Stealing Pictures of Others Work

[immiketoo]

If you've been around long enough, you've seen or experienced someone purporting your work or that of someone you know as their own.  Or you have seen blatant copies of another persons work.  For example, Richard Bourne has an instagram account with many people's work, including mine, displayed.  On my recent Popeye piece, he gives a thumbs up to a comment of nice work, implying it was his without actually saying so.  Then  further down, he receives a lot of compliments and actually says thanks!  

My question is WHY?  Attention?  Generating business?  I don't get it.  If he could carve that popeye, he wouldn't need to steal mine, and if he can't, how does he expect to fill an order?  As for attention, the leather community is incredibly tight knit and all he'll get now is negative attention, so thats a loss.

Perhaps I should just say thank you for the publicity??  What do you think?

[JLSleather]

Or perhaps just plain "hussliing"?  

One of our houses --- we listed for sale, and within hours the pics were on Craigslist as a home for rent.. $700 per month plus $700 deposit.  People take money from trusting "renters".  When these people show up to move in, those who took their money are nowhere to be found.

I contacted craigslist (had to figure out how to do that) and let them know that I don't know whose ad that is, but I own that house and can assure you it is not available for rent.

I would imagine these people are doing something similar.  Doesn't matter if they can or they can't carve that (which is lookin' purdy durn good, by the way) since they have no intention of actually producing the goods.

Oh, the reverse is sometimes true, too.  You've heard that a copyright or trademark is only good to the extent it is enforced.  Well, some apparently think that if you 'enforce" your work that is your copyright.  I met a kid, got a letter from one 'maker' on here.. to please stop using "his" design.  Every project I've ever seen from this "maker" was quite basic construction (looked a bit like maybe done by a blacksmith?) with light brown in the middle and dark brown around the edges (you know, like children would do  ).  Kid was a bit upset about it, though, so I told him long as you ain't using that guy's logo.. have at it.  

[cjartist]

Mike, I think that you should do as eposcustom has and call them out on the actual post. 

Perhaps they mean no harm and are only sharing things they love.  I would want to know if they are selling leather goods and try to find out whatever I could about their intentions.

[immiketoo]

1 hour ago, JLSleather said:

Or perhaps just plain "hussliing"?  

One of our houses --- we listed for sale, and within hours the pics were on Craigslist as a home for rent.. $700 per month plus $700 deposit.  People take money from trusting "renters".  When these people show up to move in, those who took their money are nowhere to be found.

I contacted craigslist (had to figure out how to do that) and let them know that I don't know whose ad that is, but I own that house and can assure you it is not available for rent.

I would imagine these people are doing something similar.  Doesn't matter if they can or they can't carve that (which is lookin' purdy durn good, by the way) since they have no intention of actually producing the goods.

Oh, the reverse is sometimes true, too.  You've heard that a copyright or trademark is only good to the extent it is enforced.  Well, some apparently think that if you 'enforce" your work that is your copyright.  I met a kid, got a letter from one 'maker' on here.. to please stop using "his" design.  Every project I've ever seen from this "maker" was quite basic construction (looked a bit like maybe done by a blacksmith?) with light brown in the middle and dark brown around the edges (you know, like children would do  ).  Kid was a bit upset about it, though, so I told him long as you ain't using that guy's logo.. have at it.  

Hey Jeff, thats pretty insane.  But there are scammers everywhere!  Pretty ballsy to take rent money on an occupied house!!  As for copyright, its intellectual property and I do have a few lawyer friends after 20 years in LE.  They'd be happy to do me the favor but hopefully it wont go that far.  

 

4 minutes ago, cjartist said:

Mike, I think that you should do as eposcustom has and call them out on the actual post. 

Perhaps they mean no harm and are only sharing things they love.  I would want to know if they are selling leather goods and try to find out whatever I could about their intentions.

cj, he clearly says thank you for the compliments on the popeye piece.  Its not "Stating" its his but the implication is clear by accepting praise for the work.  He has a website and says he's been at it for 10 years and that he can design or make anything.  Seems like a shady move to me.

 

[TwinOaks]

16 minutes ago, cjartist said:

Mike, I think that you should do as eposcustom has and call them out on the actual post. 

Perhaps they mean no harm and are only sharing things they love.  I would want to know if they are selling leather goods and try to find out whatever I could about their intentions.

Epos Custom Leather IS Mike & Natalie.

 

One of the notable aspects of posting stolen photos is that the whole piece is rarely shown.  For example:  On the Popeye art, if the whole thing was shown....you'd see Michael's signature on the work.

 

[cjartist]

21 minutes ago, TwinOaks said:

Epos Custom Leather IS Mike & Natalie.

 

I had not realized.  Thought Mike was just showing a theft of someone else's work

[immiketoo]

Thanks, Mike.  It didn't occur to me that folks wouldn't know.  My bad.  

[NVLeatherWorx]

Checked out the Twitter feed for the culprit noted above and found that this guy is big on using other peoples stuff and has no clue as to what is and is not acceptable; he has posted several images that have been taken from the works of Al Stohlman that are prohibited to be used in this manner (just check with Tandy's legal department and you will find that you CANNOT use any images from his works in any fashion to advertise your works, techniques, etc. and they DO NOT give you any wiggle room on this; you can use his patterns to create works that you sell but you cannot reproduce the content of his writings in any fashion).  It appears that this guy is more interested in drawing attention to himself through the use of other peoples artistic talents yet the items that he makes are clearly nowhere near the quality and level of artistic beauty of those who he has "borrowed" to promote himself.  Almost reminds you of a false advertising system: let me suck you in with all of this beautiful artwork and then sell you a copy of a magazine article from 50 years ago.  These types need to be called out within our trade community and schooled on what is and is not acceptable practice.  In fact, Tandy has been notified about his use of Mr. Stohlman's writings already.

[immiketoo]

Yep he's been banned from here, Twitter and Instagram have been notified as well.  He has been sent a few emails for cease and desist purposes and as far as I know he has removed many of the photos already.  People like this are a blight on our community and should be called out in every way possible.

[AussieMade]

The only time I ever borrow other peoples pictures is to put in my inspiration folder on my PC. But would never use them as my own work as I know I am not as good as, and probably will never be as good as a lot of people on here. Thats why I have an inspiration folder to dream of what I may be able to one achieve in this chosen hobby business.

[NVLeatherWorx]

The Tandy legal department has informed me that all of his Social Media accounts have been suspended and that he is no longer active online.  Guess that is what happens when you go around taking credit for the work of others; always comes back to bite you on your "seat cushion".

[cjartist]

That is great news.  Pays to speak up!

[Kulafarmer]

Better yet, tell em you want to meet then beat the hell out of em,,,

[cradom]

The pic of Popeye showed up on Pinterest this morning.

Posted by Devin Southam Leatherwork. That anyone here?

 

[TomG]

On 1/21/2017 at 8:26 AM, NVLeatherWorx said:

The Tandy legal department has informed me that all of his Social Media accounts have been suspended and that he is no longer active online.  Guess that is what happens when you go around taking credit for the work of others; always comes back to bite you on your "seat cushion".

At the very least, this is an inconvenience to him.  I'd be willing to bet that he will be back under another name/ID in short order. People like that are hard to stamp out.. like roaches...
As for cradom's note about Pinterest, I believe you can post most anything, as long as you do not claim it to be yours and leave or note the source or owner of it... But I may be wrong. Someone correct me if I am.

[cjartist]

3 hours ago, TomG said:

At the very least, this is an inconvenience to him.  I'd be willing to bet that he will be back under another name/ID in short order. People like that are hard to stamp out.. like roaches...
As for cradom's note about Pinterest, I believe you can post most anything, as long as you do not claim it to be yours and leave or note the source or owner of it... But I may be wrong. Someone correct me if I am.

Yes.  Pinterest was designed to share things that you like.  I would still want to ensure that someone is not taking credit for the work though.

[immiketoo]

He was saying thank you to other people's work, including mine.  Not actually saying it was his but implying it.  Anyway, this was an exercise in social media abuse and I doubt he will do it again.

[Mark Peters]

Pinterest is pretty much a community of copyright infringement.    Providing "credit", etc. does not give one the right to display the works of others without permission.   

[Tinkerton]

Good that this guy was shut down, at least for now.

As for Pinterest, it's essentially an image based bookmarking system. If you're not wild about your work being pinned by someone, you can contact Pinterest and they will remove the pin.

[cjartist]

I love it when other's pin my work.  It is great marketing.

[immiketoo]

On 3/13/2017 at 1:39 AM, cjartist said:

I love it when other's pin my work.  It is great marketing.

Only if people know its you, then I agree.

 

[NVLeatherWorx]

I "watermark" everything just so it is known who it belongs to.  I have actually found some of my "watermarked" images being used by another local weekender and had to shut it down because he wasn't even following through on most of his requests and I wasn't about to get my name dragged into that mess.

[Sceaden]

The issue is if someone claims credit for a "pin", the nature of Pinterest is finding and saving all types of cool stuff and does not in any way mean that you created the content. But yes, watermarking images in today's world is probably the best bet because stuff is constantly shared but it's easy to lose track of the origin.

Case in point, I saw a really cool tattoo design that I wanted to use for leather work so I followed the links until I ended up at an origin site that had nothing to do with an artist so I gave up on using it since I like to get permission if its an original creation. 

I ended up "pinning" a few cool designs and my wife just made up an even better design based on the inspiration.

[Sceaden]

On a slightly different note, what are your thoughts on "stealing" someone else's design idea? Do you typically contact them and ask them if you can use it or is reverse engineering based on photos considered ok? 

 

For example, this Carving Thumb Guard is a cool idea that looks fast and easy to make with a good profit margin, is it ok to basically rip off the design since it is so universal? 

[NVLeatherWorx]

1 hour ago, Sceaden said:

On a slightly different note, what are your thoughts on "stealing" someone else's design idea? Do you typically contact them and ask them if you can use it or is reverse engineering based on photos considered ok? 

 

For example, this Carving Thumb Guard is a cool idea that looks fast and easy to make with a good profit margin, is it ok to basically rip off the design since it is so universal? 

You can contact the maker and see what they say about it but, unless the item is truly registered and/or patented, there isn't much stopping you, or anyone else, from making something like this and moving forward on it.  The key to true protection of your works is attached to the expense of actually registering them and obtaining a patent/Trademark/Copyright on them; merely saying that your works are protected without having anything legal to back it up does not prohibit one from copying it.  As a professional courtesy you should always respect the works and creativity of others and, in the event that you "copy" any of their designs, you should give them credit when doing so.  I would however bet that if you were to search the Internet a bit more that the vary design that you have linked above is available from several different sources in one fashion or another so that would not make it a unique item which would make it that much easier to create your own version of it.