Advice for first solo seat sale

[KliffsKustomHouse]

Hey everyone... this is my first post up here so you'll have to excuse any malfunctions. I've just started out in leather work after getting into pinstriping and doing kustom kulture style art for a while and am after a bit of a critique and maybe some advice. I've just finished up this solo seat based on a pan that a buddy made up. Finding this forum has been awesome and made the process so much easier. Apart from an old leather work manual and a lacing guide, this forum has been the hub for all the info to give this seat a go. This seat is the second I've made and the first that I've carved and used decorative lace on. I just fudged my way through making the patterns, carving and dying/antiquing but I think it turned out ok. Maybe too much lacquer but I followed the instructions for 2 coats. Also, when I dyed it a dark red colour it left a residue on the black lacing that I had to hand paint over again with some black raven oil to eliminate. Do you need to mask dark lace in that case. It was a bit of an experiment to see if I could come up with a seat that I would be happy to sell on to a customer and now after completing I'm not real sure how much to put on it. There's not really anyone I know if here on the Gold Coast in Australia that's doing this stuff. Can anyone give me an indication as to what sort of money you'd put on a seat like this? I just want to start off at the right pricing.

Really appreciate any help and thanks to everyone on here for all the information and photos of their projects. Hopefully I'll have a more stuff up on here soon.

Cheers,

Kliff

[Jordan]

Really a nice job on that seat. It has been awhile but visiting motorcycle builders sites has prices ranging from 300 to 600 dollars for custom solo seats. They are not cheap thats for sure. The seat makers here would probably give you a better pricing idea than I could.

[TinyL]

I'm in the process of starting out. For your workmanship, which is wonderful by the way, you should go $600 to $900. However, it's difficult to get customers to understand the true value of custom. Sometimes you can only charge what you think they will pay in order to get your stuff out there. I'm in between lowballing competition and charging what it "should be for custom". When I quote a price and get the job, I wonder if I should have charged more. Right now, I just want the jobs, so despite what people close to me say, I'm okay with doing it for a lower price ( for now anyway).

On another note, if people are familiar with your work ( which is not leather), and you command a certain range in price for that work, you would want to be in the same comparable range with the leather pricing. Some people are leary of too good a deal and will pass on it. Go figure! Good Luck!

TinyL

[David]

Hey everyone... this is my first post up here so you'll have to excuse any malfunctions. I've just started out in leather work after getting into pinstriping and doing kustom kulture style art for a while and am after a bit of a critique and maybe some advice. I've just finished up this solo seat based on a pan that a buddy made up. Finding this forum has been awesome and made the process so much easier. Apart from an old leather work manual and a lacing guide, this forum has been the hub for all the info to give this seat a go. This seat is the second I've made and the first that I've carved and used decorative lace on. I just fudged my way through making the patterns, carving and dying/antiquing but I think it turned out ok. Maybe too much lacquer but I followed the instructions for 2 coats. Also, when I dyed it a dark red colour it left a residue on the black lacing that I had to hand paint over again with some black raven oil to eliminate. Do you need to mask dark lace in that case. It was a bit of an experiment to see if I could come up with a seat that I would be happy to sell on to a customer and now after completing I'm not real sure how much to put on it. There's not really anyone I know if here on the Gold Coast in Australia that's doing this stuff. Can anyone give me an indication as to what sort of money you'd put on a seat like this? I just want to start off at the right pricing.

Really appreciate any help and thanks to everyone on here for all the information and photos of their projects. Hopefully I'll have a more stuff up on here soon.

Cheers,

Kliff

Hello Kliff,

I only have one suggestion. On the seat back. I stop my decorative lace well short of going all the way around the "nose" of the seat. Many mounting brackets are long enough to over hang that lace and actually crush and break it when the bracket is wrenched down tight.

See this pic:

http://www.theobaldleather.com/fullgallery/pages/back.htm

Other than this bit of advice, to looked great.

Dave Theobald

[2MadJacks]

Hello Kliff,

I only have one suggestion. On the seat back. I stop my decorative lace well short of going all the way around the "nose" of the seat. Many mounting brackets are long enough to over hang that lace and actually crush and break it when the bracket is wrenched down tight.

See this pic:

http://www.theobaldleather.com/fullgallery/pages/back.htm

Other than this bit of advice, to looked great.

Dave Theobald

This right here just proves why this forum is the best. Because all of the top notch guys that are will to tell us... all of the little secrets like this. Thanks David

And kliff, your seat is very, very nice. you have done an outstanding job. keep it up, James

[KliffsKustomHouse]

Thanks everyone for all the advice and feedback. I'm just winging my way through so any tips are really appreciated.

Yeah... the lace all the way around the front did cross my mind and I was thinking of maybe using small spacers on the seat mount to clear it. Will have to check it out once on the bike. Thanks heaps David! I really dig all your work. I just need to look at one of your masterpieces and it drives me to get better at this artform.

I have another question about the one thing that is bothering me with the finish of the seat. When I applied the dark red dye it left a rusty colored residue on the black lace. I came back later with black raven oil and covered it up but is there a way to eliminate this? Also after dying, applying antique and sealing the leather I applied a lacquer finish. It's a product made by a local leather supply company called Mac Lace. It said to apply 2 coats to fully seal leather. I wanted it to be fairly weatherproof so I went for two coats. To me it looks way too shiny now and I think one coat would have done it. Do you guys apply gloss lacquer to your seats or just a sealer to get a nice semi satin finish and weatherproof? Just thinking that the really high shine takes away from the leather feel and look. Can you tone down the shine now that I've already applied the 2 coats?

I hope my weird questions make sense.

Can't thank you enough guys.

Cheers,

Kliff

[David]

Thanks everyone for all the advice and feedback. I'm just winging my way through so any tips are really appreciated.

Yeah... the lace all the way around the front did cross my mind and I was thinking of maybe using small spacers on the seat mount to clear it. Will have to check it out once on the bike. Thanks heaps David! I really dig all your work. I just need to look at one of your masterpieces and it drives me to get better at this artform.

I have another question about the one thing that is bothering me with the finish of the seat. When I applied the dark red dye it left a rusty colored residue on the black lace. I came back later with black raven oil and covered it up but is there a way to eliminate this? Also after dying, applying antique and sealing the leather I applied a lacquer finish. It's a product made by a local leather supply company called Mac Lace. It said to apply 2 coats to fully seal leather. I wanted it to be fairly weatherproof so I went for two coats. To me it looks way too shiny now and I think one coat would have done it. Do you guys apply gloss lacquer to your seats or just a sealer to get a nice semi satin finish and weatherproof? Just thinking that the really high shine takes away from the leather feel and look. Can you tone down the shine now that I've already applied the 2 coats?

I hope my weird questions make sense.

Can't thank you enough guys.

Cheers,

Kliff

Kliff,

Lots of good questions. I'm not sure what you used to do the dark red finish. I sure wouldn't like having to re-dye my lace when I thought I was finished. One thought is to make sure all the black lace gets hit with the dye. At least then the discoloring is uniform. (One method of correcting a mistake is to make it look intentional) Other than that, I'd try scrubbing the lace with a toothbrush to see if some of that rusty colored stuff might come off.

Do I use lacquer? Not if I can help it. Why? Because on occasion the stuff will start to peal off. When that happens, try scrubbing your seat with brake fluid to remove all the lacquer. It works but you will spend hours getting the stuff off. I do use lacquer on black seats because the stuff rubs off so badly..... Just ask Jeff Cochran how many pairs of jeans he ruined on my black praying hands seat when he rode it around Daytona a couple years ago. If the result is too glossy just remember what this finish is really used for. It is a wood finish! What would you do if you had a glossy finish on wood and wanted to tone it down a bit? You would go over it with fine steel wool.... and yes that works on leather too but go easy to make sure you don't go all the way through the lacquer. Once you tone down the gloss try Aussie Conditioner as the final finish on the seat.

Hope that helps,

David Theobald

[KliffsKustomHouse]

Thanks again for the great info David. The customer has seen the seat and is really happy so I'll leave it be. If there is a problem with peeling I'll try out the brake fluid.

What you said about lacquer makes a lot of sense to me now. I'll go and get myself some Aussie Conditioner for the next seat.

The red dye that I used again is a product made by a local company called MacLace. They manufacture and supply just about anything when it comes to leather. Do you apply your dye with a brush, foam brush or just with a rag? I used a brush this time and I think it probably went on a little thick as the brush just picked up so much more dye..... the antique too. Is it recommended to apply antique and rub it off immediately with a rag? Can you dilute it and work it up in layers to desired effect?

Sorry about all the questions. I just need to experiment with some test panels I think instead of tooling and lacing a seat for hours and then finding out the hard way.

Thanks again for answering my questions. I can't wait to get onto the next project.

Cheers,

Kliff

[David]

Thanks again for the great info David. The customer has seen the seat and is really happy so I'll leave it be. If there is a problem with peeling I'll try out the brake fluid.

What you said about lacquer makes a lot of sense to me now. I'll go and get myself some Aussie Conditioner for the next seat.

The red dye that I used again is a product made by a local company called MacLace. They manufacture and supply just about anything when it comes to leather. Do you apply your dye with a brush, foam brush or just with a rag? I used a brush this time and I think it probably went on a little thick as the brush just picked up so much more dye..... the antique too. Is it recommended to apply antique and rub it off immediately with a rag? Can you dilute it and work it up in layers to desired effect?

Sorry about all the questions. I just need to experiment with some test panels I think instead of tooling and lacing a seat for hours and then finding out the hard way.

Thanks again for answering my questions. I can't wait to get onto the next project.

Cheers,

Kliff,

Sorry I missed this post yesterday. I usually apply my dye with an airbrush. The exception is black....which I apply with anything handy....brush, rag ... whatever.

Please be aware that all my answers are based on the fact that I use spirit dyes and paste antique. I do not like the new water based stuff at all. My procedure for finishing a seat is as follows.

Clean the finished seat with alcohol....I use denatured because I have it here to clean my airbrushes.

Dye the seat....I use an airbrush

When dry... oil the seat, I use neatsfoot.....

When absorbed, Spray the seat with water to dampen it....

Apply the paste antique. I use latex gloves and rub it in quickly with my hands.

Wipe off immediately with paper towels or a damp sponge. If there are blotches, scrub with a damp sponge. If that doesn't work, denatured alcohol on a rag and re apply the paste. Work quickly because the longer the paste is on, the harder it is to remove. Work on one side at a time. Have the back done before you start the front.... Don't get the paste on the side that you are NOT working on... it will leave a blotch.

Finish the seat with leather balm and then maybe Aussie Conditioner.

This is how the last two seats were done....the USMC seat and the RockStar seat.

I hope this helps.

David Theobald

[KliffsKustomHouse]

Thanks David! I have an old airbrush so I will definately have a go next time. I will look at trying out some new dyes and antiques now too.

I enjoy all the tooling and lacing but the dye and finish has become a bit scary now with unexpected results so I really appreciate you passing on your experience to help me out.

There is a Kustom Kulture car/bike show coming up in a couple of months here on the Gold Coast in Queensland, Australia so I'm hoping to have a few solo seats complete and on display in my mates custom bike stall. I'll post some pics of the next seat so you can see if there is any improvement.

Thanks again David.

Look forward to seeing your next finished masterpiece.

Thanks,

Kliff

[wintermte]

What kind of lacquer are you using? Is is the Fiebing's Resolene? Or is it something else? I'm building my first seat right now, and was thinking about a lacquer after reading this thread (to save my pants).

Thanks,

Dan Freed