Pfaff 195-317D Post machine

[Simeon54]

Hello all,

I have recently acquire a Pfaff 195-317D leather post machine (Machine head only). 

Research tells me this is a chain stitch machine. There is still a bobbin housing inside the posts, although no bobbin, and whilst it's possible it was set up to be a lock stitch, it is more likely a chainstitch

It turns over beautifully by hand ( I believe it dates from the lat 1950's into the 1960's), however it doesn't stitch.

Does anyone have advice on how to set it up? I believe I have to adjusts the tenssion of the hook in the post, to make sure it catches the thread correctly.

Internet search turns up almost nothing about this machine.

Any help appreciated

[friquant]

How about some photos 📸

[Simeon54]

Good idea

 

[friquant]

Beautiful lockstitch machine. (Chain stitch machines don't have bobbins)

You will need to buy some new bobbins, some needles, and some thread. My inkling is it will be the same bobbin as the pfaff 545. 

You will need to learn to thread it. You can start watching videos of people using industrial sewing machines. Just cuz yours is a post bed, it still operates and threads the same as a regular flat bed.

Especially the common flat bed machines, Pfaff 545 and Pfaff 1245 will look familar. So I'd start watching videos on pfaff 545 and 1245 (and other non-pfaff industrial machines) 

For how to thread it, you might follow this manual for the pfaff 1245: https://www.manualslib.com/manual/121969/Pfaff-1245.html

(I'm not finding a manual yet specifically for your machine)

[friquant]

A couple things noticed on reviewing your photos. First there is a missing thread guide. It will sew without it, but better to replace so the thread stays where intended.

 

The second thing is the hook point looks very close to that outside wall, and I wonder if it's actually rubbing. I have not worked on a post bed before. Maybe that outer wall can be moved out a smidge?

That hook point doesn't look all that sharp from this view, so it would be worth taking a good look at it to check for burrs and check if it's been rounded off. 

 

And finally, the tang on the bobbin case needs to be in the notch of the throat plate.

[dikman]

The lever to the right of the tension dial is to release thread tension, my old-casting 335 has one and it's the first time I've seen one on another machine . The foot-lift doesn't release tension, have to use the lever.

Yeah, nice looking machine.

[Simeon54]

7 hours ago, friquant said:

Beautiful lockstitch machine. (Chain stitch machines don't have bobbins)

You will need to buy some new bobbins, some needles, and some thread. My inkling is it will be the same bobbin as the pfaff 545. 

You will need to learn to thread it. You can start watching videos of people using industrial sewing machines. Just cuz yours is a post bed, it still operates and threads the same as a regular flat bed.

Especially the common flat bed machines, Pfaff 545 and Pfaff 1245 will look familar. So I'd start watching videos on pfaff 545 and 1245 (and other non-pfaff industrial machines) 

For how to thread it, you might follow this manual for the pfaff 1245: https://www.manualslib.com/manual/121969/Pfaff-1245.html

(I'm not finding a manual yet specifically for your machine)

Hello, and thank you for taking the time to respond.

Firstly, what I discovered was that this machine 'should' be a chainstitch (the 317D in the number means it's a chainstitch), and rather than remove the bobbin housing, they left it in (so as to not have to machine new parts). It's basically an adapted 195 lockstitch.

That being said, they can be modded to run as a two thread lockstitch, so maybe this one is.
i'm going to take your advice and get some bobbins.
I'm pretty good with industrial machines, so won't have too much issue threading.

Also, that hook point isn't touching the inside of the bobbin case housing, it all turns very smoothly.

Thanks for the info on the tang needing to go in that notch, I'll fix that.

Should I try to get that thread guide as well? Is it vital?

39 minutes ago, dikman said:

The lever to the right of the tension dial is to release thread tension, my old-casting 335 has one and it's the first time I've seen one on another machine . The foot-lift doesn't release tension, have to use the lever.

Yeah, nice looking machine.

Thanks, that's good to know, I didn't know that 

Yeah, it is nice looking.

I also got a wheel feed singer, and a singer twin needle post machine, with twin bobbins in the post.
They're both in need of a lot of TLC, so not sure I'll be able to get them running, but i'll post some pics here, soon, for interests sake

[friquant]

1 hour ago, Simeon54 said:

Should I try to get that thread guide as well? Is it vital?

The thread guide is only vital if your thread ends up looping around something it shouldn't and causing a mess. You can run without it and see how it goes. 

You can measure the length of the needle that's in it to see what needle system they've been using. I'm guessing it will be either system 190 or system 135x16. You can generally switch between those two systems so long as you adjust the needle bar height. (System 190 is about 5mm longer than system 135x16)

 

1 hour ago, Simeon54 said:

I also got a wheel feed singer, and a singer twin needle post machine, with twin bobbins in the post.
They're both in need of a lot of TLC, so not sure I'll be able to get them running, but i'll post some pics here, soon, for interests sake

Where did you find this collection? they all sound delicious 👅

[nejcek74]

Such a mystery. If it's a chain-stitch there should be a looper somewhere bellow in the top of the post. I have never seen a 1-thread chain-stitch machine, but mighty Wikipedia says it is possible. Can we see how it works?

This is all I found, -317 without a D.

it's from list of spare parts:

https://www.supsew.com/download/Pfaff/Pfaff 195-6, 195-33, 195-317 (Old).pdf

 

[Simeon54]

15 hours ago, friquant said:

The thread guide is only vital if your thread ends up looping around something it shouldn't and causing a mess. You can run without it and see how it goes. 

You can measure the length of the needle that's in it to see what needle system they've been using. I'm guessing it will be either system 190 or system 135x16. You can generally switch between those two systems so long as you adjust the needle bar height. (System 190 is about 5mm longer than system 135x16)

 

Where did you find this collection? they all sound delicious 👅

Great, thanks for the info on thread guide and needles.

A woman I know who makes armour and does leatherwork ended up with a bunch of machines from an old shoemaker/ bag maker. They were paying her to store them, but then vanished, and she needed to clear the space, so gave them to me: 3 post machines, as mentioned, a filthy Durkopf heavy duty Zig Zig on a table, and 2 old domestic machines.

If I manage to get them running, I'll send her some money down the line, but at the moment, they are 'free'.

So yeah, very lucky.
I'll post some pics of the singers shortly. 

The Wheel feed hardly turns over, and is very old (they both are, but the twin needle still turns over.

10 hours ago, nejcek74 said:

Such a mystery. If it's a chain-stitch there should be a looper somewhere bellow in the top of the post. I have never seen a 1-thread chain-stitch machine, but mighty Wikipedia says it is possible. Can we see how it works?

This is all I found, -317 without a D.

it's from list of spare parts:

https://www.supsew.com/download/Pfaff/Pfaff 195-6, 195-33, 195-317 (Old).pdf

 

I"m starting to think that it isn't a chainstitch. 
Going to get some bobbins and then give it a go.

It's still going to cost a bit to set up, I'll need a cone holder and I think a bobbin winder as well.

 

Thanks for the info