing to break in.

As Tom said, there's no right way to do it, just try a method and see how it goes.

I built my first belt straight. It was done to walk myself through the belt making process so I kept it pretty simple. My belt is a double layer of 7/8oz. I'm wearing it now and it's taken a little time to break in, but its allowed me to see first hand how this build would wear. Not bad at all.

Give it a go on how you feel comfortable with.

[Lobo]

On the topic of belts, a belt constructed of 2 layers of 7-8 oz. cowhide will have a finished thickness of nearly 1/4".

I have been making belt regularly only for a few months, so my experience is limited. However, a couple of things have come up that bear some consideration.

First, the bulk caused by the leather thickness requires a belt dimension that is usually different from trouser waist size. For example, I wear a size 34 trouser, but a double-layer belt must provide 37" between buckle tip and tongue hole to be used. This has come up a couple of times, so I make it a practice to ask the customer to measure a belt that he normally wears, from buckle tip to tongue hole being used, then I make sure that the new belt will accomodate that dimension (plus at least 2 or 3 inches).

Second, a belt that thick can cause problems with holster attachments. We have to make sure that belt slots and tunnel loops are formed to accept the thickness of the belt. Pouches and other accessories may or may not have adequate clearance.

Third, many trousers have belt loops that will not accomodate such a belt. While a standard 1.5" width belt might go through the loops on my Dockers just fine, a double thickness belt will not. The second thickness of leather will require an additional clearance of 1/8" multiplied by 2 in order to fit around the belt. As we all know, the fit of the holster to the belt is critical to achieving a stable platform for the handgun, so this can cause problems for the customer.

So, those are my thoughts.

[ABC3]

Lobo - good food for thought. I only use 6/7 oz bull hide (double thickness) & it will measure just a tad under 1/4". I have never had a problem with this thickness fitting in a slot punched with a 1 1/5" punch nor loops in casual pants. Althouth I've not tried this width on dress slacks. The tunnel, on a holster, is a different story & one must make certain it fits correctly.

My concern & my question was regarding the over-all length of the straps. (What I'm trying to do is make up a grid showing the total strap length need for a certain size belt. I don't want to have to measure the belt + the inside of the buckle, allow for the buckle flap & then allow for the hole being used to the end of the belt tip. I need to cut down on production time).

Thus I want to refer to my grid & say alright the customer wants a 39" belt - I will need to cut two straps 49" long for example.

Am I making any sense with this?

[jt1]

Good input...I had not considered that a thicker belt would inpact the O/A lenght quite so much, but when I think about it I guess it would. Might be a good move to take all measurements from the inside. I am looking to bulid a very strong and stout belt but after reading the posts here I think the strips I have cut might be a bit thick as they would result in a belt about 3/8" thick...I might just use some 5/6 for the lining with one strip of the 8/9 I have cut to end up with a 1/4" thick belt. I will do a few and see how they work out. My original question was not about cutting the belt on a "curve", but rather when gluing up the two pieces. I was told by an old timer at the Portland Leather Company to start the glue up in the middle and work in both directions in the approximate waist size of the user to keep the two strips tensioned evenly all along the lenght of the belt, he's been building western rigs and saddes for over 50 years and I'm old enought to know when to listen...

Hobby Tom - I like the chart idea, seems you need to take the material thickness into account also.

Thanks for the replys

[ps0303]

I have been reading some on belt making and I read somewhere that some people added a strip of Kydex between the two layers to add stiffness to the belt. Supposedly makes for a better gun belt.

What are the thoughts here about adding Kydex between the two layers?

Kydex is plastic.

[Lobo]

Lobo - good food for thought. I only use 6/7 oz bull hide (double thickness) & it will measure just a tad under 1/4". I have never had a problem with this thickness fitting in a slot punched with a 1 1/5" punch nor loops in casual pants. Althouth I've not tried this width on dress slacks. The tunnel, on a holster, is a different story & one must make certain it fits correctly.

My concern & my question was regarding the over-all length of the straps. (What I'm trying to do is make up a grid showing the total strap length need for a certain size belt. I don't want to have to measure the belt + the inside of the buckle, allow for the buckle flap & then allow for the hole being used to the end of the belt tip. I need to cut down on production time).

Thus I want to refer to my grid & say alright the customer wants a 39" belt - I will need to cut two straps 49" long for example.

Am I making any sense with this?

Tom: You are making better sense than most would recognize. As to your idea of a "grid" or "chart", that will take some effort to accomplish, and the results might still be somewhat iffy. I like to get a definite measurement from the customer before cutting the pieces for a belt.

[ABC3]

Kydex, plastic & nylon is sometimes added in 18" sections to the back of the belt for additional support but I see no need. Two layers of 5/6 Bull/Horse/Cow has plenty of support IMO. I think the addition is "over kill".

I carry an Ed Brown or a Les Baer commander OWB every single day & have never had a support problem.

I could certainly be wrong (to each his own) but I would think the addition of a stiffiner would fall under marketing.

[Bree]

I have been reading some on belt making and I read somewhere that some people added a strip of Kydex between the two layers to add stiffness to the belt. Supposedly makes for a better gun belt.

What are the thoughts here about adding Kydex between the two layers?

Kydex is plastic.

I don't add it. You would need a really heavy rig to call for the stiffener. Two layers of 7 oz leather is plenty strong. It holds my XD-45 without any problem and the XD is a moderately heavy gun.

If you had to hold something like an S&W 500 Mag or an MR .50 Desert Eagle, you might require a stiffener since the guns weigh over 70 oz without ammo. But you might well need some suspenders to hold your belt up unless you have hips!! Those are really HEAVY guns and you don't carry them concealed.

[Dwight]

FWIW, . . . I make my belts by laying down the liner (having coated both with contact cement and allowed it to dry properly) with the glue up, . . . cover it with newspaper, . . . and starting at the buckle end, . . . lay the "outside" piece of leather onto the liner. I then roll them together with a wall paper seam roller and finish with a rolling pin on a hard counter surface.

It is then sewn around the edges, . . . holes punched, . . . dyed and finished, . . . and I have never had a complaint yet.

Mine regularly carries a full size, all steel 1911, all day, . . . no problems.

I have only had one pair of pants that had belt loop trouble, . . . a $10 pair of jeans from Wally World, . . . and they are just snug, . . . but they go through.

My $.02

May God bless,

Dwight

[Tac]

Dwight,

What weight leather are you using for belt and liner?

Thanks

-Tac

[ABC3]

I use 6/7 oz Bull & have just started to play with 7/8 Bull but will go back to 6/7 Bull. Plenty of support. No need for a stuffer/ Reinforcement IMO.

[Dwight]

My belt measures .260 to .280 if you take a mike and check it in different spots, . . . which makes it just over a quarter of an inch in thickness, . . . meaning it had to be 8/9 oz for both pieces. And it is basically a full 1 1/2" wide.

I am very happy with mine, . . . it has taken on "My" shape in the years I have worn it (it needed a good couple of weeks to "set" so to speak), . . . and I do not have any other belt I would rather wear, . . . with or without the 1911.

May God bless,

Dwight