Carved Surfaces - Vinegaroon

[Shelly]

OK - I've read thru this entire thread, and I have a question that doesn't seem to get an answer here...if I have a belt, or any piece that is carved and tooled, for that matter, all of my instincts tell me that it's not a good idea to 'soak' these pieces in vinegaroon, to get the black color, because soaking it thru is going to swell up the finish cuts, and generally make a nice carved piece look bad...the other thing I get from reading this is that by pre-treating the leather to make it black, I will probably not be able to carve and tool it afterward, either...?

I have had a few requests for chap tops that are carved, stamped, etc, but they want them totally black, to go with the black chap leather, so I've not tryed this process as yet - I have used Fiebings dye, USMC black, many coats, let it soak in, then go back over with a light coat of oil and Tan-Kote finish. Unfortunately, it's not so great - the Tan-Kote wants to lift the dye in areas that the dye didn't penetrate as well, so I end up with some small areas that need touched up...I'm looking for a better way to do this, and thought this might work...

I do like the idea of using it for dying my rawhide...also need a good brownish/tan, and I understand that Ortega used Rit Dye in Red for those projects that included a red highlight in the braiding...I need to go thru a book I have that has a lot of Indian lore, covers much of what they used for dyes on leathers and rawhide, etc...all natural, ground up and steeped in water, etc.

Maybe Troy can tell me how he approaches carved/tooled/stamped pieces that need to be black??

[OutBackP]

I've always dyed first then stamped after. I'll normally work with the leather as it's drying out so I don't have the hassle of re-wetting it. But if you do need to re-wet it then I found hot water does the trick.

But it's definitely easier to use as it's drying. Once it gets to a workable stage I'll wrap it in plastic and store in my fridge till I'm ready to use.

As I've found out best to do a test first, as leathers can react differently.

Hope that's been some help

[sodapop]

heres my experience so far...if your juice is pretty concentrated/potent...don't need to "soak" persay...just a quick dip...unless its something you want it to penetrate all the way through...

also it seems to me the vinagroon doesn't have the same swelling effect on leather that water does...i haven't had an issue with loosing detail like that...i also don't do the rinse others do afterwards either....i personally dip, let dry...oil and aussie...vinagroon also seems to stiffen the leather a bit...

other ideas is shelly...is you can paint on the vinagroon, and cuz its a chemical reaction vs dye...its blends with itself perfectly...no spotting/streaking and such like dye may...so hypathertically speaking...should beable to spray it on as well...even with a squirt bottle...

darryl

[TroyWest]

Shelly,

Everything Darryl just said I agree with. I have done a number of belts where I tool 'em, line and sew, then hold one end of the belt in one hand and the other in my other hand and just run it through the solution, sometimes twice. Then just let it dry. On a thin chap top I think I would just apply it with a dauber on the surface, after I tooled it. I havent tried it in a spray bottle but it should work. I think you'll like it on your chap tops. Obviously I recommend you experiment on a small scrap first but it should work well for this application.

Troy

I havent noticed any loss of detail in the carving after it was dyed black either.

Edited September 30, 2008 by TroyWest

[celticleather]

I can't imagine that vinegaroon would work on rawhide (although I haven't tried it!). The process works by causing a chemical reaction between the iron oxide dissolved in the vinegar and the tannins in the leather. Rawhide hasn't been tanned, so presumably won't contain the tannins that are necessary for the chemical reaction.

[TwinOaks]

When I use the Vin. mix, I 'paint' it on using a paper towel. I haven't tried any super detailed work with it, but it doesn't disturb the boning on holsters. Also, when I get everything molded like I like, I heat set it in a convection oven- about 125 for 8-10 minutes. That really helps to stiffen it.