My First Customer Order - Baby Eagle .45 Iwb

[chaosready]

This is my first holster made for a customer. He wanted an IWB for his Baby Eagle compact, in a special configuration. It looks like a left-handed holster, but is actually for a right-handed draw. He wants it to ride in the 5:30 area with a backward cant. He finds this a more comfortable way to draw.

Holster is equipped with dual belt loops (for 1 7/8" belt) with Pull-The-Dot snaps, with multiple mounting locations for full cant and ride height adjustment. Holster also has skin guard and front sight channel. Inside surface is burnished.

[Big O]

Nice looking holster! You really should put your mark on it with a maker stamp.

I've had a couple of people ask for holsters to accomodate a "cavalry draw" (where the hand slides between the gun and the body). I've discouraged it. Not only is it more difficult to do at speed and under pressure, but the mechanics of the draw make it highly likely that the muzzle will cross the body during the draw.......and not just a leg.

[katsass]

Good morning from the grumpy one: GOTTA agree with BogO! Back when I was assigned as armorer/range-master for our Dept., I had a smart a$$#% troop that swore up and down to me that the carry you describe was the way he 'always' carried his off-duty firearm....albeit, sans holster. During a live fire exercise, I allowed him to show me his rapid, combat draw..........with an unloaded handgun. Upon the signal to draw, his hand sped back and (1) grasped the gun butt, (2) began to draw the gun (3) started the (anatomically necessary) wrist rotation, (4) hooked his skivvies with the front sight, (5)scratched the hell out of his right buttock, (6) gave himself a great wedgie (7)damned near lost control of the gun and (8) made himselflook like an absolute idiot in front of a large number of other troops. Had the gun been loaded he most likely would have put a large caliber hole in his right thigh. The "Mexican Carry" is more often than not (with or without a holster) just as you describe.........and is NOT the way to carry a gun safely. It is THOUGHT by many (uninformed and without experience) to be the way to carry a gun in the 5:30 or 6 o'clock position because it's the easiest way to HOLSTER the gun in those positions. The "Mexican Carry" is nothing more than a strong side carry, moved to the rear. In this case I feel that the LEAST that could happen is for the shooter to jamb up the gun in the holster during his draw........with the probability of personal injury extremely high. JMHO Mike

I absolutely refuse to build such a holster.

Edited April 25, 2011 by katsass

[Reaper]

I think the Calvary Officers which carried in such a manner in the movies only did it because the ran out of right hand holsters....

Mexican behind the back is thug common these days of un-holstered deep iwb at the crotch, either is a good thing IMO. Because one lends to ended Thugs and the other lends to Non-Propagating Thugs.

I'm with Kat and BigO on it across the board. Also wonder if that isn't going to get between the weapon and thumb effectively locking it into the holster?

[chaosready]

Hehe. Well, learn something new everyday, I guess. You guys do have a point.

I absolutely refuse to build such a holster.

Although, I suppose anyone could simply order a left-handed holster and wear it at 5:30.

[katsass]

Hehe. Well, learn something new everyday, I guess. You guys do have a point.

Although, I suppose anyone could simply order a left-handed holster and wear it at 5:30.

Chaos' I think that you are missing the point. Nobody is knocking your work....it's just an unsafe design. Try it yourself. With the gun in your belt (or holster) back there at 6 o'clock, butt of the gun facing down toward the floor, you must slide your hand between the gun butt and your body to draw the weapon.......the back of your hand will be against your back. Grasp the gun, and as you draw it, you will see that your hand will naturally rotate forward in order to align with a target in front of you. This rotation will cause all kinds of problems ( as I previously explained). Now, try it with the gun butt facing up....sort of toward your left shoulder (for a right handed person) grasp the gun and draw, it comes out just like a strong-side draw.......which it is. Now, stuff that shooter back into your belt line ....it goes in easily............the wrong way, butt down. This is why some feel that it is a good way to carry the gun. It AIN'T. Your customer has either been watching too many movies, is very inexperienced, is a fool.....or a combination of these. Do a little research on SOB holsters ........ they don't come with the butt of the gun facing downward. Again, it ain't you or your work.......it's an inexperienced customer .........and the excitement of your first order ......... been there, done that. Now you may know why I am considered by some to be a grumpy old man .......... i won't build something I don't think is safe. Mike

[chaosready]

Chaos' I think that you are missing the point. Nobody is knocking your work....it's just an unsafe design. Try it yourself. With the gun in your belt (or holster) back there at 6 o'clock, butt of the gun facing down toward the floor, you must slide your hand between the gun butt and your body to draw the weapon.......the back of your hand will be against your back. Grasp the gun, and as you draw it, you will see that your hand will naturally rotate forward in order to align with a target in front of you. This rotation will cause all kinds of problems ( as I previously explained). Now, try it with the gun butt facing up....sort of toward your left shoulder (for a right handed person) grasp the gun and draw, it comes out just like a strong-side draw.......which it is. Now, stuff that shooter back into your belt line ....it goes in easily............the wrong way, butt down. This is why some feel that it is a good way to carry the gun. It AIN'T. Your customer has either been watching too many movies, is very inexperienced, is a fool.....or a combination of these. Do a little research on SOB holsters ........ they don't come with the butt of the gun facing downward. Again, it ain't you or your work.......it's an inexperienced customer .........and the excitement of your first order ......... been there, done that. Now you may know why I am considered by some to be a grumpy old man .......... i won't build something I don't think is safe. Mike

No, I didn't miss the point. I understand (after the fact) why it's not a safe idea.

All I'm asking is, couldn't a [right-handed] customer intending on carrying in this fashion simply order a normal left handed holster from you (perhaps with adjustable cant) and just wear it in the 5:30 position? That's what it basically boils down to.

But yes, knowing what I know now, I'll not build such a holster if I'm aware the customer wants to use it this way.

[Big O]

I'd suggest you don't START by flat-out refusing to build it.

First, try explaining the problem and suggesting alternatives. Usually, the customer's desire stems either from watching too many B-movies, or from wanting maximum concealment. And holsters such as this DO offer very good concealment - at the cost of safety.

Point out to them that a holster can be worn anywhere on the belt that they can reach, and all that changes is the angle and/or height. Have them test this theory with an unloaded gun or blue gun by placing it against the belt and sliding it around. Then seek out natural voids around the waistline that lend themselves well to concealment. Nearly everyone has them in back, between the 8:30 and 3:30 positions. Folks that actually HAVE missed a meal now and then (I'm talking about folks here, not me) also tend to have them just in front of the hips, in the "appendix" postion, as well.

Educating the customer is an added-value service we can offer.

[Big O]

Seriously, though, chaosready, that is some very fine work you've done there, and you should be quite proud of it.

All any of us are criticizing here is the manner of carry, which was not YOUR idea in the first place.

[katsass]

No, I didn't miss the point. I understand (after the fact) why it's not a safe idea.

All I'm asking is, couldn't a [right-handed] customer intending on carrying in this fashion simply order a normal left handed holster from you (perhaps with adjustable cant) and just wear it in the 5:30 position? That's what it basically boils down to.

But yes, knowing what I know now, I'll not build such a holster if I'm aware the customer wants to use it this way.

Yes, Chaos, you're right. Just using a left-handed holster in that position would actually be just what you have created. Again, no kicks with your workmanship ...........you did a good job. BigO does bring out a very good point ......... the education of uneducated customers SHOULD be part of our service. I try to do just that, BUT, at times my manner can be a bit 'brusque' ....... therefore, the 'grumpy old man'. Mike