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Constabulary

Singer 51W SV 2 Post Bed Machine Restoration

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I picked up this machine ~10 ago in Munich. No idea what this machine could do or not or if it will suit my need at all. You barely find information on the 51W machines and especially not on 51WSV2 (Special Variant) - I mean stitch length and so forth...

However, I did a lot of research and figured there are 2 different 51W post bed models. Mine is the earlier one based on a Wheeler & Wilson N12 (as it seems). I found a picture on Alex Askaroff´s website (scroll down). The later models (made after 1938 as it seems ) are more Singerish than the W&W based 51W model and have a different tension unit, stitch length adjuster, thread lever moved to the front... and so forth. Lots of features you also find on other Singer models like 108W, 107W and so forth. So what I have is the earlier model. On the back side you still can see the cam for the trimming device which was mounted on the top of the machine head.

https://sewalot.com/wheeler%20&%20wilson%20sewing%20machines.htm

Singer took over W&W in 1905 and even produced some W&W machines 1:1 but with Singer label. That probably explains the short serial number w/o prefix - I guess Singer produced some SV machines with from existing (already cast?) W&W parts - this is a wild guess, I know.

Anyway - machine was badly gummed and VERY dirty inside - sorry I did not take pictures. I figured it uses an odd needle system 128x2 / 128x3 (short needle with thin shaft) so thats nothing I could use. The NB also has an odd cut out and seems someone already "bubbaed around" on it's not functional att all :thumbsdown: So I robbed a needle bar from my old Singer 111D which rests on a shelf for some years already and - surprise surprise - the needle bar is pretty much the same so I now can use 135x17 needles - downside is the 111D needle bar is shorter. It works but I have to install a extra guide (have to figure how to do this - already have an idea).

Next think is the presser foot bar - looks like it can accommodate 111 type needle feed presser feet or 107w presser feet - but thats a bummer too cause the 51W presser foot bar and feet are slightly different... Next idea - I take the PF bar from the 111D and - surprise surprise #2 - it perfectly works and fits and now I can use wide spread 111 needle feed feet and similar. But I decided to try a PF bar with fixed roller foot I once bought "in wise foresight" cheap on ebay a while ago and it also works perfect. :)

Next thing was the badly worn hook and bobbin case (0.5mm horizontal and vertical play :blink:) The machine already has a rotary hook but without bobbin case opener (later 51W models have a bobbin case opener). So I removed the hook from the machine and figured it has the exact same mounting as the Singer 136w / 153w hooks which are the same as some of the Durkopp hooks I have in my parts box - so I installed one and - holly crap - it works perfect even though the Durkopp hooks where meant for using with a bobbin case opener but seems it does not matter in this case :lol:. But -belive it or not I found a source for an original new hook but they ask $80 + shipping (+ EU VAT and import tax) to I will keep the Durkopp hook - good think is I now can use the bobbins of my 111 and 212 in this machine and don´t have to stock different bobbin types.

So - lot of words... here are some pictures.

I know most would have kept the original decals but they aren ot as nice as they seem and I personally do not like the Singer floral design very much...

This is what I have found:

155106439_Singer51WSV2.thumb.jpg.c7f63d4bfdbd0639e6c22db03160728f.jpg346.thumb.JPG.6cfa4ea3d2981ea72a5e2b6f97700fd6.JPG51WSV2_.thumb.JPG.33ab801ad16be1943ec553a875bdb4ab.JPG

 

 

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I also added a thread holder I found on Ebay a while back. I also figured when you remove the silver limiter which is mounted to the stitch length lever and grind down the feed dog a bit on the backside you can achieve almost 5mm / 5SPI stitch length - original stitch length was approx 3.2mm  :spoton:

The paint once again is VHT crackle / wrinkle paint

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Impeccable restoration..superb.. :)

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Looks great, but just like me gets more crinkles every day, but your efforts seem to be much more uniform crinkles than me

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Another nice job, Constabulary.:specool: Beats me where you find these old things.

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Another great restoration.  Really great that you share all your machines on the forum :)

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Looks great, well done.

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So I have installed a new needle bar guide because the Singer NB is a lot shorter than the original W&W NB. Interestingly the NB guide came from a Durkopp machine and has the same diameter as the Singer and W&W NB. Really interesting how parts pretty much remained the same for decades and that different sewing machine Co´s followed the old W&W / Singer specs. I really love to figure out when parts are interchangeable.  :)

The long tube on top of the NB (see above pictures) was not a NB guide it rather is a dust protector for the NB and had a wider diameter so nothing I could use.

IMG_7533.thumb.JPG.8f46d6f624d4c5dd2cdf5f47423f280b.JPG

 

 

Surprise #3:

You still find needle plates and feed dogs that work with this old 51W machines :blink:

While playing with google searches I figured the needle plates of the GOLDEN WHEEL 810 pretty much look the same. So I ordered some cheap sets on Ebay for for testing (hell they are dirt cheap).

This was the 1st set - it fits but needs modification. Feed dog needs an oblong screw hole for height adjustment and the outer ridge of hook is touching the needle plate (remember I installed an Durkopp hook that was not designed for this machine) but needle plate can me modified.

https://www.ebay.de/itm/143143427599

IMG_7515.thumb.JPG.2b7f1f905fd778b1806416e84fc135d0.JPGIMG_7516.thumb.JPG.d0bebbad15dc461b4b7994fde76912f1.JPG

 

 

This was the 2nd set I have ordered and it works w/o problems I only had to play with the feed dog height.  :banana:

https://www.ebay.de/itm/143164778742

Hook works a lot better with this set and yet no modification is required!

IMG_7904.thumb.JPG.0865e0126291c187046dc9aa6dbfddd9.JPGIMG_7905.thumb.JPG.6c0d7980a5f212ab08e93273d1096eac.JPG

 

 

Surprise #4:

Damn - there are even hooks for the Golden Wheel 810 / 820 that looks very much like the Singer 111 hook. They have the same needle deflector but no shaft instead they have the same "2 prong mount" as my original 51W hook and the Durkopp hook I´m currently using. So I´ll gave it a try. For less than $10 you can do much wrong.  :lol: 

GEH-820 hook

Hook is on the way already and should arrive within the next few days.

 

Machine already works good for far... (I know needle too thick)

BTW - I have removed the limiter from the stitch length lever (2nd post, last picture) and I now get approx 5 SPI. with NP / Feed dog set #2.  :)

IMG_7908.thumb.JPG.ca540bb573bcce5e8a0bf873d4b93a41.JPG

 

 

 

 

Edited by Constabulary

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On 8/1/2019 at 9:49 AM, Constabulary said:

Surprise #4:

Damn - there are even hooks for the Golden Wheel 810 / 820 that looks very much like the Singer 111 hook. They have the same needle deflector but no shaft instead they have the same "2 prong mount" as my original 51W hook and the Durkopp hook I´m currently using. So I´ll gave it a try. For less than $10 you can do much wrong.  :lol: 

GEH-820 hook

Quick update - above mentioned hook has arrived - it fits but the hook tip is touching the needle and I cannot move the hook to the left. So the GEH-820 hook does not really work for my 51WSV2.  So back to the Durkopp hook. ;)

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10 hours ago, Constabulary said:

Quick update - above mentioned hook has arrived - it fits but the hook tip is touching the needle and I cannot move the hook to the left. So the GEH-820 hook does not really work for my 51WSV2.  So back to the Durkopp hook.

I meant: cannot move the hook to the right (cannot alter the post)

I also have ordered a slide plate / cover for the hook from College Sewing part number is 221215. It also works fro the early 51w model. Original slide plate is a lot nicer because it is full metal and the new one is just stamped sheet metal but it works. I will try fo fit a binder attachment to the new plate (just for playing around a bit).

IMG_8245.thumb.JPG.2718cbf386e19eb3da7f6667d616aa4c.JPG

 

This is the OEM W&W foot and needle bar in comparison with the Singer parts (W&W to the right - Singer to the left). So you can well see where Singer got the idea of the 111w / 107w (f.i.) feet from. Unfortunately they are not interchangeable (screw holes do not line up) so I switched to the Singer NB so now I could use all the 111w needle feed feet and 107w feet. But as mentioned above atm I have installed a NB with roller foot.

IMG_7501.thumb.JPG.d51d7be77f30bf07cfd9547759756970.JPGIMG_7499.thumb.JPG.cd490036ec294abf501b135cf44f92b2.JPGIMG_7505.thumb.JPG.8d207806a857932bfa70043e1a85be03.JPG

9 hours ago, DrmCa said:

I miss the Singer gold.

I will add a Singer decal when the machine is fully set up. If you mean the floral design - well that's not what I really like.

Edited by Constabulary

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Great job as usual C.   Keep it up!

glenn

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"Decal Update"

Thanks to LW member EVO160K who supported me with this nice "special" decal. Actually the letters are vinyl like stickers but very well made with real gold foil (afaik). Looks a bit 3D-ish...

Looks a bit different compared with thin water slide decals but I like it especially because of the Font with the long R.

IMG_9248.JPG

IMG_9249.JPG

IMG_9250.JPG

Edited by Constabulary

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I like that decal. Does he market them?

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Nope! These are prototypes and afaik they will not be for sale.

Edited by Constabulary

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Very nice!  Good job!

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Wow, looks nice!!

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Really well done, great job, thanks for sharing.

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Hi Folker, 

The decal is fantastic and your Singer post bed is so well restored. I’m in need of a post bed machine for my work and looking hard for one. Post bed is very useful and it does not restrict you from sewing something with odd sizes, like shoes or bags. Wonder what Al thinks of my suggestions about replicating the decals with KisSinger, he has to reply. 

Tony 

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Went back to a plain foot - works better for my purposes.

So here is a quick & dirty YT video just to show how well the old 1975 dated 250Watt Moretti motor in addition of a 1:3 Speed reducer performs - really love it! :) It´s just about the performance, not the seam quality ;)

 

Edited by Constabulary

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Hello there.

I came across this post and found it very interesting because I just purchased what looks to be a Singer 51 but it is twin needle one. I have been looking for more information about this machine but there is none so far. Can anyone to know more about this very good looking machine?

 

Thanks in advanced. 

Dayán

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What needle plate did you end up using?  I tried to open the link you provided.  However, as it has been a little while since you posted, it seems to be no longer working.  I tried to Google golden wheel 810 and 820 needle plate to no success.  I hope you don't mind, but I am going to use your trial and error to replicate your success.  I am also curious what you used as a second thread guide for the shorter needle bar? Thank you for the information you have already provided.

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