troy Report post Posted May 11, 2009 Only my second attempt at fid work, but this one looks alot more even then the last - but still have a pain of a time laying the first side of lace - sort of found a way to do this one but wondered if any body else does this sort of work and has a particular way to ensure that first row of lace is nice and even? Paul Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rawhide1 Report post Posted May 12, 2009 Paul Nice looking work on the handle! The knife is pretty cool looking too. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alan Bell Report post Posted May 12, 2009 Paul, Nice! The thing about fid work is that the strings have to be nearly perfect. Yours are not uniform in width so that will affect your work and make it harder to get that first pass perfect. The weakest link in any type of braid work is always the string. The string has to be the best you can get for each project. There are some missed passes too and that should not happen in fid work because you can always back track the string and correct not like when you are braiding and it is harder to correct missed passes. To get the first layer down good i tie the strings down REAL tight with either a few strands of sinew or waxed thread (thinned down) and then place the strings at the correct angle and place two rubber bands tightly around them. I move the first rubber band as I spiral around the project to hold everything in place. As I get farther along I will move the second rubber band up a little to maintain the tension in the strings. Hope this helps. Vaya Con Dios, Alan Bell Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted May 12, 2009 Cheers for all your comments and thanks for the elastic band idea. Ye I know the lace is uneven which does'nt help, still getting to grips with cutting out of my own rawhide and stretching, one day I'll get there - I'll have to buy rawhide from now on so I may have better rawhide to start with. As for the unuiform braiding, that was intentional not only to signify that it is'nt from a sweat shop somewhere but also to try and create different patterns like below - naturally this is OK with coloured leather but I guess with rawhide, sticking to 3 u 3 o looks better then the alternative 2 o 3 u, 3 o 2 u that you can see. The biggest problem I've had before is keeping it all even and not twisting to one side, I am pleased that atleast it does look even in this example. I guess there is different kinds of leather work that facinates every one, this sort of fid work is what does it for me. After seeing some work from australian and especially argentian braiders, it is something I would like to eventually do to the degree's they do them sometimes - imagine 100 strings instead of 32, just unbelievable. cheers Paul Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Just finished a PDF tutorial I made around this fid work - again it's more for beginners and included lace prep and diagrams for the two pineapple knots Fid work PDF Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alan Bell Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Hey Paul, Great job doing the tutorial!!!! I'm quite sure there was a great deal of time and effort put into making it and it it truly appreciated. I have a couple of critiques. Rawhide is beveled on the grain or smooth side, leather on the flesh or rough side. That is the standard way of doing it. Also, the Gauchos will typically use half as many strings, twice as long and double back for the final interweave. So a 100 strand handle will actually be 50 strands doubled. You will spiral down from the top just like you did and at the bottom make a bite and start your pattern with an over under pattern with each strand and then the design or in your knife handle case over three, under three. On their knives they put a metal cab over the beginning but you could just as easy use a button and at teh bottom the button "butts" up to the end turn back, and again you could cover this but there is no need to with this method. Again, Thanks for a great job on the tutorial, I just wanted to point out this other way. Vaya Con Dios, Alan Bell Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Hi Alan Once again, thanks for your great advise, my learning of this I guess is from bruce grants encylopedia and then just pictures of the gaucho's work and experimentation. But as always the simpliest method is always the best such as the doubling of the lace - feel like homer simpson 'Doh' - and I always double lace that way for belts and whips. Thanks for the bevelling method - always thought they were both done on the flesh side for some reason. As for the metal caps, I have thoughht of them and would like to do that one day but I do feel they will be expensive so stick to lace for now. Mostly thanks for pointing these things out - learnt something useful today. Paul Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HorsehairBraider Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Nice tutorial, Troy. I especially enjoyed seeing the diagrams of the pineapple. I always like to learn new stuff, and although I knew of "perfect" pineapples, I had never seen that particular book and therefore these diagrams are new to me. It makes me want to braid more in leather! You can't tie the knot like that in horsehair, or at least not easily. But it would be a great method in rawhide or leather. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted May 15, 2009 Great job on the handle. Also, great job on the tutorial. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted May 29, 2009 Made this glossary first for my own use as I increasingly ventured deeper into the world of braided knots. It is amazing just how many mathematical variations and codes there are to knots - I have’nt covered these as I don’t really understand them yet, at the moment I’m like a driver of a car who after years of driving is only just finding out how it works. Glossary of knots and tapering lace tutorial I have also included a short piece about tapering lace which complete’s other PDF’s I have done on the subject of lace, plus diagrams for two knots used to help explain some items of the glossary. Hope they help someone. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sidney Wood Report post Posted May 29, 2009 (edited) I just want to say that the tutorial on fid work is one of the best things I have seen lately and the effort is a amjor contribution to our craft. Sidney Wood Edited May 29, 2009 by Sidney Wood Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted June 17, 2009 Cheers for your comments, makes the writing worth it. Have just tried another way of affixing the first layer of lace for fid work after trying to lay 30 thin laces at the same time - just could'nt seem to get them all into place but the form their going on is of different widths, a axe handle. So instead I used the elastic band idea and layed one lace at a time using an elastic band on the top and bottom of the job, naturally this is'nt a perfect method but it got them on in the end and showed where I'd have to do interweaves for the wider parts. Will see the wisdom of my trick once finished. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted June 17, 2009 Please do post your finished work with that experiment in your last post. I would enjoy seeing a couple of photos on that. I too am about finished with my dog leash and will be adding some overlayed fid work to it. This is why this subject is especially interesting to me. The broader my skill set the better braider I can and will become. I really love to use roo lace on all my selling products. So, these kinds of posts are really needed here and at my website. So keep up the really awsome work you are doing. I look forward to seeing more with great anticipation. Brian... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted June 18, 2009 Hi Knothead (like the name, I guess mine should be fidhead!!) Heres a photo of a 54 string one I did once. It is in 2mm string and found it easy to apply, rawhide and leather on the other hand are much harder to work with, but do create a much better looking article, so starting your playing with string is probably a good idea and cheaper. Only disadvantage with this string was that I could'nt remove the core so they stayed roundish. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted June 18, 2009 WOW! Troy that is awsome work. I'd be surprised if someone did'nt come along and not buy it, or ask if was for sale. Just awsome is all I can say about it. Well, I take that back... JUST FRIGGIN AWSOME DUDE!!! Sorry for the caps one there. A moment of finger crampsitus... Brian... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted June 18, 2009 In that case your probably faint to hear what it's used for - it has a broom on the end now and used to sweep the kitchen floor. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted June 18, 2009 If it be cleanin your shop floor, it has a worthy job and should be there. LOL... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted June 19, 2009 Just finished the fid work on the axe - did'nt quite work to plan but I'll get over it I guess. Used 42 lace in all and made it the way I explain in my fid work PDF except in this case I just double over the lace meaning that the top end can just be tied around itself - much easier then having to place a knot over rough ends. I did try and spell gransfors along the shaft, but ended up with grans so I guess I’ll have to give it to her now!! It also meant I had to make another sheath and have included the design for that if any one else has one. I made this sheath from one of Al Stohlmans books to go on the rear cinch of a western saddle for a friend and naturally one for myself. The knot on the top was devised by Chris Barr and published in a journal of the AWPA - it is a 27 bight gaucho knot, not exactly great for this type of work but I was dying to use it for some thing ever since seeing it. Paul Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UKRay Report post Posted June 19, 2009 Paul, Leaving aside the fid work which I know nothing about but admire from a distance... where did you get that amazing axe? Ray Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted June 19, 2009 its called a mini hatchet from gransfor - can get them from here. - http://www.gransfors.co.uk/gransfors%20standard%20axes.html. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
megabit Report post Posted June 19, 2009 Very nice indeed. I like the back cinch sheath too. I have been thinking about picking up a tomahawk from this place http://www.2hawks.net/AHAWKS.html but I don't know that I can justify it no more than I manage to get into the backcountry. Sure do like your fid work though. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryrwm Report post Posted July 4, 2009 While looking up rawhide braiders on the web I came across this site. He is from Argentina and the language is not English, possibly Portugese or something. But the fid work he does is unbelievable. Not impossible but it gives one something to strive for. http://www.armandodeferrari.com.ar/home.html Check it out. Jerry R Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HorsehairBraider Report post Posted July 5, 2009 Thanks for the link, he does beautiful work. He also does metal work! The language appears to be Spanish - at least, I can understand some of it, and I don't know Portuguese. I was interested to note he does some fid work that is similar to hitching horsehair - where you have one long piece of rawhide that goes around the core in a spiral, and many pieces of rawhide that make half-hitches around the spiraling piece. Anyone else do fid work like that? I'd love to see it if so. Also note that really cool fid he uses! I wish I had one like that! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
troy Report post Posted July 5, 2009 the guy from that link is in argentina, can't remeber if it is spanish or portungese they speak but have seen his work before when Ron Edwards reviewed it and imspired me alot but I feel it is one of those skills you could spend a life time trying but never quite get as good as the argentinians - but no harm trying!!!!! I saw his fid as well and ye - the mouth waters - I ended up making my own from an old large needle I found and does the job for me until the million dollar cheque arrives. I did a multipe conqustitor braid once on a handle when I first started messing with rawhide - pictured below - its not very good but is that what you were meaning horse hair. troy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HorsehairBraider Report post Posted July 5, 2009 Troy - that's not quite it... I don't know if I can link to a pic from the guy's site or not. OK nope, just tried it. When you go to his index page, there's a pic of a large wooden round base (perhaps of a whip handle or some such) and that is what I'm talking about. It's oriented straight up and down, and the rawhide has been worked up it from the bottom to about half way up. This is one of those times when I wish you could see me waving my arms around in the air... although that probably wouldn't help much either. :D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
