Twoshot

Sorry for the blunder, but here's the image depicting the stitching with #207 thread vs. Tandy's white waxed thread saddle stitched.

Thanks for your input, SantaFeMarie. No I've not tried Photobucket. I posted the four images at the beginning of this thread a couple weeks ago, without using Photobucket and had no problem. I used the Link:shown below through the menu which can be found on this website. There must have been some changes made to dis-allow this function. http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=62465# Thank You.

I've posted pics without difficulty before. I don't have any idea why they won't stay with the text input. I've inserted the pic here, this time trying to use the text box instead: ] That didn't work either. Sorry, I'm out of ideas on how to post a pic. The text box was a shot in the dark.

I tried to add a pick of the stitching on the holster, but for some reason it is not appearing with the post. Don't have a clue as to why. Sorry.

I replaced the open clutch system on the 16-88, with the FS 550s servo from Bob at Industrial Sewing. For me, the open clutch setup was almost impossible to use on leather. With the servo connected directly to the 16-88 head, the speed is very manageable at the lowest potentiometer setting. A close guess would be approx 1.5-2 stitches per second. Perfect for straight runs on holsters, but I personally have to slow down and use the hand wheel on tight curves in order to stay in a pre-cut stitching groove. The leap forward in motor technology is appreciated, when comparing the noise from the original motor and clutch. It is all but gone, as well as being able to watch the needle bar go up an down as opposed to the almost uncontrolled blurred motion of the original 1/3 hp motor. I'm also using #207 thread. I was able to sew a holster together for a Beretta .380 using a single, fully loaded class 15 bobbin, and a 16x64 needle. When completed, I still had a bobbin with some thread remaining. Since the holster was for personal use, and R&D, I decided to experiment, and saddle stitch part of the holster using Tandy's largest size thread in the same color to compare it with the machine stitches and color. As always, the saddle stitches pick up dye from hands and leather and appear grayish, compared to the machine stitching. The machine was set at 6-7 spi, and hand stitches were at 5 spi. I'm new at using a machine for stitching leather, and need to practice in order to keep stitches where they belong... on target. It sure saves my old hands from hurting. I used 7-8 oz. leather, and although I had no problems sewing the pieces together, I believe that I have reached the machines maximum capacity for sewing leather . It works fine, it's just that this thickness is all that will fit between the presser bar and needle plate. Class 15 bobbins and cases are very inexpensive. For the money, I wouldn't be concerned about frequent replacement. Although this machine is an antique, it holds it's own for being 105 years young.

You make a good point. For a couple of bucks, it's worth a try. Before I mounted the Old Iron Horse in the table, I sewed a couple of Iphone5 holders using only the flywheel. After all, there isn't a great deal of real estate in an Iphone holder or a small caliber paddle holster. It's gotta look better than the unfilled craters the 160x23 leaves behind.

Yes, but the 16x63 is for cloth. The 16x64 is for leather which is supposedly equivalent to the 160X23 needle which I am currently using.

Your right about thread getting lost in the holes. I've used #207, but it's appearance is only marginally better. If you looked close, you can see that I ran three rows of thread through the same holes. That 160x23 needle makes a good dent in the leather. I'm grateful for having had the pleasure of working on a machine of this vintage. It's 35 years older than me, and will probably be sewing leather and canvas another 105 years or more. A treadle setup is possible. However, I've decided to mount a new Servo motor to the table. The present open clutch setup works fine but the original motor is a museum piece, and is very tired. It will still sew canvas like it did when new. I've no complaints regarding the machine. I do wish I could use a needle with a smaller diameter that will handle the #138 and #207 threads for leather work.

Recently I responded to a post: Singer 16-88 Sewing Machine Started by SueGy, Feb 11 2015 02:53 PM At the time, I had just taken possession, by way of donation, the above machine make and model. I was attempting to glean information regarding this machine when I found the above post. I discovered that there were perhaps four posts on this forum that made some mention of the machine. I feel that the Singer 16 88 machine deserves a bit more exposure then it has at present. The machine that I have had the pleasure of resurrecting, was born in 1910. It's last owner/user had a sail boat business, and of course used the machine in that capacity. Upon receiving it, I found that it needed a new check spring. The needle plate, and hook had needle marks that prevented thread from passing over the bobbin. In addition the needle to hook timing was improperly set. These problems were easily remedied, and with a new needle 160x23, threaded with #138 thread recommended for this machine by Bob Kovar. I also disassembled the clutch for cleaning. It is mated to a two speed reduction pulley. The clutch is composed of rubber friction disk which mates to a very coarse metal disk to engage the motor output to the machine. The sewing table is manufactured by Beswick mfg. circa 1900. After replacing belts, wiring, and general cleanup on the table, I removed all the machine parts that I could, and placed them in a Sonic cleaner to get rid of the 105 year fabric and oil build up. The only components that worked perfectly were the bobbin winding assembly. I repainted this and also the bed of the Singer 16-88. I would also like to say that putting this machine back into service was very simple. This machine is very easy to work on because of it's design. The average domestic machine is by far more complex. The Singer Class 16 uses a Class 15 (oscillating) Japanese hook, bobbin case, and bobbin. These parts are available everywhere on the planet. Bob Kovar of (Toledo Industrial Sewing Machine) informed me that this machine will sew approx. 20 oz leather. I believe his estimate to be pretty close. The motor mounted onto the Beswick table is of the same vintage, and could use an upgrade. The antique Adams alternating current motor labors at 1/4" thickness of veg tan. If and when I do this upgrade, I will be replacing the drive system with a servo motor. Any suggestions for the servo for this table configuration would be appreciated. After reassembly and adjusting, I was able to successfully sew together two pieces of 7-8 oz. leather as seen in the pics. According to the Singer manual, this machine is capable of 1400 Stitches per Minute in it's present configuration, which is perfect for canvas and sail cloth. My next boat cover will be a breeze. Thanks to Bob Kovar for supplying a check spring, thread, needles, and belts, I am able to enjoy this wonderful pastime without having to stitch everything by hand. I love the look of saddle stitching and the size of the thread, but the punishment on my old hands is the motivation for now using a machine. As you can see in the pictures, the machine stitches are consistent and by my measurement, adjustable from 6-10 SPI. I prefer 6 SPI for most of my leather projects. In addition, I don't seem to have a problem with the presser feet marking the leather. The effect is barely visible on the top stitch. I haven't made any belts with this machine, but it's perfect for this leather thickness for a belt or dog collar. It moves quickly, but with a little practice, and short bursts, it's something that can be managed with the clutch motor setup. I highly recommend this old work horse. If you have any questions regarding the repair of this machine and associated components, perhaps I can answer some of them for you.

Thanks Bob. I won't forget that when I give it a tune-up.

I watched a youtube demo on this machine. The owner sewed together 10 layers of thick vinyl. He said the machine had been used by the military for sewing bags etc. It's gotta be tops if the military uses it. I really like your Guitar Straps on Photobucket, Thanks.

Colt, thanks for the input. Yes Bob was very helpful. I plan on purchasing whatever parts that may be needed for the 16-88. Fortunately, i'm located about 40 miles from his store. The Singer 16-88 was a donation from a good friend that owns a metal fab business. He has been storing it in the attic of his shop for many years. It sounds like you weren't very satisfied with your 16-88. I understand that this machine stitches at light speeds (not good for physically small projects). High speed is good if your sewing canvas for large watercraft, or 300 feet of sail cloth. I have a 10 amp Variac that I'll be using to control the input voltage to the motor. It should be interesting to see the result. The stitch length is adjustable from the front of the machine.. You indicated that your machine exhibited an extremely short stitch. Do you think this is inherent in it's design or perhaps a problem with a possible solution? I'm glad that you responded. it's good to find others that have experience with the same equipment. What kind of walking foot machine did you purchase?

Sue, I just received a Singer 16-88 mounted into a metal table. It appears to need some basic parts(belt bobbin case, and possible hook (shutle replacement) and I found this information on Leatherwrker.net: Bob Kovar Toledo Industrial Sewing Machine Sales Ltd. 3631 Marine Rd Toledo,Ohio 43609 1-866-362-7397 I'm also in pursuit of parts, and spoke with Mr. Kovar on this date. He assured me that his company stocks most parts for this machine. He also informed me that this machine was made for canvas work, but also can be used for leather a thickness of 5/16" I hope this helps...