A couple of Holsters

[leatherhead117]

Here are a couple of holsters that I made for a friend. The one with the Colt 1911 is the very first holster that I ever made and the one with the Vaquero is the 3rd holster that I have made. Any input would be helpful as I have had several other people come to me and ask for some holsters. I am looking for any kind of critique. Good, Bad it will be looked at as constructive. Thanks.

[DCKNIVES]

First the quality of your tooling and stitching look good. IMO your wings on the pancake holster are way too wide and should be brought in at least an inch maybe more.I also think both holsters are way too shallow for the guns, especially without a retention strap.I typically have the gun all the way covered up to the rear sight. I usually line my holsters, but I always dye and seal the inside, as I never like seeing raw leather on a finished project.Hope this helps.Dave

here's two of mine showing what I think the depth of the gun should be

[katsass]

Here are a couple of holsters that I made for a friend. The one with the Colt 1911 is the very first holster that I ever made and the one with the Vaquero is the 3rd holster that I have made. Any input would be helpful as I have had several other people come to me and ask for some holsters. I am looking for any kind of critique. Good, Bad it will be looked at as constructive. Thanks.

Leatherhead; I agree with Dave, on the 1911 holster the wings are way too wide and the gun sits too high. I don't do too many pancake holsters anymore....just because I don't get much call for them, but I have made many in the past. The butt of a 1911, like most auto's, when loaded will most likely want to 'lean' out away from the body due to the weight from the ammo in the magazine. Sitting it lower will add to the comfort of the wearer and the security of the gun. The balance point on 1911's is fairly high so the belt loops should be cut higher up toward the butt of the gun, this will stop the muzzle from riding into the wearers hip. Lay a ruler over your belt loops and you will see that the top of the belt will be at about the front of the trigger guard, it should be up about the rear of the trigger guard for safety and comfort.

As to the holster for the Vaquero. The skirt holster, sometimes called the 'Mexican flap holster', started showing up in the mid 1870's. It was a working holster, very utilitarian although many were decorated with carving and tooling. All originals that I have seen set the gun very deeply in them, the trigger guard is fully covered but the body of the holster is frequently cut deeply to expose just the top of it and a little of the trigger. The belt loop, formed by the skirt, was wide to allow the holster to be moved on the belt for comfort and to get the gun out of the way when performing some jobs.

The speed holster for single action revolvers made it's debut around the early 1950's, the result of western movies and a big interest in speed shooting of the western six-gun. I can remember watching Thel Reid (spelling?) and others in speed draw competitions in Big Bear, CA and outside of Wrightwood, CA. way back in 1953. That style of holster is basically a molded tube of rigid leather (many times over a metal form) that allows the front of the trigger guard to rest on the top of the sewn welt, with the hammer, all of the trigger guard, and much of the cylinder exposed. It was designed to sit as firmly as possible on the belt in one location only. Frequently the toe was tied down to the wearers leg for stability. A very fast holster, but not a very practical one for carry. Almost all I have ever seen or made had a hammer thong or strap to retain the gun; it's really a necessity in this type of holster. Your design has, sort of, melded the two designs. On your design I would definitely add a hammer thong for retention, and add a 'filler' to widen the welt where the trigger guard rests on it. Form the body of the holster around the front of the pistol frame, as this will aid in retention to some degree.

Please don't think that I am 'knocking' your work, I'm NOT. Your workmanship looks good , it's just that I have made the same (and many more) mistakes myself. If my advice can help you build a better product, without the time and lost leather I spent, I'm glad to do it. You may want to look at "How To Make Holsters" by Al Stohlman and, for some history of gunleather you might find "Packing Iron" by Richard Rattenbury fascinating. I'm right at twice your age and I still learn from the many fine leathersmiths on this forum. Hope this helps some, Mike

[leatherhead117]

First the quality of your tooling and stitching look good. IMO your wings on the pancake holster are way too wide and should be brought in at least an inch maybe more.I also think both holsters are way too shallow for the guns, especially without a retention strap.I typically have the gun all the way covered up to the rear sight. I usually line my holsters, but I always dye and seal the inside, as I never like seeing raw leather on a finished project.Hope this helps.Dave

here's two of mine showing what I think the depth of the gun should be

Thanks DCKnives, This really does help as this was the first of each kind of holster I have made. I too agree with the "skirt" being too wide. I thought that maybe that was how it was suppose to be, at first. The Western holster came straight out of Al Stolhman's book how to make holsters. But I think that I misjudged and deffinetly need more practice. The one for the 1911 was purely for fun and the very first I have ever made. The wings were widened purely for practice with stamping, yet I agree way too wide for practical use. I never thought about the depth of the gun, I will deffinetly remember that. Thanks. And I have been learning how to line holsters and sheaths since these were finished because I agree that they look much better that way. Thanks again, I appreciate the input.

[leatherhead117]

Leatherhead; I agree with Dave, on the 1911 holster the wings are way too wide and the gun sits too high. I don't do too many pancake holsters anymore....just because I don't get much call for them, but I have made many in the past. The butt of a 1911, like most auto's, when loaded will most likely want to 'lean' out away from the body due to the weight from the ammo in the magazine. Sitting it lower will add to the comfort of the wearer and the security of the gun. The balance point on 1911's is fairly high so the belt loops should be cut higher up toward the butt of the gun, this will stop the muzzle from riding into the wearers hip. Lay a ruler over your belt loops and you will see that the top of the belt will be at about the front of the trigger guard, it should be up about the rear of the trigger guard for safety and comfort.

As to the holster for the Vaquero. The skirt holster, sometimes called the 'Mexican flap holster', started showing up in the mid 1870's. It was a working holster, very utilitarian although many were decorated with carving and tooling. All originals that I have seen set the gun very deeply in them, the trigger guard is fully covered but the body of the holster is frequently cut deeply to expose just the top of it and a little of the trigger. The belt loop, formed by the skirt, was wide to allow the holster to be moved on the belt for comfort and to get the gun out of the way when performing some jobs.

The speed holster for single action revolvers made it's debut around the early 1950's, the result of western movies and a big interest in speed shooting of the western six-gun. I can remember watching Thel Reid (spelling?) and others in speed draw competitions in Big Bear, CA and outside of Wrightwood, CA. way back in 1953. That style of holster is basically a molded tube of rigid leather (many times over a metal form) that allows the front of the trigger guard to rest on the top of the sewn welt, with the hammer, all of the trigger guard, and much of the cylinder exposed. It was designed to sit as firmly as possible on the belt in one location only. Frequently the toe was tied down to the wearers leg for stability. A very fast holster, but not a very practical one for carry. Almost all I have ever seen or made had a hammer thong or strap to retain the gun; it's really a necessity in this type of holster. Your design has, sort of, melded the two designs. On your design I would definitely add a hammer thong for retention, and add a 'filler' to widen the welt where the trigger guard rests on it. Form the body of the holster around the front of the pistol frame, as this will aid in retention to some degree.

Please don't think that I am 'knocking' your work, I'm NOT. Your workmanship looks good , it's just that I have made the same (and many more) mistakes myself. If my advice can help you build a better product, without the time and lost leather I spent, I'm glad to do it. You may want to look at "How To Make Holsters" by Al Stohlman and, for some history of gunleather you might find "Packing Iron" by Richard Rattenbury fascinating. I'm right at twice your age and I still learn from the many fine leathersmiths on this forum. Hope this helps some, Mike

Thanks for your input, I will have to look up the book "Packing Iron". I have the book from Al Stolhman. It was a great help with both holsters. A retention strap is a great idea. Thanks. I'm always looking for ways to improve, as I have only been working with leather for not quite a year yet. Thanks.