Supplies - what do you need that the market is not giving you?

[JohnBarton]

I just went through the thread on the Chaylor interiors and it occurs to me that there doesn't seem to be a lot of choice in suppliers of this item and I started wondering what else is out there that could stand to have more choice or even better quality?

I am not looking to steal anyone's business but I am in a place where I can get things made fairly quickly. I can often negotiate lower production runs on items, and I can set the quality standards.

I have seen that it might be nice to have some more stamps, maybe some new cool embossing plates/tapoffs, perhaps another source of interiors for common items or even a company that was willing to do custom runs for you in your configuration/leather type.

I don't know. Usually I tend to not be thinking about much other than my case business and our billiard supply business. But I have seen a lot here that I thought it would be neat to have and I could have most of these items made fairly easily and to high quality standards.

I know that China-made goods are stigmatized these days and that it's a polarizing issue. But I read the Chaylor website and if I read between the lines I get the feeling that a lot of what they sell is made in China. PLEASE correct me if I am wrong and not that there is anything wrong with that in my opinion as long as they stand behind their goods. My point is that as a community you have the opportunity to have someone like me working on what you want. We work leather every day just like most of you do. We use the same tools and even have a bit of a disadvantage as a lot of you have access to higher end tools and supplies that aren't readily available here in China. There is no Home Depot on the corner here and no Tandy Leather down the street, no Hermann Oak or Zack White, at least not in the same sense that most of you have access to tools. I am not looking to copy Barry King's tools, or Bearman's mauls - I am looking to do things where there isn't a lot of choice and perhaps the supply could stand to be a bit better in quality?

Any suggestions on items you'd like to see or is everyone set? I sure am not looking to upset the applecart here but as easily as I can make new tools for myself I can have them made by the dozens, hundreds, thousands....

John - Mr. Chinglish - Barton

[tattoosbyjay]

I just went through the thread on the Chaylor interiors and it occurs to me that there doesn't seem to be a lot of choice in suppliers of this item and I started wondering what else is out there that could stand to have more choice or even better quality?

I am not looking to steal anyone's business but I am in a place where I can get things made fairly quickly. I can often negotiate lower production runs on items, and I can set the quality standards.

I have seen that it might be nice to have some more stamps, maybe some new cool embossing plates/tapoffs, perhaps another source of interiors for common items or even a company that was willing to do custom runs for you in your configuration/leather type.

I don't know. Usually I tend to not be thinking about much other than my case business and our billiard supply business. But I have seen a lot here that I thought it would be neat to have and I could have most of these items made fairly easily and to high quality standards.

I know that China-made goods are stigmatized these days and that it's a polarizing issue. But I read the Chaylor website and if I read between the lines I get the feeling that a lot of what they sell is made in China. PLEASE correct me if I am wrong and not that there is anything wrong with that in my opinion as long as they stand behind their goods. My point is that as a community you have the opportunity to have someone like me working on what you want. We work leather every day just like most of you do. We use the same tools and even have a bit of a disadvantage as a lot of you have access to higher end tools and supplies that aren't readily available here in China. There is no Home Depot on the corner here and no Tandy Leather down the street, no Hermann Oak or Zack White, at least not in the same sense that most of you have access to tools. I am not looking to copy Barry King's tools, or Bearman's mauls - I am looking to do things where there isn't a lot of choice and perhaps the supply could stand to be a bit better in quality?

Any suggestions on items you'd like to see or is everyone set? I sure am not looking to upset the applecart here but as easily as I can make new tools for myself I can have them made by the dozens, hundreds, thousands....

John - Mr. Chinglish - Barton

i think tool and stamps would be a great idea i will be making some new tools soon ill post some pics

[UKRay]

Buckles are an expensive issue for me, John. I have just paid this month's buckle bill of just over £650, and feel sure this could be reduced dramatically by buying direct. I'm reasonably confident that the solid brass harness style buckles I buy are made in China anyway so it makes sense to find the maker. Any thoughts on getting metalwork made to order or sourcing a supplier?

Tools are also a constant battle as the new Tandy stuff bends if you give it a decent clout with a maul and getting good quality tools from the US costs a fortune in shipping on top of the high prices they attract. I'm not saying that US tools aren't worth the money, far from it - just that shipping costs and customs charges prohibit me from buying them.

I think the stumbling block for many great import/export ideas is this issue of shipping and import tax. As you probably know, I already import and retail a number of items including Skidmore's Beeswax Products from the US and would love to expand my import business to include goods from China; but can I really afford to? What, if any, are the hidden costs?

Ray

[electrathon]

I am all over good high quality purse or wallet interiors. I do this as a hobby, so I would only be buying a handful.

Aaron

[JohnBarton]

Buckles are an expensive issue for me, John. I have just paid this month's buckle bill of just over £650, and feel sure this could be reduced dramatically by buying direct. I'm reasonably confident that the solid brass harness style buckles I buy are made in China anyway so it makes sense to find the maker. Any thoughts on getting metalwork made to order or sourcing a supplier?

Tools are also a constant battle as the new Tandy stuff bends if you give it a decent clout with a maul and getting good quality tools from the US costs a fortune in shipping on top of the high prices they attract. I'm not saying that US tools aren't worth the money, far from it - just that shipping costs and customs charges prohibit me from buying them.

I think the stumbling block for many great import/export ideas is this issue of shipping and import tax. As you probably know, I already import and retail a number of items including Skidmore's Beeswax Products from the US and would love to expand my import business to include goods from China; but can I really afford to? What, if any, are the hidden costs?

Ray

Well,

I could certainly set up some sort of a distribution business to service smaller orders but I do think that shipping, delivery times and possible duties would certainly be factors that weigh in against it being viable.

Things like buckles, latches, metal parts in general though are something that can either be found at the leather market or made on demand. Most factories here will produce them in any metal you request, iron, steel, alloy, zinc, or brass. Brass is the most expensive but likely to be a fraction of the price of buying from wholesalers. But I want to stress that I am not trying in any way to compete with or replace places like Ohio Travel Bag - that's not the scope. If you do need some specific things and are willing to discuss buying a larger quantity then we can talk about it for sure - for example I just bought more metal parts than I will ever need (well I hope that I will need them quickly) because I wanted better quality and the minimum amount was 5-10,000 pieces per type of part. So in this type of situation it's likely to be that the prohibitive factor may be the sheer quantity and not the unit price.

As for the questions regarding shipping and export/import. Small shipments can go via the post office via their EMS air service and pallet sized ones would need to go by LCL (Less container load) freight. The catch with freight is all the document charges. The actual freight charge is small per kilogram BUT there are plenty of fees on both ends that make about the same or more as air freight up until you get over a certain amount of weight. Of course this is on a case by case basis as well and depends on the goods as to whether it is more or less economical.

Import duties and taxes are really unavoidable. When I lived in Germany it was 17% tax and 3-6% duty. The tax was passed on to the customer eventually of course by the 17% we charged them for finished goods. To me it's just the cost of doing business.

So the stumbling block I see is basically finding the balance between how much you can afford and how low of initial quantities we can negotiate with manufacturers. Typically for things like latches the minimum quantity to produce ones made from existing molds is around 500 but I have had them made in quantities as low as 100 per color. Buckles from existing molds are anywhere from 1000-10,000. Just about every manufacturer will quote you a 10,000 minimum to start but they are generally flexible on that. Any metal parts where a new mold has to be made will generally incur about a $250 mold fee.

I don't really know what I am looking at to manufacture stamping tools. Near me is a street with something on the order of 30-40 machine shops specializing in CNC milling. These guys can crank out the tools but I haven't gone to see any of them yet. The machine shop across the street from me has said that they can make the simple patterns. They currently do precision brass fittings for pool cues, stainless steel joint collars and the like. I plan to go soon to check out CNC street to see what they can do.

Another interesting option which I want to explore is stone stamps. I live in an area that is rich in granite and related stones. There is a village nearby that is specialized in producing stone jewelry and other decorative stuff from stone. One of the things that they make are "chops" which are basically Chinese signature stamps made of stone. These are dipped in ink and stamped onto calligraphy, paintings and documents. I have some crazy idea that they might make good stamps. One of the suppliers I talked to said send him any design and he will turn it around in a day or so. I can't remember the price but it was very reasonable. Of course this could just be a stupid idea and they may shatter with any use but it's worth a shot.

Anyway, that's the China report for now. I think I wrote a lot but didn't say much. Send me pictures and specs of the buckles and parts you want and I will see about getting you specific details on getting them from here.

John

[swinewerx]

Well,

I could certainly set up some sort of a distribution business to service smaller orders but I do think that shipping, delivery times and possible duties would certainly be factors that weigh in against it being viable.

Things like buckles, latches, metal parts in general though are something that can either be found at the leather market or made on demand. Most factories here will produce them in any metal you request, iron, steel, alloy, zinc, or brass. Brass is the most expensive but likely to be a fraction of the price of buying from wholesalers. But I want to stress that I am not trying in any way to compete with or replace places like Ohio Travel Bag - that's not the scope. If you do need some specific things and are willing to discuss buying a larger quantity then we can talk about it for sure - for example I just bought more metal parts than I will ever need (well I hope that I will need them quickly) because I wanted better quality and the minimum amount was 5-10,000 pieces per type of part. So in this type of situation it's likely to be that the prohibitive factor may be the sheer quantity and not the unit price.

As for the questions regarding shipping and export/import. Small shipments can go via the post office via their EMS air service and pallet sized ones would need to go by LCL (Less container load) freight. The catch with freight is all the document charges. The actual freight charge is small per kilogram BUT there are plenty of fees on both ends that make about the same or more as air freight up until you get over a certain amount of weight. Of course this is on a case by case basis as well and depends on the goods as to whether it is more or less economical.

Import duties and taxes are really unavoidable. When I lived in Germany it was 17% tax and 3-6% duty. The tax was passed on to the customer eventually of course by the 17% we charged them for finished goods. To me it's just the cost of doing business.

So the stumbling block I see is basically finding the balance between how much you can afford and how low of initial quantities we can negotiate with manufacturers. Typically for things like latches the minimum quantity to produce ones made from existing molds is around 500 but I have had them made in quantities as low as 100 per color. Buckles from existing molds are anywhere from 1000-10,000. Just about every manufacturer will quote you a 10,000 minimum to start but they are generally flexible on that. Any metal parts where a new mold has to be made will generally incur about a $250 mold fee.

I don't really know what I am looking at to manufacture stamping tools. Near me is a street with something on the order of 30-40 machine shops specializing in CNC milling. These guys can crank out the tools but I haven't gone to see any of them yet. The machine shop across the street from me has said that they can make the simple patterns. They currently do precision brass fittings for pool cues, stainless steel joint collars and the like. I plan to go soon to check out CNC street to see what they can do.

Another interesting option which I want to explore is stone stamps. I live in an area that is rich in granite and related stones. There is a village nearby that is specialized in producing stone jewelry and other decorative stuff from stone. One of the things that they make are "chops" which are basically Chinese signature stamps made of stone. These are dipped in ink and stamped onto calligraphy, paintings and documents. I have some crazy idea that they might make good stamps. One of the suppliers I talked to said send him any design and he will turn it around in a day or so. I can't remember the price but it was very reasonable. Of course this could just be a stupid idea and they may shatter with any use but it's worth a shot.

Anyway, that's the China report for now. I think I wrote a lot but didn't say much. Send me pictures and specs of the buckles and parts you want and I will see about getting you specific details on getting them from here.

John

I would like whole veg tanned skins for less seams and more molding and tooling too. All for my bug's seats to recover