Identify This Knot Please.

[Melanie Wilfong]

I put this question in the wrong spot, originally. Sorry for the duplication. Could someone tell me what knot this is(purple one)? Is it a Turks Head? I can't tell with it pulled that tight. I've got Grant's horse gear and leather braiding as guides. Thanks.

http://www.nrsworld....=HORNKNOT!WILLA

Edited February 10, 2011 by Melanie Wilfong

[longtooth]

Looks like a pineapple knot to me.

[Glock21]

I think it looks like a pineapple or turks head knot

I put this question in the wrong spot, originally. Sorry for the duplication. Could someone tell me what knot this is(purple one)? Is it a Turks Head? I can't tell with it pulled that tight. I've got Grant's horse gear and leather braiding as guides. Thanks.

http://www.nrsworld....=HORNKNOT!WILLA

[Aggiebraider]

This is what is called a Horn Knot. It is used by calf ropers and any other cowboy wanting to tie their rope on "hard and fast" to their saddle horn. The end of the rope is folded over and slid through this horn knot making a loop in the end of the rope that can be placed over the saddle horn. As you pull on the rope, it will draw down tight onto the saddle horn, but will also release if slack is forced into the rope just before the horn knot.

Horn knots are fairly easy to make in relation to other knots such as pineapple knots. Not really sure if this is considered a turks head or knot but I wouldnt be surprised if it is considering how many knots can be labeled as such. For me, the easiest way to tie a horn knot is over 2 or 3 fingers (make sure you get things too tight, because if your string is small enough, it can get really hard to get off your fingers). This knot is made with only one string, but if you really wanted to, you might be able to add another strand to get a different color in (I will explain a problem with this later). The entire process for making these is to do what is called crowning. You basically twist the working end of your string over the standing end (make sure you always go in the same direction), and working in odd numbers of twists. Depending on your string diameter, you may want to do more or less twists per pass (smaller diameter, more twists). Once you have completed your first pass, you will follow the working end, making crowns (or twists) through the same places. On the third pass, you want to follow the standing end in the same process. Once you get to this point, the pattern should be apparent, and the process just continues until you have done as many passes as you want. Most horn knots are probably 1.5" - 2" in height, but thats completely dictated on personal preference. Once you have the knot made initially, you will want to find something (a dowel works well) that is the diameter you want the finished knot to be and you will want to tighten all of the twists down. You want this knot to be fairly firm, so you cant pull it tight enough. Once you have it tightened down, cut the ends and burn them.

One of the major problems with this knot is the inability to effectively hide the ends in an attractive manner. If you dont have the ends secured down, the knot will unravel, no matter what you do. This is why most horn knots are made from a nylon based cord, because when burned it melts really well and you can (and should) burn it enough to melt the end to adjacent twists so it wont pull through. Once finished, most are shaped fairly flat, or will take that shape when used since the two pieces of the calf rope that pass through the horn knot will pull on the outer sides of the knot. The problem I mentioned earlier is the fact that because you cant hide the ends, if you add another color, you just add two more ends that have to be burned to adjacent twists. One really cool application of this knot is to tie it actually directly around the saddle horn as a cover. Because of the nature of the knot and how it will draw tight down onto whatever round shape you want, it covers a saddle horn well. The hard part about this is that you have to tie the knot initially around the saddle horn or try to slide the finished knot down over and then tighten it. If you are going to try covering a saddle horn in one shot with this, you need to be careful not to damage the leather of the saddle horn with your hemostats or needle nose pliers.

If you are going to cover a saddle horn with this, DO NOT DALLY WITH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is designed for calf roping saddles or barrel racing saddles that will not be dallied on, as the knot will not allow a rope to slide if you try and dally over top this.

I hope this all makes sense and Im sorry its so long winded, I just wanted to explain this knot as best as I can, because its really simple, but can seem confusing at first.

Hope this helps,

CW

[SilverBear]

Hide the ends by tucking them under the body of the knot finish tightening pull the slack out under the knot and cut it off flush. This knot is not something created since plastics rope Bruce Grant talks about using the same technique as fish scale braid on page 36 of the Encyclopedia of Rawhide and Leather Braiding. I believe that ABOK has something similar used for pointing ropes. I will check in the morning and see if I can find a page number.

[kitch2500]

Does anyone have any photos or diagrams describing this process?

[25b]

It's in lots of books and I think at least a few youtube videos.

If you don't have the Grant book (encyclopedia of rawhide and leather braiding), you should buy it if you're interested in knots like this.