2Nd Rawhide Flop

[acox4t4]

Howdy all, yep this is the rawhide rookie again. This was my second attempt at making rawhide and it looks to me like its a flop. I did the remove the fat, then put in lime water method. It was in the water for 5 days total, it started to let me pull out hair yesterday but I noticed that a slim layer was also coming off with it. Didn't know if that was suppose to happen or not so put it back in the lime water so that all the hair would come out. Well today I pulled it out and where the slim came off yesterday there were big holes and in taking off the hair today more slim came off so I'm sure this will be nothing but a holy mess. Bah !!! Any help on what I'm doing wrong would be very helpful I love feedback since I'm really wanting to braid something and this hobby is starting to get expensive without any results.

One picture is from yesterday, and the other one is today with hair all out.

Thanks Annette

[roo4u]

yup big holes thats what happened to me when i tried to make my own...now im gonna buy a hide and wont do my own again until i can get set up to cook it. mine was in to long and not only had the holes but also lost alot of the top layer where the strength is so it was useless. you can start braiding using something else..leather, paracord, different sizes of cord. check out knotheads site alot of folks braid without ever touching leather and you could learn the basics very cheaply.

[dirtclod]

I never have made any rawhide. But i seen it made in a movie about braiding and that guy cleaned, streached and dried the hide then laid the hide over a pole and scraped the hair off.

[rcjunky007]

your rawhide seems to have been left in too long and some hides will not slip very easy and some will. your mixture might be too strong as well. also thid method does not work when the weather/water is cold-ish but other than that dont quit rawhiding! you will find what works for you weather it be slipping or scraping. scraping is very natural and seems to be the best way for ME it just takes some more work. good luck!

[acox4t4]

Thanks much for the feedback, hopefully third time will be the charm. I don't know much about how to do this so thought it was probably caused by to much lime but wasn't sure. Since I've read and saw the pic's on how to make it and followed those directions by putting in a coffee can full but I don't drink coffee and I wasn't sure if they ment a small can or one of those big ones. Plus I didn't fill the trash can full of water just enough to cover the hide. Glad to hear from ya all it helps to know the reason rather then guessing. I didn't know if maybe the cow had something wrong with it, ringworm or something that caused it. So with the feedback my 3rd try will hopefully be the charm. I won't try it for awhile, I'm alittle burnt out plus need to save up some money again. But with deer season coming up soon and I go hunting, processed up 5 deer last year making Jerky, summer sausage, burger and have eaten almost all of it through-out the year so will need to go restock the freezer this year. Will maybe just wait and use them to save some money from buying another cow hide. Has anyone used much deer to braid with?? In the books I'm reading there was only one that made mention of using deer.

[Hennessy]

Thanks much for the feedback, hopefully third time will be the charm. I don't know much about how to do this so thought it was probably caused by to much lime but wasn't sure. Since I've read and saw the pic's on how to make it and followed those directions by putting in a coffee can full but I don't drink coffee and I wasn't sure if they ment a small can or one of those big ones. Plus I didn't fill the trash can full of water just enough to cover the hide. Glad to hear from ya all it helps to know the reason rather then guessing. I didn't know if maybe the cow had something wrong with it, ringworm or something that caused it. So with the feedback my 3rd try will hopefully be the charm. I won't try it for awhile, I'm alittle burnt out plus need to save up some money again. But with deer season coming up soon and I go hunting, processed up 5 deer last year making Jerky, summer sausage, burger and have eaten almost all of it through-out the year so will need to go restock the freezer this year. Will maybe just wait and use them to save some money from buying another cow hide. Has anyone used much deer to braid with?? In the books I'm reading there was only one that made mention of using deer.

an old custom tree maker told me scrape hide right after removal off animal ..find a running creek lay hide out under water,preferably on a rock base[rapid water better] weight[rocks]down hide.return every day n move rocks about.hair will slip in a few days resulting in a clean raw hide.dont drink downstream eh! failing that there are several braiders and tree makers who may share mix formula's,one did with me yrears back ,i never used it and is now lost.being able to tumble hide in a wooden container with lime solution accelerates the process[no metal containers]plastic or wood.also after lime bath and slip you have to neautralize the lime in another immersion of [forgot] then peg out for a few days for shrinkage before cutting oot yer circles

[acox4t4]

Thanks for the advice on the running water method. I'm a city slicker so don't have any place close to me to do that but if I could talk a friend into checking on it for me everyday and moving the rocks I might have a way of trying that method out. If not then my plan for try #3 is going to be to scrape off the fat, then shave the hair side and scrape. Right now I don't want to worry about the hair being seen, I want something to try out the cutter/beveler that I made and other tools that I have aquired. Plus I saw a picture of some brading with the hair shaved and I kinda liked it.

[Aggiebraider]

If you are just learning to braid I would say the best way is to step back from the route you are going now and simplify things. I would suggest getting some parachute cord or any other nylon based cord and learning the different braids and knots. Then once you progress and feel comfortable making the jump, start working with leather. Kangaroo has proven to be very nice to work with for myself, and yes it is somewhat expensive, but it works so nice that I will never go back to anything like latigo or cowhide. Rawhide is so temperamental and difficult to learn with, Im afraid youre jumping the gun just a bit. If you have already learned the basics and know how to braid fairly well, why not save the money and time and just buy rawhide already made in hides or even strings? Bill Confer ((866) 660-2830) sells rawhide and from what I have heard his is the best. He also sells precut lace in different widths to meet whatever needs you have. If you have already been braiding for a while and are trying to make the jump to rawhide, disregard what I said, I just hate to see you spend more money and struggle. I know some braiders that do GREAT work and buy all of their lace pre cut....they just feel like their time spent in making lace is worth more by just braiding and buying it premade.

Hope this helps,

CW

[rgerbitz]

Hello acox,

I started with 25 foot of string that I bought from Mike and Cindy Beaver, after that I have made all of my own hides except for some chap and roo hides that I have bought. So far I've been at this for about 4 or 5 years and feel like I am starting to make some decent rawhide. I have thrown away about as much rawhide as I have kept. Either because I screwed up the hide dehairing it, screwed up the string cutting it, or had to can some projects cause the workmanship was horrible. I have given up on using lime to remove the hair, I have only been able to get that to work out well on a few occasions. I have gone to using sodium sulfide to remove the hair (Big thanks to Rod Nikkels for that). 45 minutes and the hair is history. It's not a process you would want to do in town unless you really like pissing off the neihbors. The smell can be a bit stiff. I had a hog farmer complain about the smell!! If you would like to know more call me 815-542-6035.

Best of luck,

Rob

[Hennessy]

If you are just learning to braid I would say the best way is to step back from the route you are going now and simplify things. I would suggest getting some parachute cord or any other nylon based cord and learning the different braids and knots. Then once you progress and feel comfortable making the jump, start working with leather. Kangaroo has proven to be very nice to work with for myself, and yes it is somewhat expensive, but it works so nice that I will never go back to anything like latigo or cowhide. Rawhide is so temperamental and difficult to learn with, Im afraid youre jumping the gun just a bit. If you have already learned the basics and know how to braid fairly well, why not save the money and time and just buy rawhide already made in hides or even strings? Bill Confer ((866) 660-2830) sells rawhide and from what I have heard his is the best. He also sells precut lace in different widths to meet whatever needs you have. If you have already been braiding for a while and are trying to make the jump to rawhide, disregard what I said, I just hate to see you spend more money and struggle. I know some braiders that do GREAT work and buy all of their lace pre cut....they just feel like their time spent in making lace is worth more by just braiding and buying it premade.

Hope this helps,

CW

thats an educated way of resolveing a messy experience eh!

[roo4u]

rob..

what is your source for the sodium sulfide? and how much do you use per hide. im looking for a better way to use than lime. my first hide ended up ruined like the one in this post. i was going to try to cook it but your way may be easier.

thanks in advance

[rgerbitz]

Tracey,

I cannot remember what the name of the company is without looking, it is a regional company. I just looked in the yellow pages and started calling/emailing every chemical supply company around till I found one close by that carried it. I paid $170 for 55 lbs picked up at the warehouse. I use about a lb or two per hide. It is pretty easy to use but you want to be sure and have plenty of fresh air around or some kind of special breathing gear it can be pretty rank stuff.

Rob

[curlyjo]

If you are determined to make your own rawhide then the easiest way is to take the hide, nail it to a real strong wood wall out of the sun with the flesh out. As it dries, peel and cut the flesh off until it is totally dry. Then take down, lay it over something round and start scraping with a large, sharp rounded Knife. Go with the grain but its going to take awhile to figure direction. If its long hair use clippers to shorten it up. If this is your first time with rawhide and no one to help you I would advise going with Bill Confer at tejas and getting a hide to start with. It will save you a ton of frustration and then you can work with the raw product without the first numerous steps. Ive scraped until I hurt and am glad I found a good source.Brad

[roo4u]

i agree with curly joe and the others...learn to braid first. see if you can do it, you like it etc then learn to make the rawhide. learning to braid can be frustration enough without adding the extra problem of trying to make the stuff. as i said before many braid their whole lives and never touch rawhide or leather...try cords of various sizes.

to anyone who buys from bill at tejas...what are they getting for rawhide?

[curlyjo]

I've gotten the the whole cow hides but a little to much waste with the belly. The perfect string is the 30" diameter hides. I've cut up to 200' of under 1/4 " string and then sized down from there. But it is a little thin for Honda string so I get the split bull and size accordingly. I've bought different size string precut but it seems to be cut dry and carries a circular shape to it. If you are just starting I'd go with the 30" discs as they are really free of blems and a controllable size. But you need to be able to cut small string and not waste to much. Brad

[roo4u]

what is the price difference between getting a hole hide vs buying the discs? i assume your getting them both from the same source.

[acox4t4]

Whow this leather working site rocks. You all are great !!! Everyone gives it their best shot at giving out the best information to help. I've greatly enjoyed this site and the people in it, from what I have read in other posted questions and seen the work that you do, you all love the craft and have a great heart to share it with others. You all seem like a big group of friends rather then strangers that have never met and live miles apart. Thank you every much for your time in answering my questions and giving me the much appriciated advice on how to continue with my learning of this hobby. So far I'm greatly enjoying the braiding shoe strings (my cat is also having fun) although my 2 rawhide attempts have been flops I've enjoyed trying and the little rawhide that I have bought pre-cut from Tandy to mess around with trying to make buttons and braid has diffently brought me new found respect for those of you that can do it. Which at some point I'm sure that I'll be asking how and the heck do ya get a wet noodle type string made into a long woven shape off a wooden stick, hehe and I'm sure that is the easy part of making a button. Thanks again, greatly enjoy you all.

[roo4u]

the best part of braiding is when you see your stuff being used! we used to do alot of dog leashes and because of the way i finish our leads i can tell its one of ours...so i could watch a dog show on tv and recognize our work...even though nobody knew who actually made the leash they were using.

oh wait i also like that just when you think you have it down you can go online and see someone elses work and be inspired to learn another knot or braid. you know what else? even the elite of the braiders are more than happy to share their knowledge with those willing to learn.

[curlyjo]

roo4u, the 30"discs are pricey but top quality rawhide. The whole cowhides give you more string and more options on size string. Call Tejas Industries, Bill Confer, Hereford Tx for current price list. acox4t4, reading your last entry you mentioned using noodle wet string to build projects. If your string is noodle wet, your'e not going to get anything done. You need to learn the proper moisture to work with rawhide. I'd stay with leather or Parachute cord to learn the basics before tackling rawhide unless you have someone right with you. Goodluck and keep trying. Brad

[megabit]

Which at some point I'm sure that I'll be asking how and the heck do ya get a wet noodle type string made into a long woven shape off a wooden stick, hehe and I'm sure that is the easy part of making a button. Thanks again, greatly enjoy you all.

That's easy 1st your rawhide needs to be drier than noodle wet and second you tie it onto where you want it to be in the first place. The wooden sticks are mostly for learning to tie the knots.

[roo4u]

megabit is right...the wood stick, aka mandrel, are mostly just for learning. . all my small knots, ring knots, gauchos, pineapple knots whatever i need i tie around my finger. bigger projects i tie right on the item. even a botan or a pampas button...when i put them on bracelets i braid them right on.

[skyout]

Hi Tracy,

I did a quick search on site as well as Google search and came up empty handed.

Would you have any pictures of the botan and pampas buttons? Possibly some links?

TIA

Rick

skyout

[Aggiebraider]

They are both in one of Grants books, without getting it out and looking, I want to say they are in the Encyclopedia of Rawhide Braiding or whatever its called.

CW

[roo4u]

they are in bruce grants encyclopedia...i think they are not a popular knot because they are hard to tie and i dont think you can interweave them...least ive never tried. the small boton is also called a fan knot and the large boton is also the three section fan knot, it is considered very difficult. the pampas is a 3 section lazy knot and is easier than a boton to tie. im making some bracelets now so ill take some pix of these when im done.

i really like them because i think they are some of the prettier knots to tie.

[skyout]

Thanks, looking forward to the pics as I don't have any braiding books yet.

I have heard of the Gaucho Fan Knot???

http://www.khww.net/articles.php?article_id=10

Rick

skyout

Edited September 25, 2010 by skyout