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Jewelers Rouge is chemically what?


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#1 TheTrooper

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 05:15 AM

Dear all,

does anyone of you what Jewelers Rouge chemically is ??

I´m asking this because, as my daywork I´m an laboratory assistent. I know that we have some polishing compounds here. But I don´t wanna make something wrong, thats why I´m asking, what Jewelers Rouge really is ??

Cheers,

Marcel
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#2 Art

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 09:58 AM

Hi Marcel,

Jeweler's Rouge (the real stuff used by jewelers not platers) is finely ground Ferric Oxide powder (iron oxide or commonly rust) Fe2O3. In bar form it is usually in some grease or wax binder.

Art

Dear all,

does anyone of you what Jewelers Rouge chemically is ??

I´m asking this because, as my daywork I´m an laboratory assistent. I know that we have some polishing compounds here. But I don´t wanna make something wrong, thats why I´m asking, what Jewelers Rouge really is ??

Cheers,

Marcel


For heaven's sakes pilgrim, make yourself a strop!

#3 TheTrooper

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 10:18 AM

Thanks Art,

I guessed it is corundum, from its normally white color (aluminum oxide abrasive - Al2O3). Do you know if I can also use this for stropping my Swifelknife blade ??

Regards,

M.
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#4 Art

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 10:52 AM

Hi Marcel,

White and Green Rouge (kind of a misnomer right there) are not Jeweler's Rouge but are aluminum based (in the case of White, Yellow, and Black Rouges) or Chromium Based (for Green Rouge Cr2O3), Jeweler's Rouge is finely ground Alpha Phase Iron Oxide and is a much less aggressive cutter than Aluminum or Chrome. Since we want to polish the blade and not cut it, we use the Jeweler's Rouge which is "less hard" and finer ground than the others. Stropping is not a particularly precise operation and we really don't want to cut metal. Jeweler's Rouge is also used by jewelers because it "yellows up" gold quite a bit. I have never studied the chemistry of that process, but it is what I am told.

Art

Thanks Art,

I guessed it is corundum, from its normally white color (aluminum oxide abrasive - Al2O3). Do you know if I can also use this for stropping my Swifelknife blade ??

Regards,

M.


For heaven's sakes pilgrim, make yourself a strop!

#5 Rawhide

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 11:31 AM

Yeah the white "jeweler's rouge" sold at Tandy is the Aluminum Oxide form and is used to strop swivel knives, or any blade edge you want to keep polished.
Marlon

#6 whinewine

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 12:14 PM

Hi Marcel,

White and Green Rouge (kind of a misnomer right there) are not Jeweler's Rouge but are aluminum based (in the case of White, Yellow, and Black Rouges) or Chromium Based (for Green Rouge Cr2O3), Jeweler's Rouge is finely ground Alpha Phase Iron Oxide and is a much less aggressive cutter than Aluminum or Chrome. Since we want to polish the blade and not cut it, we use the Jeweler's Rouge which is "less hard" and finer ground than the others. Stropping is not a particularly precise operation and we really don't want to cut metal. Jeweler's Rouge is also used by jewelers because it "yellows up" gold quite a bit. I have never studied the chemistry of that process, but it is what I am told.

Art

Sometime back, there was some discussion about stropping ruby blades with jeweler's rouge & I adamantly disagreed with those who insisted that jeweler's rouge... 1) would be able to strop ruby blades, ...2) and that one could definitely discern a difference after stropping, and that the composition of jeweler's rouge ...3) WAS aluminum oxide. I stated and felt that any perceived benefit of stropping with jeweler's rouge was the result of a placebo effect, since ruby (corundum) was the second hardest natural substance [9 or 9. something on the MOHS scale]. However, at that time, I felt it was not worth arguing with those who insisted I was wrong.
There are different types of 'rouge'... yellow, green, white, blue, black... none of which are red (ie, 'rouge') and all of which significantly differ in composition from Jeweler's rouge.
Jeweler's rouge is simply rust- 5.5 to 6.5 on the MOHS scale= NOT hard enough to polish a ruby blade.

#7 Rawhide

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Posted 04 October 2007 - 04:53 PM

maybe it is placebo effect. :dunno:. I do know what I feel. I feel a difference if I strop it. However, stropping a hollow ground steel blade, the smooth feel lasts about twice as long as the smooth feel of the stropped ruby, but I still feel a difference. Sorry that goes against all the technical mumbo jumbo that you know.

Say what you will, it works for me :thumbsup:

Marlon
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#8 TheTrooper

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Posted 05 October 2007 - 01:50 AM

Thanks Guys,

for all the replies. I will take a look, if I have some Fe2O3 in my chemicals stock :biggrin:

Have a nice weekend,

M.

Edited by adamant-leather, 05 October 2007 - 02:05 AM.

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#9 skipj

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Posted 05 October 2007 - 07:14 AM

Someone told me at a class this spring in Wickenburg that stropping the swivel knife during carving doesn't polish the swivel knife but cleans the residue from the leather and makes it cut smoother.
SkipJ

#10 whinewine

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Posted 05 October 2007 - 08:05 AM

maybe it is placebo effect. :dunno:. I do know what I feel. I feel a difference if I strop it. However, stropping a hollow ground steel blade, the smooth feel lasts about twice as long as the smooth feel of the stropped ruby, but I still feel a difference. Sorry that goes against all the technical mumbo jumbo that you know.

Say what you will, it works for me :thumbsup:

Marlon

It's unfortunate that you believe science is 'technical mumbo jumbo' as you term it. For years I had traveled to North Carolina to dig out gemstones (emeralds, aquamarines, sapphires [same material as ruby= corundum], tourmalines, garnets, amethyst...). Most I kept as specimens, but many I cut & polished into cabachons, including sapphires. Diamond is what is used to polish corundum- not rust (jeweler's rouge).

But that's okay. You know what you feel, and you believe, and that's all that matters to you. And that's fine.
All I have on my side is science ('technical mumbo jumbo'). I consider this discussion about stropping ruby blades ended. :deadhorse:

Edited by whinewine, 05 October 2007 - 10:40 AM.






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