Garyspruill

New Thread Company Advice

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Folks,

New to board, new to leatherwork, learning.

Found this site by accident through google.

I am more of a reader of posts, rather than a writer.

Name: Gary

Have built several projects and proud of all of them. Wife is happy anyway. I get a lot of satisfaction from the detail work that goes into what I am making and have a much higher appreciation to other’s work now as well.  

Personal life: business owner. High stakes entrepreneur, husband and father of 3 boys, 2 great daughter-in-laws (my now daughter's) and (5) great grand-kids

In all things I do, I can never set idle nor on the sidelines. Never!

I have a business idea, and wanted to see the “if” there was an interest in it?

I have read many posts on this forum about different types of hand sewing thread. OK? I started studying all the different types there were since this was such a huge topic. I have used and respect the “Tiger Thread” due to its ease of use and likability from other user's.

Here lies my humble question:

Is there an interest – market for a like product to this thread?

Polyester, braided high strand count, flat, lightly waxed, super high tensile strength.

I know this topic is covered all the time. I am approaching it from a different side of things. I am very used to new company start ups and know, I need to know the market before I jump in with both feet and asking for your assistance to let me know if there is even a market for such a thing.

I have already reached out and visited several thread companies with my ideas here in the US. Several have even told me to pound sand and did not want to even get involved with such a project. I never take a “no” about anything.

Your feedback would be grateful and rewarded if take on this crazy adventure.

Let me know the “what” you are looking for, what you would want to “see” in a leather thread. I will be a sponge and soak it all in. Reminder: I am on the Tiger Thread path.

Thanks a million in advance,

Gary

PS: If you can’t tell, I am not a huge “poster” on forums 

Edited by Garyspruill

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That sounds good, I am new to leather work as well, but I like the waxed braided cord from Tandy and the artificial sinew more than the “thread” threads. The hemp thread knots and snarls on my projects often very tightly before I notice, which makes to take longer to unknot. They, the braid and sinew, seem to lie better on (in) the work, smoother and not so puffy and amateurish.

I also like having more than black, brown, cream and white to work with. After years of sewing projects, it’s a very limiting color range.

I’m a variegated gal if I can get it. Lol. Seventies yarn.

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To make new thread is relatively easy to do, the problem arises with the marketing of such tread.Where are you going to place your thread in the current market, at the top end, middle or lowest cost.

The low cost is quite a large market but covered well by the Far eastern countries.

The top and middle area's mainly covered by a very traditional group of people who will require a lot of proof the item is significantly better then existing threads and will require a massive amount of marketing to make headway into both area's

Also with thread it's quite a slow moving item, people don't go out and buy 1500 meter cops every month, so stock costs could be very high especially if selling many colours

Can it be done Yes, but very hard to challenge existing market,  

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10 hours ago, ScoobyNewbie said:

That sounds good, I am new to leather work as well, but I like the waxed braided cord from Tandy and the artificial sinew more than the “thread” threads. The hemp thread knots and snarls on my projects often very tightly before I notice, which makes to take longer to unknot. They, the braid and sinew, seem to lie better on (in) the work, smoother and not so puffy and amateurish.

I also like having more than black, brown, cream and white to work with. After years of sewing projects, it’s a very limiting color range.

I’m a variegated gal if I can get it. Lol. Seventies yarn.

Thank you scoobynewbie,

I have never used the Tandy sinew. I may have to go to a Tandy store and see what it even is.

Colors: I am thinking somewhere close to 30(+) colors for what I am doing.

Gary

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8 hours ago, chrisash said:

To make new thread is relatively easy to do, the problem arises with the marketing of such tread.Where are you going to place your thread in the current market, at the top end, middle or lowest cost.

The low cost is quite a large market but covered well by the Far eastern countries.

The top and middle area's mainly covered by a very traditional group of people who will require a lot of proof the item is significantly better then existing threads and will require a massive amount of marketing to make headway into both area's

Also with thread it's quite a slow moving item, people don't go out and buy 1500 meter cops every month, so stock costs could be very high especially if selling many colours

Can it be done Yes, but very hard to challenge existing market,  

Hey chrisash,

Market looking at: Middle to High end at consumer level: yet at a cost of about 1/2 of what we are paying for the same here in the US from brothers and sisters Italy and Germany. 

I am very used to marketing, aka: getting the word out and tested. Understood what your saying. Better product at 1/2 the costs is not always going to knock the top dog off the hill. I am thinking of the "user" market, not the big boys. 

My game plan: if I pursue, make the product, test - test and test some more, then; get it in the hands of the user's by sending out free samples to try out. Not 1500 meter cops, but at least a couple of 25 meter spools. Get feedback and make the needed changes. I am going to be relying on folks that "know" a ton more than I do. I live on the marketing basis of: let the market tell you what they want and they drive the market.

Thanks for the input, helpful.

Gary

Edited by Garyspruill

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2 hours ago, Fowlingpiece said:

It appears to be plenty of competition with the modern synthetics. Why not work on some quality linen cordage?

Hey Fowlingpiece,

I like your idea. Linen Cordage, maybe in phase (2) add an additional line of product to the lineup. Something like the Lin Cable from France that would be lightly pre-waxed. Hmmmm??? Good idea. Thank you!

Gary

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My goal would be to offer a product that is equal to or better than what we currently have access to here in the US and to our brother's and sister's across the pond that would offer more color selections and at about 1/2 the costs.

Me paying $7.00 for 25 meters of thread is telling me in my head, there is a market there. Then when I order it, and am told they are out of this or that color, tells me even more, there is a market there. I am not putting the re-seller's down or anything negative, I am only thinking: at $7.00, and they are selling out, a lot of folks are selling - buying a lot of it.

Gary

Edited by Garyspruill

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Trouble is you only make to meet demand, they will have a minimum amount that it's economical to make in one batch, often in slow moving colours it's just not worth making more and having a large stock holding (money) tied up

If you are making as for the half way house then strong possibility that the buyers are not that interested in the cost of the thread as cost is low in proportion to other costs, but still at the same time interested highly in quality

Just my thoughts, could be well wrong

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1 hour ago, chrisash said:

Trouble is you only make to meet demand, they will have a minimum amount that it's economical to make in one batch, often in slow moving colours it's just not worth making more and having a large stock holding (money) tied up

If you are making as for the half way house then strong possibility that the buyers are not that interested in the cost of the thread as cost is low in proportion to other costs, but still at the same time interested highly in quality

Just my thoughts, could be well wrong

Hey Chrisash,

Agreed in your comments.

Pick the colors you want to run with, let the market dictate the strongest colors, keep those colors on a consistent 30 day turn around time at factory. Let the slow seller's be on a order as needed basis to restock. Doing it this way, your core group will always be there to pay for the stranglers - non-sellers. 

Quality: design it to be the best, test it, let the market decide if your right or if changes need to be made.  

Striving for the best, hoping to get to the end user at a niche price point.

Thanks again,

Gary

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Have you considered touching base with a company such as Springfield Leather Company to discuss your idea? They are a standalone company that has a large customer base across the spectrum of leather crafters. Kevin or Rusty would be the ones to talk to.

Personally I only sew by machine now, I started out hand sewing but after hand stitching a couple of belts I made the investment in a Cobra 4 machine.

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Don't forget the existing companies are experts in their own field and have years of experimenting to get where they are today, that's why there is a cost. how are you going to match that yet be cheaper

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3 hours ago, Ed in Tx said:

Have you considered touching base with a company such as Springfield Leather Company to discuss your idea? They are a standalone company that has a large customer base across the spectrum of leather crafters. Kevin or Rusty would be the ones to talk to.

Personally I only sew by machine now, I started out hand sewing but after hand stitching a couple of belts I made the investment in a Cobra 4 machine.

Hey Ed in TX,

Another Texan here. Have I touched base with Springfield, District, Buckle Guy, Frog Jelly, Makers, yes.

I am working with some top notch thread engineer's (never knew there was such a thing), and wanted to get this (if) idea off the ground as a stand alone first, then if we choose to offer the product to the wholesale route, can do so at that time. My main concept is going to be: maker to user market. This may change, but for now, this is the path I am on.

Sewing machine thread: this is what the thread guru's keep pushing me to do first?? Same type of thread as mentioned above, yet non-waxed in the size 130's and 90's just for sewing machines. Maybe down the road along with the Linen goods.

Thank you kindly for the input. Something to put on the chalk board.

Gary

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My goals are:

1st - Hand sewing thread

2nd - Sewing Machine thread

3rd - Linen Thread

4th - Edge Paint

5th - Motorized parts - burnishers -  sanders

Right now, I am in the first stages, trying to figure out the "if" there is/would be a market for such a thing. If not, move on. If yes, pursue it, test it, see if on the right track to offer.  Still trying to figure out what the Leather worker's want to see in a hand sewing thread. 

Quick story, my youngest son, wanted to learn how to Fence (Sport Fencing for Olympics), we went out to find him a club and he was very successful at it. Me, not setting on the sidelines, now have this to offer to the fencer's: www.swordmasters.com, many of the products we offer, we  design and make ourselves. Its a niche market, yet is very successful. 

 

Gary

Edited by Garyspruill

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9 hours ago, Garyspruill said:

Hey chrisash,

Market looking at: Middle to High end at consumer level: yet at a cost of about 1/2 of what we are paying for the same here in the US from brothers and sisters Italy and Germany. 

I am very used to marketing, aka: getting the word out and tested. Understood what your saying. Better product at 1/2 the costs is not always going to knock the top dog off the hill. I am thinking of the "user" market, not the big boys. 

My game plan: if I pursue, make the product, test - test and test some more, then; get it in the hands of the user's by sending out free samples to try out. Not 1500 meter cops, but at least a couple of 25 meter spools. Get feedback and make the needed changes. I am going to be relying on folks that "know" a ton more than I do. I live on the marketing basis of: let the market tell you what they want and they drive the market.

Thanks for the input, helpful.

Gary

I have a feeling that you won't be able to get to 1/2 the cost of what I am getting from Germany (Ritza 25 Tiger Thread), I get it for about $.06 per yard and that is INCLUDING the shipping costs being broken out.  Besides, it sounds like you are just trying to provide the same thing that we get from the Tiger Thread which is already a very popular thread among the quality professional craftsmen.  Here is wishing you luck though and hopefully you can pull it off.

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2 hours ago, NVLeatherWorx said:

I have a feeling that you won't be able to get to 1/2 the cost of what I am getting from Germany (Ritza 25 Tiger Thread), I get it for about $.06 per yard and that is INCLUDING the shipping costs being broken out.  Besides, it sounds like you are just trying to provide the same thing that we get from the Tiger Thread which is already a very popular thread among the quality professional craftsmen.  Here is wishing you luck though and hopefully you can pull it off.

Thanks NVLeatherworx,

1/2 the costs: you may be right! But I am going to try. Offer a braided thread, to compete with a well respected thread is going to be tough "if" I pursue this adventure. Lots of marketing, lots of showing off the product, getting it in the hands of the end user's, all tough to do. I know, have done it at least a dozen times. (Texan) It ain't easy.

Looking at your numbers you mentioned: 

Base Line: a 500 meter spool = 546.50 yards, with shipping at 0.06 per yard, that runs right up to: $32.79 for a 500 meter roll at your door. I am going to guess you are getting Tiger Thread at 0.80 thickness or 1.00 correct?  That's a really good deal. Now for the normal user, looked across the website and the normal retail price point for the same thread runs right at: $36.99 for a 500 meter roll. That comes to: $0.067 for a 546.50 yard roll before shipping. Math: 500 meters = 546.50 yards. divided by $36.99 retail =  $0.067 per roll by the yard.

What I am asking is: on the money end of it, and again the "if" I pursue this, and (not set in stone) found my mfg's to make a equal to or (trying to) make a better liked product at a price point of around $0.046, math: 546.50 yards (x) $0.046 costs per yard= $25.14 for 546.50 yards, aka: 500 meters, would that interest anyone? Trying to keep it apples to apples. Also, on that note, distribution would be in the US. Shipped from the US. I may have to go overseas to have it made. to keep the costs in line.

I am still hoping to get some feedback on "what" the end user's want to see in a hand stitching leather thread?

Here is what I will do to try and get some feedback.

Tell me what your favorite hand stitching thread is, tell me what you like about it. Tell me the "why" you use it! Best end result is about it. Let me soak it all in to see if there is a market for what I am trying to do. Now: for those that share this, here is what I will do for you. If I jump on this project, which I am trying to do, for all those that give me feedback that I can use with my guru thread engineers (laughing because never knew this folks were out there) I will send you product to test for me. Not some piece of cardboard with some thread wrapped around it, more like 50 to 75 meters of thread on spools to play around with. Not going to get into colors yet, but something to run  down some lines with, or just use on something you are working on. Try it out. 

Good?

NVLeatherworx, again, thank you for your input. Helps me see all sides of the project.

 

Gary

 

Edited by Garyspruill

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But that brings you down to the Chinese prices for basically the same thing

Ritz is a byword of quality accepted by most professionals, the Far East produces a similar item at a far lower price it may well be as long living and basically the same quality as Ritz, but questions will always remain regardless of how many examples of stitches are shown comparing the two or maybe more samples

That area is not the middle you originally stated but the bottom end which is a free for all who can get to the bottom first

99% of people on this forum will probably state that John James are the best needles its taken years of marketing to get that result, there may be better needles around but the fact is most people don't want to try them as they know John James needles do what they want

I do really wish you luck, but just don't think there is much mileage in what your planning,

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9 hours ago, Garyspruill said:

Thanks NVLeatherworx,

1/2 the costs: you may be right! But I am going to try. Offer a braided thread, to compete with a well respected thread is going to be tough "if" I pursue this adventure. Lots of marketing, lots of showing off the product, getting it in the hands of the end user's, all tough to do. I know, have done it at least a dozen times. (Texan) It ain't easy.

Looking at your numbers you mentioned: 

Base Line: a 500 meter spool = 546.50 yards, with shipping at 0.06 per yard, that runs right up to: $32.79 for a 500 meter roll at your door. I am going to guess you are getting Tiger Thread at 0.80 thickness or 1.00 correct?  That's a really good deal. Now for the normal user, looked across the website and the normal retail price point for the same thread runs right at: $36.99 for a 500 meter roll. That comes to: $0.067 for a 546.50 yard roll before shipping. Math: 500 meters = 546.50 yards. divided by $36.99 retail =  $0.067 per roll by the yard.

What I am asking is: on the money end of it, and again the "if" I pursue this, and (not set in stone) found my mfg's to make a equal to or (trying to) make a better liked product at a price point of around $0.046, math: 546.50 yards (x) $0.046 costs per yard= $25.14 for 546.50 yards, aka: 500 meters, would that interest anyone? Trying to keep it apples to apples. Also, on that note, distribution would be in the US. Shipped from the US. I may have to go overseas to have it made. to keep the costs in line.

I am still hoping to get some feedback on "what" the end user's want to see in a hand stitching leather thread?

Here is what I will do to try and get some feedback.

Tell me what your favorite hand stitching thread is, tell me what you like about it. Tell me the "why" you use it! Best end result is about it. Let me soak it all in to see if there is a market for what I am trying to do. Now: for those that share this, here is what I will do for you. If I jump on this project, which I am trying to do, for all those that give me feedback that I can use with my guru thread engineers (laughing because never knew this folks were out there) I will send you product to test for me. Not some piece of cardboard with some thread wrapped around it, more like 50 to 75 meters of thread on spools to play around with. Not going to get into colors yet, but something to run  down some lines with, or just use on something you are working on. Try it out. 

Good?

NVLeatherworx, again, thank you for your input. Helps me see all sides of the project.

 

Gary

 

If you were to pursue this I feel that you would have tough slog of it, especially trying to get your product into the hands of the Makers like myself.  We have spent many years working with the various products that are out there once we find that one that is like our "Golden Ring" we stick with it; we rely on the quality, consistency, and customer service that we have received from our suppliers and unless they lose their mind and flip the company upside down we are committed to them as much as they are us.  Regarding your numbers that though you were pretty close to what I am getting it for; I actually pay about $34.95 for the spool and the shipping is not that much more, the $.06 per yard is actually rounded up to the whole penny though.  I use the 0.80 and 1.0 as you stated.  I have tried a couple of other very good products from right here in the U.S. and they are pretty good but still can't deliver the results that I am accustomed to providing my clients and that is why I stick with the Ritza line.  The other products I have tested are available to me for the same cost per yard as what I get Tiger Thread for but in much smaller spool availability.  I carry 6 Tiger Thread colors at all times as my core threads and will make a special color purchase every once in awhile.  The cost isn't the primary concern for us businessmen, it is the quality and consistency of the product for the cost that makes the difference so the biggest hurdle that exists is the quality and consistency first; I don't mind paying a bit more for a product if it is superior to what I am using now and that is where you will find your direction to try and win over the discerning leather worker.

I wish you luck in your research and information gathering and keep us posted as to where it goes.

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3 hours ago, NVLeatherWorx said:

If you were to pursue this I feel that you would have tough slog of it, especially trying to get your product into the hands of the Makers like myself.  We have spent many years working with the various products that are out there once we find that one that is like our "Golden Ring" we stick with it; we rely on the quality, consistency, and customer service that we have received from our suppliers and unless they lose their mind and flip the company upside down we are committed to them as much as they are us.  Regarding your numbers that though you were pretty close to what I am getting it for; I actually pay about $34.95 for the spool and the shipping is not that much more, the $.06 per yard is actually rounded up to the whole penny though.  I use the 0.80 and 1.0 as you stated.  I have tried a couple of other very good products from right here in the U.S. and they are pretty good but still can't deliver the results that I am accustomed to providing my clients and that is why I stick with the Ritza line.  The other products I have tested are available to me for the same cost per yard as what I get Tiger Thread for but in much smaller spool availability.  I carry 6 Tiger Thread colors at all times as my core threads and will make a special color purchase every once in awhile.  The cost isn't the primary concern for us businessmen, it is the quality and consistency of the product for the cost that makes the difference so the biggest hurdle that exists is the quality and consistency first; I don't mind paying a bit more for a product if it is superior to what I am using now and that is where you will find your direction to try and win over the discerning leather worker.

I wish you luck in your research and information gathering and keep us posted as to where it goes.

Thanks NVLeatherworx,

Consistency : I agree with you. 

I have already been approached by the Asian mfgs. That solution is not even in my wheelhouse in anyway! I already do business in Asia with another company and know first hand the acceptable tolerance levels they accept. Not happening.  

I currently have (3) mfgs I am working with. (2) of them are mfgs in Europe and (1) here in the States. The youngest of the (3) companies is 70 years in business. The tolerances we are speaking about between us is less than a 1% variance which is too high for me at this time.

I am very aware of the Golden Ring rule. That is the "why" I keep saying: Trying to make it better, not the same, but better. The word "better" has many meanings, to one, it means pricing, or consistency, or color selection, and the really hard one is: working with it. This is the reason I am asking the questions: what is better to you and why is it better to you?

You sound like a businessman same as me. If I came to your shop and you and I sat down and had a cup of coffee and in the conversation the topic of thread came up, and I asked you: what is it you like about your favorite thread, bullet point it for me, you would say?  I am handing you a John James 002, a yard of Tiger thread 0.80, know that I respect your opinion, tell me what you like about it? Time and true is hard to put a pen to.

Please note: I am just a educated red-neck businessman from Texas trying to figure out if there is a market for what I am doing. If not, I can move on. Done it before. If there is a market for it, I want to pursue it.

Here is a thought: In about (3) weeks from now, I will have samples, you want to get some a test drive?  See if I am on the right track or not? Reminder: my perception of "better" may be different than yours. I don't need my perception, I need the public's perception.

Gary

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7 hours ago, chrisash said:

But that brings you down to the Chinese prices for basically the same thing

Ritz is a byword of quality accepted by most professionals, the Far East produces a similar item at a far lower price it may well be as long living and basically the same quality as Ritz, but questions will always remain regardless of how many examples of stitches are shown comparing the two or maybe more samples

That area is not the middle you originally stated but the bottom end which is a free for all who can get to the bottom first

99% of people on this forum will probably state that John James are the best needles its taken years of marketing to get that result, there may be better needles around but the fact is most people don't want to try them as they know John James needles do what they want

I do really wish you luck, but just don't think there is much mileage in what your planning,

Hey chrisash,

I understand Tiger Thread is a branded name of quality, I am the same as you. This is what I personally buy-use myself for the very same reason. I also know I would be a no-name company going up against a company like Nike. It's tough - coupled with small margins.

Far East production: would never even think of this. I am working with companies here in the US and in Europe to get the tolerances and quality that would match what we all currently use and like or "better".  The base line from me to these companies is pretty high, and most of the companies are fighting me. I have set some pretty high levels to them. It's very close to a darn boxing match with some of these companies. Gary, you just can't do this, OH yes you can. 

If I do this project, I can only hope to some day sway you to change your mind or at least give us a fair shake. That is all one can ask for.

Thanks again chrisash

Edited by Garyspruill

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20 hours ago, Garyspruill said:

Hey Ed in TX,

Another Texan here. Have I touched base with Springfield, District, Buckle Guy, Frog Jelly, Makers, yes.

I am working with some top notch thread engineer's (never knew there was such a thing), and wanted to get this (if) idea off the ground as a stand alone first, then if we choose to offer the product to the wholesale route, can do so at that time. My main concept is going to be: maker to user market. This may change, but for now, this is the path I am on.

Sewing machine thread: this is what the thread guru's keep pushing me to do first?? Same type of thread as mentioned above, yet non-waxed in the size 130's and 90's just for sewing machines. Maybe down the road along with the Linen goods.

Thank you kindly for the input. Something to put on the chalk board.

Gary

Gary, 

The sizes of thread that you mention 130's and 90's is going to limit your audience to the folks doing primarily light/middle weight leather work. Items such as holsters, duty belts and saddles etc. that use heavier weight leathers rarely use and thread lighter than a #207 and use thread sizes all the way up to #346 and above.

Garment makers and those using lighter weight leather might even use something smaller than a #69.

You have your work cut out for you. Best of luck in your venture.

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6 minutes ago, Ed in Tx said:

Gary, 

The sizes of thread that you mention 130's and 90's is going to limit your audience to the folks doing primarily light/middle weight leather work. Items such as holsters, duty belts and saddles etc. that use heavier weight leathers rarely use and thread lighter than a #207 and use thread sizes all the way up to #346 and above.

Garment makers and those using lighter weight leather might even use something smaller than a #69.

You have your work cut out for you. Best of luck in your venture.

Hey Ed In TX

Thank you for your advice, So in the sewing machine world, I need to be looking in the #346 through the #69 thickness range. Reminder: I personally hand sew. Picking irons and awl. Learning the sewing machine concept is a new world to me. I personally own around 8 sewing machines, but I personally do not use them :-). I want to say they are Juki LU-1508N's with a servo and speed reducer? I can learn, but as stated, new to me. Main focus right now is the hand sewing thread. With my personal sewing machines, I use them on garment goods, 800 Newton material, I use a #69 poly bonded thread for strength and the folks that use what we make, sweat a ton!

ED: when we get to that point, you mind if I call you and pick your brain?

 

Thanks again

Gary

 

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3 hours ago, Garyspruill said:

Thanks NVLeatherworx,

Consistency : I agree with you. 

I have already been approached by the Asian mfgs. That solution is not even in my wheelhouse in anyway! I already do business in Asia with another company and know first hand the acceptable tolerance levels they accept. Not happening.  

I currently have (3) mfgs I am working with. (2) of them are mfgs in Europe and (1) here in the States. The youngest of the (3) companies is 70 years in business. The tolerances we are speaking about between us is less than a 1% variance which is too high for me at this time.

I am very aware of the Golden Ring rule. That is the "why" I keep saying: Trying to make it better, not the same, but better. The word "better" has many meanings, to one, it means pricing, or consistency, or color selection, and the really hard one is: working with it. This is the reason I am asking the questions: what is better to you and why is it better to you?

You sound like a businessman same as me. If I came to your shop and you and I sat down and had a cup of coffee and in the conversation the topic of thread came up, and I asked you: what is it you like about your favorite thread, bullet point it for me, you would say?  I am handing you a John James 002, a yard of Tiger thread 0.80, know that I respect your opinion, tell me what you like about it? Time and true is hard to put a pen to.

Please note: I am just a educated red-neck businessman from Texas trying to figure out if there is a market for what I am doing. If not, I can move on. Done it before. If there is a market for it, I want to pursue it.

Here is a thought: In about (3) weeks from now, I will have samples, you want to get some a test drive?  See if I am on the right track or not? Reminder: my perception of "better" may be different than yours. I don't need my perception, I need the public's perception.

Gary

Hey Gary,

If you end up with some samples I would give it a try and provide you some honest critique against my standard thread (Tiger).  I have done many studies/comparisons of products over the years for various items so I know where to go with the data/information that is crucial to a designer when trying to bring something new to market.  Many, many moons ago I was making custom fit and made golf clubs for people, even some big names (can't share them though) and I was always being "entertained" by the many clubhead designers and manufacturers to give their product a try.  I was able to provide great feedback on these items because of my professionally trained skills on golf club performance characteristics as well as the fact that I am a Professional Golfer (semi-retired now) and could put the clubs through the wringer to get some results that you wouldn't get from other sources or methods.  I would also let the rep's know what I thought about the clubs/components and whether or not there was a market for what they were trying to target (each ability group has a different set of specifications that applies to their abilities).  If there was an item that I put on the top of the list and it provided better results than what I was currently working with I would add it to my program, regardless of what the cost was.  I use the same methods of testing and evaluation for leather craft related products and with my over 40 years of hands-on experience and formal training/education I know how to properly evaluate whether or not there is an improvement over a currently used product or not and I would give you honest and fair results.

Keep me posted on where you are going and we will see what comes up down the road.

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1 hour ago, NVLeatherWorx said:

Hey Gary,

If you end up with some samples I would give it a try and provide you some honest critique against my standard thread (Tiger).  I have done many studies/comparisons of products over the years for various items so I know where to go with the data/information that is crucial to a designer when trying to bring something new to market.  Many, many moons ago I was making custom fit and made golf clubs for people, even some big names (can't share them though) and I was always being "entertained" by the many clubhead designers and manufacturers to give their product a try.  I was able to provide great feedback on these items because of my professionally trained skills on golf club performance characteristics as well as the fact that I am a Professional Golfer (semi-retired now) and could put the clubs through the wringer to get some results that you wouldn't get from other sources or methods.  I would also let the rep's know what I thought about the clubs/components and whether or not there was a market for what they were trying to target (each ability group has a different set of specifications that applies to their abilities).  If there was an item that I put on the top of the list and it provided better results than what I was currently working with I would add it to my program, regardless of what the cost was.  I use the same methods of testing and evaluation for leather craft related products and with my over 40 years of hands-on experience and formal training/education I know how to properly evaluate whether or not there is an improvement over a currently used product or not and I would give you honest and fair results.

Keep me posted on where you are going and we will see what comes up down the road.

 

1 hour ago, NVLeatherWorx said:

Hey Gary,

If you end up with some samples I would give it a try and provide you some honest critique against my standard thread (Tiger).  I have done many studies/comparisons of products over the years for various items so I know where to go with the data/information that is crucial to a designer when trying to bring something new to market.  Many, many moons ago I was making custom fit and made golf clubs for people, even some big names (can't share them though) and I was always being "entertained" by the many clubhead designers and manufacturers to give their product a try.  I was able to provide great feedback on these items because of my professionally trained skills on golf club performance characteristics as well as the fact that I am a Professional Golfer (semi-retired now) and could put the clubs through the wringer to get some results that you wouldn't get from other sources or methods.  I would also let the rep's know what I thought about the clubs/components and whether or not there was a market for what they were trying to target (each ability group has a different set of specifications that applies to their abilities).  If there was an item that I put on the top of the list and it provided better results than what I was currently working with I would add it to my program, regardless of what the cost was.  I use the same methods of testing and evaluation for leather craft related products and with my over 40 years of hands-on experience and formal training/education I know how to properly evaluate whether or not there is an improvement over a currently used product or not and I would give you honest and fair results.

Keep me posted on where you are going and we will see what comes up down the road.

NVLeatherWorx

It would be my honor to send you what ever you wanted or I have to test.

I would soak up advice from you like a sponge.

I have sent you a private message letting you know my information just in case you ever needed it.

Will need your shipping address at some point to send you the samples.

 

Thanks again

Gary

Edited by Garyspruill

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On 8/5/2018 at 2:49 PM, NVLeatherWorx said:

Guys - Gals, 

Have gotten in some samples, anyone want to try it out? If so, will need a shipping address

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