Singer 45K - Skipping Stitches

[monkfinch]

My Singer 45K cylinder machine is no longer reliable in that it continually skips stitches.

The timing appears to be fine and the shuttle hook is in good shape with a polished tip and no burrs. The only issue I can find is lateral play in the race/shuttle causing a gap between the hook and the needle kerf to occasionally exceed the recommended width of 2mm. My service manual says to insert a paper shim to correct this. I now have 4 card stock shims and adding more obstructs rotation.

My questions is whether anyone has experience with this issue? A replacement race assembly will not be cheap and I would love to hear opinions before I throw money at this machine. Lastly, any recommendations for vendors that have 45K race assembly's? Thanks!

One last thing - notice how my shuttle driver has been ground. Has anyone seen this before? I guess that is one way to keep the driver from slipping...

---Chris

Edited June 16, 2012 by monkfinch

[amuckart]

You need a certain amount of slop in the shuttle race to allow the thread to pass around the shuttle. Make it too tight and you'll get thread breakage.

What size of needle and thread are you using? What happens if you go up a needle size or down a thread size?

[monkfinch]

You need a certain amount of slop in the shuttle race to allow the thread to pass around the shuttle. Make it too tight and you'll get thread breakage.

What size of needle and thread are you using? What happens if you go up a needle size or down a thread size?

Amuckart,

Thanks for your response. It makes sense to have a little "slop" in the shuttle race. I also have a Singer 7-34 that uses a similar bullet shuttle type. The 7-34 sews perfectly and its shuttle/race has way less wiggle than my 45K.

I am going to try a brand new shuttle for my 45K and see how that goes.

As far as thread, I've tried 207 and 277 nylon with matching thread for the bobbin. I've also tried 207 with 138 in the bobbin, but that produced even more skipped stitches. I've tried a few different needles for canvas and leather. I'll get the needle sizes when I go to the shop on Monday.

---Chris

[amuckart]

What needle sizes are you using with those threads? If the needle is too small it won't reliably throw a loop for the shuttle to pick up

[Anne Bonnys Locker]

I see that you have pulled it all apart but have you tried after cleaning all of the crap out of the race and reassembling it?

Recently I fixed a 45k that someone else had determined was "stuffed" with a simple clean. On another "broken" machine the screws on the shuttle driver shaft were loose!

Jim Saddler gave me a bit of advice (and I think Bob mentioned it here too) that you need to back the timing off a fraction for heavier leather. I fixed another "buggered" machine with this method recently.

There seems to be a nasty groove in the retainer ring. Is there a raised 'welt'?

Edited June 18, 2012 by Anne Bonnys Locker

[monkfinch]

Amuckart,

As far as needles, I've been using:

- Organ brand needles size 328LR 214x2RTW DDx2LR 180/24 (for leather)

- Leo Lammertz brand size 328Ch 180/7 (for canvas)

I have 214x2RTW 230/26 (for leather) but I did not like them with the 207 thread because they left a larger stitch hole that I would like.

Anne Bonnys Locker,

The race has been cleaned.

I thought the groove on the retainer ring was factory machined, but after your comment it's looking like it's a wear pattern. Good eye! Also, at some point the ring was reversed and an identical groove is beginning to appear on that side too. The groove on the correct side is noticeably deeper near the ring opening. That may be where I am getting my extra lateral movement.

That's an interesting point you made about backing the timing off for heavier leather. Not sure if that applies to what I am doing - sewing 10-12 oz harness or bridle leather through canvas webbing and two layers of 18 oz. waxed duck canvas.

---Chris

[monkfinch]

Anyone know where I can get a replacement retainer ring (Singer / Simanco part # 91430)? My sources do not have one...

OR

I see there are new stitchers that appear to be copies of the Singer 45K like the Tech-SEW GA5-1R. Does any one know if parts on these machines are interchangeable with the Singer 45K?

http://shop.raphaelsewing.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=274

---Chris

Edited June 18, 2012 by monkfinch

[Anne Bonnys Locker]

Hi Chris,

I have a 45k25 and a GA5-1and will compare the parts tomorrow. There is a long term plan to work out which GA5 bits fit the 45k but I am waiting for a full kit of parts to try it all out.

[monkfinch]

Hi Chris,

I have a 45k25 and a GA5-1and will compare the parts tomorrow. There is a long term plan to work out which GA5 bits fit the 45k but I am waiting for a full kit of parts to try it all out.

I downloaded a GA5-1 parts list and it does not have a retainer ring like the 45K does. Let me know what you think of the GA5-1. I may be in the market for a cylinder bed to replace my 45K...

---Chris

[Anne Bonnys Locker]

There are differences between the machines in that the outer retainer is flat while the inner is stepped. I have just tried the GA5 parts on a 45k and they appear to fit with a bit of modification.

1/ The grooves on the outside of the inner ring (the ones to accommodate the two studs) are smaller on the GA5 so these will need to be ground out slightly to fit - not a biggie.

2/ The 45k I am testing on is not a runner so I cannot give it a test but I suspect the shuttle is too tight. A cardboard shim is probably all it needs - once again, not a big issue.

The GA5 is a good machine but I would strongly suggest you work on getting the 45k going!

I downloaded a GA5-1 parts list and it does not have a retainer ring like the 45K does. Let me know what you think of the GA5-1. I may be in the market for a cylinder bed to replace my 45K...

---Chris