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Frodo

your opinion

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I am posting this as an opinion.  Which I want your opinion.

Your opinion is not wrong or right it is an opinion.  Please, no hating on anothers opinion

 

Protests and riots Definitions

A protest is the USA is a lawful assemble of citizens to PEACEFULLY air there grievances 

When and if it turns to violence it is no longer a protest but is now a riot which is illegal

Riot is non peaceful protesting.

 

Cops during a protest are not to lay a hand on the protester

But IF a protester touches a cop  then the cop has every right to defend himself

I believe in the use of body cams.  If a policemen is involved in a conflict with a citizen then it is recorded, If the body cam is off then In My OPINION  The policemen should not be allowed to work.   

 

Edited by Frodo

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I believe all have a right to freedom of speech, including protesting!  But I also believe you don’t have the right to riot, loot, etc.  including blocking streets, roads, interstate highways, or interfering with other peoples rights to go about their normal activities.  As far as cops there are good and bad just like all other occupations and people.  I have friends that were FBI agents, county deputy’s and local police and I have known a lot of others in law enforcement some get into it because they want to make a difference others get into it to get a badge and gun to look tough.  It’s the same in all walks of life, be it law enforcement , a lawyer, carpenter, leather worker or whatever there are those who are good and honest and then the crooks.  I would think cops would want to have a body cam going in any stop or arrest to protect themselves and the ones they stop or arrest.  There is talk now of protesters wanting to do away with police depts. and I guess that would be good for the bad guys but don’t see it helping with anything else.  Our society as a whole has deteriorated in the last number of years,  people didn’t use to have to worry about kids getting shot at school,  we didn’t even use to lock or houses when we left, never locked our cars.  The worse thing that happened at school was you got in a fight with another boy,  when it ended you both got your but beat by the teacher and probably became friends with each other.  Prisons are full of people that didn’t get their asses beat when they did wrong,  time outs evidently didn’t work to well.  No one has the respect for anyone anymore, or their rights!  Demonstrate all they want it’s not going to change the situation until things are changed at home when you respect others, there rights, and children are to  taught right from wrong and to behave themselves, kids that have no discipline at home are usually the ones that grow up to be trouble makers and prisoners.

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Actually. my opinion mostly matches yours

Unfortunately my wee country has far more experience than yours on demos and riots. It has evolved a lot of measures to deal with protests, demo and riots.

Our police do not wear body cams and its only in the last 20 years or so that their vehicles have over-view cameras fitted, and only in the last 10 or so years that images from those cameras have been allowed as evidence in courts.

Here; Police may physically restrain any protester in order to protect life or property, whether the demo is peaceful or not. If a protestor assaults a police officer, the police officer may not respond in kind but may restrain the protestor and arrest him/her.

Although all our police are armed, it is rare, very rare for them to use their firearms. They have long since stopped using rubber bullets, baton rounds and water cannon, except in very exceptional circumstances. Even long wood batons are not now used. The police use a 'surround and isolate' procedure now just using clear acrylic riot shields.

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March 16, 1974 my Father gave me this piece of advice.  "Always treat a man like a man until he will no longer allow you to."  That, though not verbalized, applied to ladies as well.

While not an opinion, His words were of uncalculable value.

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Some are calling for police departments to be "dismantled". How would our world go if ALL police agencies kept officers off of the streets for 30 days? As stated before, there are bad cops on the streets and they should be weeded out. By and large, police officers hire on to "protect and serve" and most do a very good job of it. It is a high stress job, not many can handle it and I am thankful for those who risk their lives for my safety. If you are anti-cop, present an alternative.

 If a person stays on the right side of the law, the police will leave you alone. If you are a thug or criminal, your chances of interacting with the police increase and most likely not in a good way. Be a good citizen and you probably wont have to worry about it...

 If you want to protest peacefully and respectfully, go ahead. If you choose to use protest for an excuse to destroy, burn, loot, and block public access, expect to pay for your transgressions. Arrest and jail SHOULD be what happens to those who break the law, too bad only a handful have to pay for their crimes. Respect for each other, the law, and self seems to be absent from society these days and has been replaced with selfishness. As for me, I'll follow the Golden Rule, treat others as you would want to be treated, works almost every time.

 Thanks Frodo, just my opinion...

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Good statement cattledude!  I would like to add,  the protests seem to be mostly Black Lives Matter, or what I see seems lead by that group.  To me all lives matter no matter the color.  I would be willing to bet that most murders of blacks are by blacks!  I am not prejudice and have had some very dear black friends but they need to clean up their own crime ridden neighborhoods and the people who live there and cops are the only ones that can do that!  Without cops those neighborhoods and our own neighborhoods will be in a downward spiral,  I sure don’t want that nor do I think anyone else does.  Defunding police departments makes no sense what so ever especially in a place that is already overrun with crime!  Look at the crime rates in cities like Chicago, Miami, New York City and many other large cities,  it looks to me like they need more law and order not less!  If you live in a city overrun with crime I feel for you and hope you can change it, but if you will be honest I bet the crime has only gotten worse in the past number of years.  We should probably all be protesting to bring law and order and more good cops to our cities and communities.  Just my opinion! Thanks Rodney 

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In my opinion, the root cause of most of the problems in US society is due to lack of family values.  I don’t know the percentage, but I remember reading that the majority of children in the US grow up in families with no father present.  I read stories in the paper about lack of discipline in schools and kids can say anything they want and teachers are afraid to discipline them.  Many people don’t want to take responsibility for their actions- it’s always somebody else’s fault.

Until this cycle is broken and children are being raised in loving families, regardless of whether or not both parents are present, the situation will continue to worsen.

I think a good many of our youth would be well served by spending a few years in the military.  I was a bit of a misguided youth until I enlisted in the Marine Corps 51 years ago and they straightened me right out!  

I see no easy solution to this problem and I feel bad for my children (in their 30’s now) for how society will be when I am gone.

My opinion - thanks for listening!

Gary

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Violence is not legal no matter what you want to call it. Protesting is legal and is one of our few legal rights. Those using the words protest to do illegal acts are criminals plain and simple. Those using their money to incite these riots are also criminal and should be treated as such. I have no problem with legal protests by people who really want to have their voices heard. I have a problem with people who are paid to protest and people who incite those dumb enough to fall for turning to violence, neither hold any water for me. I don't know about all you folks but people here live together go to school together and work together no matter their color so we really don't understand the problems of the city folk. The problems we face as a society are coming from a few very rich people wanting to change us to their ideals, they have taken our schools and created indoctrination centers to promote their personal agendas, anti family, anti religion, anti morality just to name a few and now they pay people to incite hate and violence in our streets.  This is all still a huge childish temper tantrum by that bunch of rich people who didn't like the outcome of our last election.  As stated by others their will be bad apples in every bunch including law enforcement doesn't make em all bad and I 'l tell you when the point comes that good people don't take those jobs we will all be very sorry as a civilization. One week without law enforcement and the cities would be ashes. as Gary said I hate to see our youth giving away the freedoms so many have fought and died for. Our grandchildren will be no more than cattle , fed, vaccinated, chipped, surveiled and controlled by their lil mind boxes and their nanochips every minute of the day. 

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If a person stays on the right side of the law, the police will leave you alone

If only that were true, Cattledude, we wouldn't have this problem! I was saddened to find this article from Toronto Life magazine the other day. A young black man, with an impeccably clean record, has been stopped and interrogated by police more than 50 times, just for 'being black'! I knew we had racism in Canada, I just didn't realize how bad it was... :(

https://torontolife.com/city/life/skin-im-ive-interrogated-police-50-times-im-black/

Edited by Sheilajeanne

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All we here is systemic racism. In my opinion the SYSTEMIC HATE the democrat party uses to win elections and divide this country is just as bad as the systemic racism. Want to see systemic hate just Google 5 yr. old girl ask cop if he is going to shoot them. Mayor Deblasio teaches his kid the same thing.

Edited by Tim Schroeder

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We all have the right for Peaceful protests but when they run into riots things change.  I lived through the riots of 68 while living in Newark, N.J.  It wasn't pretty and I can not understand people burning down their own neighborhoods and steeling from the local stores in the name of justice.  Those store owners will never recover and the local people will suffer.

I can't believe that they want to defund ( dismantle) the police.  Who are you gonna call when you need someone.  What if someone breaks into your house in the middle of the night?  What if you are being attacked.  Chances are the police won't arrive in time but they may be able to get you the help you need next.  

Just my .02 cents worth...

 

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'Defund the police' is being misunderstood. It's a lousy, misleading title. What it really means is removing the police from jobs that would be better suited to another profession, and providing that profession with the funds to do the job. The best example is mental health. People with mental health problems often wind up dead when the police are called. If someone experienced in mental health went to the call instead, the outcome would be different, but mental health services have been chronically short of funds for many years. 

 

 

 

Defund police2.JPG

Edited by Sheilajeanne

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If you want to TRANSFORM the police in Canada that’s your business,  but I think we need to fund more police and training in the United States!  Are people with mental health problems getting the help they need? I would say definitely not but if the police are called on someone for brandishing a gun threatening people and the police gets there and he threatens the police and points a gun at them and gets himself shot I doubt the police had time to ask if he had mental problems and it doesn’t matter if the guY, or gal, was black, white, red or green if you act stupid with cops you are asking for problems.  A mental health worker would probably be the one to get shot in the above situation because they are not trained to deal with someone with a gun the cops are  I am not a cop nor have I ever been,  was in the military years ago so have had some training but if someone threatens me or mine and pulls a gun, knife, or club they will get shot , period end of story, I don’t care who they are or what kind of problems they have.  When they pull a weapon I doubt anyone is going to take time to ask or care what kind of problems they have, what color they are, or anything else about them you are , or should be, only worried about you and yours well being!

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52 minutes ago, Rhale said:

If you want to TRANSFORM the police in Canada that’s your business,  but I think we need to fund more police and training in the United States!  Are people with mental health problems getting the help they need? I would say definitely not but if the police are called on someone for brandishing a gun threatening people and the police gets there and he threatens the police and points a gun at them and gets himself shot I doubt the police had time to ask if he had mental problems and it doesn’t matter if the guY, or gal, was black, white, red or green if you act stupid with cops you are asking for problems.  A mental health worker would probably be the one to get shot in the above situation because they are not trained to deal with someone with a gun the cops are  I am not a cop nor have I ever been,  was in the military years ago so have had some training but if someone threatens me or mine and pulls a gun, knife, or club they will get shot , period end of story, I don’t care who they are or what kind of problems they have.  When they pull a weapon I doubt anyone is going to take time to ask or care what kind of problems they have, what color they are, or anything else about them you are , or should be, only worried about you and yours well being!

I agree 100%.  I will add the bad guys know how  bad they are and what they intend to do, the officer arrives not knowing either one, how many are there, cant pick his/her place of contact, is underpaid, understaffed and is the enemy in most crime ridden neighbor hoods so he's watching his back and his front or trying to. I've only had 30 years experience working in a prison but know full well what p&$$ and s#!% feels like when its thrown on me, being threatened with my life and my families lives, been called every name in the book and guess what its all the same color no matter what race of person throws it. And you are the enemy no matter what race you are. Now a bunch of people that don't leave the safety of their houses or fantastically safe neighbor hoods think they have any idea what the officers in those neighbor hoods do and see on a daily basis need to visit one someday maybe go for a ride with the cops but instead they pull up some story from the world wide web and the media read a few lines ,listen to a minutes worth of sound bites on the fake news channel do absolutely no real research and think they know what interaction goes on in these places and how to fix the social problems in these areas.  LETS defund the politicians, transform the hate groups, reform the criminals, rebuild the ghettos, retrain the poor and reprioritize the liberals.

Edited by chuck123wapati

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4 hours ago, Sheilajeanne said:

'Defund the police' is being misunderstood. It's a lousy, misleading title. What it really means is removing the police from jobs that would be better suited to another profession, and providing that profession with the funds to do the job. The best example is mental health. People with mental health problems often wind up dead when the police are called. If someone experienced in mental health went to the call instead, the outcome would be different, but mental health services have been chronically short of funds for many years. 

 

 

 

Defund police2.JPG

I don't know who you are trying to bull$#&! The democRAT voters and politicians want to get rid of the police completely. Not a single democrat politician  in our country condemns the riots or Chaz or the abuse the cops are taking all over this country at hands of the black race.  They are for full Anarchy. You referenced an article about a black man pulled over 50 times just because he was black. Bullshit. The very first story talked about how they threw a tissue or some crap out the window and a cop pulled them over.  After the cop let them go his uncle looked around and said everyone in the car is black. I didn't read another word of the article. Come to Texas and throw some crap out the window. Especially a cigarette butt. From me you will get flashing headlights a continuous horn and the middle finger. If I can get you to roll down the window I will tell you to back pick your crap up. Driving with out brake light or turn signals or license plates or anything else wrong with your car will get you pulled over every time regardless of skin color. But for the black race it is just because they are black. We are watching videos of the black race and even little black kids throwing milk or water or whatever on cops. Just more systemic hate from the black race.

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Wow. I have black friends who tell me about experiencing racism firsthand and their experiences are similar to that of the young man I posted about in the other thread.

And no, democrats - let's make that NO ONE that I'm aware of - wants to get rid of the police. They just want changes made so no one gets choked, shot or beaten up. 

But it's obvious we can't have a civil discussion about this, so I'm bowing out. Have better things to do with my day - a friend of mine was cleaning out someone's house and he gave her a beautiful half a veg-tan hide, which she's passed on to me. The thing is absolutely HUGE, and very high quality - no marks on it at all!  :thumbsup:

Edited by Sheilajeanne

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35 minutes ago, Sheilajeanne said:

Wow. I have black friends who tell me about experiencing racism firsthand and their experiences are similar to that of the young man I posted about in the other thread.

And no, democrats - let's make that NO ONE that I'm aware of - wants to get rid of the police. They just want changes made so no one gets choked, shot or beaten up. 

But it's obvious we can't have a civil discussion about this, so I'm bowing out. Have better things to do with my day - a friend of mine was cleaning out someone's house and he gave her a beautiful half a veg-tan hide, which she's passed on to me. The thing is absolutely HUGE, and very high quality - no marks on it at all!  :thumbsup:

I don't see any  un civil comments but I see some passionate comments by U.S. citizens about the problems in our country. very cool on the hide and yes you may be right, folks in Canada may have a problem with racism and black poodles you should contact your government about that. Last I knew this was a discussion about the U.S. so I don't quite understand why you even wanted to comment but thank you for your opinions and sorry if you were offended.  I will also add you came into the conversation understanding, if you read any of the comments, the people who were commenting probably wouldn't agree with what you posted but you chose to post a meme, not even a real comment with any real facts,  you knew would get this type of feedback and now you are upset? 

Edited by chuck123wapati

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She said people want to change the police so no one gets choked, shot or beat up!  Well for that to happen you better defund society and get society to change!  What happens when someone wants to resist arrest? The cop says now you can’t do that, let’s call the mental health people and get you some help or gee we can’t arrest you because black lives matter and you are black so we will just let you go but don’t be robbing anyone else!  What the hell is this crazy world coming to.  If you resist arrest you are going to get hurt or worse.  Give these crazy people an inch and they want a mile.  They are removing statues of generals from the civil war because it is shameful to have them, I guess they think they can change history.  The strong tribes in Africa captured the weaker tribes sold them to the Portuguese shipped them to America and other countries and sold them as slaves!  Is that terrible?  Hell yes it is! No doubt about it !  But no matter what they do it won’t change history!  Now they want the United States to pay them for what happened to their ancestors 200 years ago and most don’t even know for sure if their relatives were slaves.  If you look back in history at the American Indian they got screwed around a whole lot more than the blacks did,  The United States came in and took over their land, promised them this and that, broke almost every treaty they made, put them on reservations and tried to convince them they had it made.  Build a fence around places that defund the police make them all stay there and in six months they will have killed each other and we can get back to some sort of normalcy, what a bunch of idiots to think you can do away with law and order and come out of it smelling like roses

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Okay, here's something other than a meme. It's just that the meme was the shortest, tidyiest way of getting the message across. Not holding my breath waiting for someone to criticize this source, too... https://www.thecut.com/2020/06/what-does-defund-the-police-mean-the-phrase-explained.html

Being Canadian doesn't prevent me from having opinions about the s**T show that's going on south of the border. We DO have some of the same problems, as you'll know if you read the Toronto Life article about the young black man. And, oh, the poodle (now deceased) was American. And the owner hasn't been pulled over since he died...

And I consider democRATS to be uncivil. I don't much care for the Republicans, but I don't call them names. Name calling ain't cool... I learned that in the schoolyard playground!

 

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You can not send Dr Phil on a domestic dispute

He would get his rear end kicked

 

153391167_Defundpolice2.JPG.c4ae298d33900ab2e90bdb3a88b0e1b6.jpg

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 for example, a 2016 report from the Obama White House’s Council of Economic Advisers found that “a 10 percent increase in wages for non-college educated men results in approximately a 10 to 20 percent reduction in crime rates.”

So what you are saying is the gang banger on the street corner making $500.00 a day selling dope and his little sister should get a 10 or 20 percent raise?  

sorry but I really do not want Ray RAY passing that 10 or 20% hike in his product price on to me. need to figure something else out LIKE HEY.  I Got an IDEA  JOBS   What about JOBS?   Oh never mind, all the jobs are gone they burned up

lol.....he he

Edited by Frodo

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2 hours ago, Sheilajeanne said:

Wow. I have black friends who tell me about experiencing racism firsthand and their experiences are similar to that of the young man I posted about in the other thread.

And no, democrats - let's make that NO ONE that I'm aware of - wants to get rid of the police. They just want changes made so no one gets choked, shot or beaten up. 

But it's obvious we can't have a civil discussion about this, so I'm bowing out. Have better things to do with my day - a friend of mine was cleaning out someone's house and he gave her a beautiful half a veg-tan hide, which she's passed on to me. The thing is absolutely HUGE, and very high quality - no marks on it at all!  :thumbsup:

Minneapolis voted to dismantle the police dept. More on the way. 

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Can we GET REAL HERE 

another cop shot a black guy 

report says the black guy started struggling with the cop and tried to grab his taser

Where I am from. that will get you a BOOM BOOM your dead.

Now every one is all mad at the cop for shooting the guy.

 

Here is what I want.  If you disagree with the shooting of this guy that tried to take the cops taser during a struggle

then step up and tell me just wth do you expect the cop to do.   

do you expect him to go go hand to hand combat with the guy?

do you expect cops to say oh , ok  i see you are having a bad day, here is a pillow why dont you take a nappy?

tell me !!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

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I think all posting in this matter except the Canadian agree, you can’t defund or dismantle the police and expect to be able to live in the area that is done!  So I am not going to discuss this matter any farther with the idiot that thinks you can.  Clean up the dope ridden slums of America however is necessary with community leaders, cops and others and you won’t have most of the problems we have in society today!  By the way most of those slum, drug infested neighborhoods are in black neighborhoods it looks to me like they would want to clean up the area in which the live not make it worse by doing away with cops. What kind of world would this be without police?  Total chaos that’s what and any idiot that thinks different is beyond stupid! Enough said let’s talk leather!

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25 minutes ago, Frodo said:

Can we GET REAL HERE 

another cop shot a black guy 

report says the black guy started struggling with the cop and tried to grab his taser

Where I am from. that will get you a BOOM BOOM your dead.

Now every one is all mad at the cop for shooting the guy.

 

Here is what I want.  If you disagree with the shooting of this guy that tried to take the cops taser during a struggle

then step up and tell me just wth do you expect the cop to do.   

do you expect him to go go hand to hand combat with the guy?

I do not disagree but its a difference in cultures. Here, last year or the year before during a riot a lowlife tried to get a PO's gun from his holster. It was hand-to-hand fighting, the lowlife ended up on the ground handcuffed and hog-tied. At no point did any officer draw their firearm and the other officers stood close and let the one being attacked deal with it. No doubt they would have intervened if needed but our officers are trained in un-armed combat

25 minutes ago, Frodo said:

. . .  do you expect cops to say oh , ok  i see you are having a bad day, here is a pillow why dont you take a nappy?

Here a nappy is a diaper! :lol:

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