Singer 31-15 & Needles (Again)

[bfranklin3]

Anne Bonnys Locker: I just saw your comment after posting my comment above. I don't see much of a gap between the needle and the hook. There are several threads on this topic also, so I'll look into this.

Thanks for the feedback!

[Wizcrafts]

Loops from the top thread under the bottom layer are caused by either little or no top tension, failing to feed the thread through the take up lever, or too much tension on the bobbin thread, or wrong hook timing. Verify that the top thread is threaded correctly.

Something that is not always apparent is the rotational timing of the hook when it meets the ascending needle and grabs the loop. The hook can be made grab the loop when it is retarded or advanced, by raising or lowering the needle bar. But, if it is out of sync with the direction of motion of the take-up lever (and check spring), bad things will happen. I had to advance my hook last year to resolve an ongoing problem of the top thread making a snap noise as it was pulled around the bobbin. The retarded timing of the hook allowed the take-up lever to begin its upstroke a little too soon, pulling hard on the thread before it was past the halfway point around the bobbin. Advancing the hook and raising the needle bar allowed an extra few degrees of rotation needed to get the top thread over the hump without extra stress. This made for better bottom stitches and no more loops under the work.

We are talking about very old iron here. My 31-15 is from 1921. It was never meant to use nylon thread, because such thread was non-existent back then. It was a tailoring machine, meant for use with cotton thread, sewing cotton, gaberdine and other light garments. My Dad had a 31-15 in his tailor shop, for 50 years.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Wizcrafts

[bfranklin3]

OK - I think I found the problem (a problem?) on my machine — it's weird that I don't remember seeing this originally.

By going very slowly — and watching and listening, I can see that when the needle is going down into the bobbin area, it hits the hook slightly (I can see the needle deflect and hear a slight scraping noise). With the 16x257 needle, the deflects but the scarf seems to caught slightly on the hook and the bounces off as the needle moves upward.

How do I adjust the needle to the left or the hook to the right to give a bit of clearance between them? Or is this due to the rotational timing issue that was mentioned?

[bfranklin3]

Last post I wrote that the Organ 16x257 needle is slightly hitting/rubbing the hook and that the scarf seems to catch on the hook. I then asked how to adjust the machine so that the needle is moved slightly to the left or the hook is moved slightly to the right to provide a bit of clearance.

Not receiving any answers, I decided to experiment a bit further. Since I have an old 31-15 machine from 1902, I thought I'd try a needle CDTthayer mentioned in his response.

I was able to obtain Schmetz 16x73 (16x1) needles [both numbers are listed on the box]. Although CDThayer mentioned that these are for foot-powered machines, I tend to sew slowly with my motor-powered machine. These needles are the same diameter as the 16x257, but do not have a scarf. However, they are about 1/32 of an inch longer than the 16x257 needles, so I adjusted the needle bar slightly to compensate.

For some reason, they do not rub the hook. These needles work great! No problems at all. So, I'm happy that the machine is running fine now. As long as I can obtain these needles, all is good. Again, thanks everyone for your help. Your comments set me on the track to find a needle that works.

However, I am still curious why the 16x257 needles (with a scarf) would rub the hook and if there are any adjustments that can be made to eliminate this. If anyone has an answer to this mystery, I'd love to know.

[Wizcrafts]

Maybe the needle bar positions the 16x257 too far to the left and it allows the hook to hit it.

[Anne Bonnys Locker]

I have an old 31 class around here somewhere and will try and dig it out but I am pretty sure you can adjust the position of the whole shuttle assembly by loosening the screw in the casting. Some oil and a scientific tap may be required.

Possibly the assembly had been adjusted for a worn shuttle and then a new one was put in and caused problems.