Correct way to cut the end of a belt?

[unioncreek]

What is the correct way to cut the end (non buckle end) of a belt?  I know there are dies to do this, but I'm just getting started and can afford a die right now.  I thought I say somewhere that gave measurements so you could get the correct curve so it would look nice.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Bob

[Squid61]

Springfield Leather has what they call a Belt Ninja, about $12, that is a template for the end cut as well as holes and buckle slot.  I have also seen some free download patterns on the internet, just do a search.  I usually just use an old belt as a pattern.

[jcuk]

Any of these your choice.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6ipWzTixiQ

Hope this helps

JCUK

Edited December 5, 2021 by jcuk

[tsunkasapa]

I used a 'French Curve' for that. Play around with it and find what pleases your eye.

[Hardrada]

Download a head-on photograph of a gothic arch and trace over the outline with a vector program such as CorelDraw or Illustrator. Scale as needed whilst maintaining proportion. Then print that out as the pattern for the billet.

Here's one example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:PSmichel4277.JPG, though I wouldn't use this in particular as a model since the perspective is bound to net you a skewed pattern.

Gothic architecture was built to minute harmonic proportions, so you'll end up with a pointy end that isn't haphazard.

Edited December 5, 2021 by Hardrada

[JLSleather]

There is no "right" way.  Cut it the way you like it.  Easy way to get there is cut a piece of heavy paper the width of your strap, and the length of a sheet of paper or so.  FOLD the paper in half lengthwise (so you have a piece 11" x HALF THE WIDTH you started with).

Using a knife or shears, cut a curve you think is "about right" through BOTH layers.  Open the fold, and the two sides will match.  Don't like the look?  Fold it back together and try a different curve, until you get what you're wanting.

Once done, measure from the tip to where you want your holes, and mark (or punch) the holes on the folded line.

 

[mike02130]

2 hours ago, Hardrada said:

a head-on photograph of a gothic arch

I believe that style is called an "English point".

For an English point you can buy a punch or use a pair of wing dividers and lay it out on the belt end.  Google it and check YouTube.

[Hardrada]

1 hour ago, mike02130 said:

I believe that style is called an "English point".

For an English point you can buy a punch or use a pair of wing dividers and lay it out on the belt end.  Google it and check YouTube.

Yup, that´s the only end I use for my belts. I use a punch, of course, but before I bought punches I worked out a pattern in Illustrator with harmonic proportions. Even with a punch, you sometimes need to have a way to cut an end by hand, for the odd non-standard width belt, such as this commission I got once:

 

Edited December 5, 2021 by Hardrada

[HandyDave]

I like my tab end at 4 1/4" before the holes start. With 7 holes set at 1" on center. Hole size depends on prong of buckle. I use a more oval shape rounder end on my belts. I made a pattern that i liked as JLSleather said with a piece of paper folded then i made that into a wood template so i can use it over and over. 

[JLSleather]

12 hours ago, Hardrada said:

I worked out a pattern ... with harmonic proportions.

Based on WHAT?  What is the "right" proportion of cut length to strap width?  What is the "proper" radius of the curve of the cut?  How does leather thickness affect the proportion?  

If you "worked out" a pattern, that seems to suggest that you have A way, not necessarily THE way.  This is perfectly acceptable, but it does reinforce the idea that there is no "right" way to shape a belt tip...

16 hours ago, JLSleather said:

There is no "right" way.  Cut it the way you like it.  Easy way to get there is cut a piece of heavy paper the width of your strap, and the length of a sheet of paper or so.  FOLD the paper in half lengthwise (so you have a piece 11" x HALF THE WIDTH you started with).

Using a knife or shears, cut a curve you think is "about right" through BOTH layers.  Open the fold, and the two sides will match.  Don't like the look?  Fold it back together and try a different curve, until you get what you're wanting.

Once done, measure from the tip to where you want your holes, and mark (or punch) the holes on the folded line.

 

Oh, I guess I assumed it was clear, but maybe I should have said that this heavy paper (card stock) becomes your TEMPLATE ...

[chuck123wapati]

16 hours ago, JLSleather said:

There is no "right" way.  Cut it the way you like it.  Easy way to get there is cut a piece of heavy paper the width of your strap, and the length of a sheet of paper or so.  FOLD the paper in half lengthwise (so you have a piece 11" x HALF THE WIDTH you started with).

Using a knife or shears, cut a curve you think is "about right" through BOTH layers.  Open the fold, and the two sides will match.  Don't like the look?  Fold it back together and try a different curve, until you get what you're wanting.

Once done, measure from the tip to where you want your holes, and mark (or punch) the holes on the folded line.

 

 cmon you know you gotta make it sound much more complicated or scientific lol maybe some math involved also. 

[JLSleather]

2 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

 cmon you know you gotta make it sound much more complicated or scientific lol maybe some math involved also. 

the curve (radius) of the tangential arcs are bilateral, and such that the pivotal center of the arc is maintained in a position inversely proportional to the square of the strap width.  Even more so on Tuesdays before dawn.

Seriously, this is not something you need vector software for.

[jcuk]

I know this depends on whether you have a Round knife or Head knife and depending on how competent you are using one, to cut church windows (English point) with one.  But once you get how to do it, and if you are doing it enough - no need to mark and measure which is a great time saver, also what it does mean you have to buy so many church window punches. I went to Osborne site that could mean anything from 1/4 '' to 2'' (very expensive) although you can away with using one that is slightly bigger than your strap and also you don't need so many templates in different sizes either.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5GqItjXtRI

Hope this helps

JCUK

[Hardrada]

6 hours ago, JLSleather said:

Based on WHAT?  What is the "right" proportion of cut length to strap width?  What is the "proper" radius of the curve of the cut?  How does leather thickness affect the proportion?  

If you "worked out" a pattern, that seems to suggest that you have A way, not necessarily THE way.  This is perfectly acceptable, but it does reinforce the idea that there is no "right" way to shape a belt tip...

I seem to have tossed away the paper where I worked out the geometry.

Here's the pattern:

 

Regardless, ideally one'd want something that is aesthetically pleasing (harmonious). Ideally, you wouldn't want something that looked like this:

Or this:

Or this?

Again, ideally.

No, mine ain't THE way; were it so I'd patent it and charge everyone royalties.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Hardrada

[chuck123wapati]

https://leathercraftlibrary.storage.googleapis.com/Archives/PDFs/Creative-Belt-Stamping.pdf

 

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[Hardrada]

1 hour ago, jcuk said:

you have to buy so many church window punches. I went to Osborne site that could mean anything from 1/4 '' to 2'' (very expensive) although you can away with using one that is slightly bigger than your strap and also you don't need so many templates in different sizes either.

You bet! Definitely expensive. I bought mine from Kyoshin Elle, either through goodsjapan.com or RML, so cheaper than Osborne, but still I only have two—1.25" and 1.5". What I did buy more of were the round ends, go figure, but even the ones Tandy sells are not inexpensive.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Hardrada

[jcuk]

13 minutes ago, Hardrada said:

You bet! Definitely expensive. I bought mine from Kyoshin Elle, either through goodsjapan.com or RML, so cheaper than Osborne, but still I only have two—1.25" and 1.5". What I did buy more of were the round ends, go figure, but even the ones Tandy sells are not inexpensive.

No matter how cheap its money you could use else where like better leather.

[fredk]

When I started in this leather crafting lark I used the 'folded card' method for shaping the ends of belts. Later I bought one large 'English' belt tip punch. That one large size does all the smaller one too. I've also bought a set of belt templates in acrylic, like these uns, (below) they cost me under £5 for the set but are dearer now, With them you have the two most common ends

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265264220814?hash=item3dc2faca8e:g:~VIAAOSwq1VhFIl5

 

[JLSleather]

3 hours ago, Hardrada said:

I seem to have tossed away the paper where I worked out the geometry.

Here's the pattern:

 

What are the shaded parts on the first one?  And... I don't mind the LOOK of that last one, though I suspect it could get irritating catching on belt loops when put on.

[Hardrada]

2 hours ago, JLSleather said:

What are the shaded parts on the first one?  And... I don't mind the LOOK of that last one, though I suspect it could get irritating catching on belt loops when put on.

 

On the billet, the shaded part is the shape added to the rectangle to make the shape of the point. Yeah, that part for which I no longer have the calculations I made to determine its dimensions.

On the buckle end of the pattern, the shaded areas are just cutouts on the cardstock pattern where the branding stamps will go.

[Klara]

If you want to use maths, 2:3 is generally considered pleasing, or 3:5, or 5:8 (Fibonacci sequence, remember? )

Without maths, somebody (possibly linked to above, I didn't check the videos) said to poke a compass in one side of the belt, about one belt width from the end, adjust it to the belt width, and draw a curve to the point. Repeat on the other side. 

Or you could just cut free hand: Both sides narrowed to a point and point off - I think it's called a bridle point. 

Heck, my woven belts have square ends and work as well...

 

 

[JLSleather]

11 hours ago, Hardrada said:

On the buckle end of the pattern, the shaded areas are just cutouts on the cardstock pattern where the branding stamps will go.

[Squid61]

My head hurts!  Find a belt you like and use it as a pattern.

[Samalan]

On 12/5/2021 at 1:34 PM, unioncreek said:

What is the correct way to cut the end (non buckle end) of a belt?  I know there are dies to do this, but I'm just getting started and can afford a die right now.  I thought I say somewhere that gave measurements so you could get the correct curve so it would look nice.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Bob

The very best way to do this is to make your own patterns that look nice to you poster paper works good for this I can say I have never used a ready made pattern unless I made it I always hear people saying do you have a pattern for this or that the very best way is make your own patterns , sharpen your own knifes, make your own designs but don't do all this blindly do your research one more thing " It's up to you to know everything"  Good luck in all that you do.

[unioncreek]

I eventually just started making a pattern and then cutting it on some scrap leather to see how they looked.  Finally came up with one I liked.

Thanks for the info though.

 

Bob