Thank you both for your help. It's much appreciated. I'm actually looking for something a little more simple like the first three machines mentioned. I have a needle ans awl in my shop right now, doesn't belong to me. I was very kindly given it to try, and its just a bit too tome consuming for me I'm afraid. I just need something more simple. I like the outlaw and weavers cub cause they are not huge. I dint have a ton of space in my shop right now unfortunately.