Wet molding before stitching holster?

[Bingo]

Does anyone do this? The first two holsters I made, I stitched then molded. I'd like to mold it first so that I can stitch along the lines of the gun more accurately, and get the stitching as close to the gun as possible. I use Beacon 527 glue, and it says it's waterproof, so I'm thinking the glue should hold. I'm wondering what the experts here think.

I also wonder if it'll be more difficult for me to make thread holes, as I use a drill press. I guess I could just raise the leather up to the drill bit?

Thanks.

[Jared]

My thought on this is number one.. get the glue on as much surface as possible.. but to do that you really need to know how far to go.. and then you might as well stitch first. Second wouldn't it also allow for a tighter fit if you force in after stitching? You can just look at the old holster and figure out where to stitch to be closer? Meaning look at how far out from the guns shape you put the stitching and tighten it up? Not sure how everyone else does it.. but just things that went through my head on the subject.

[Shorts]

Mold after stitch. I get great results this way. Unless the design of the holster forced the stitching to be done after molding, I wouldn't do it.

[RWB]

I would suggest that you get you leather wet and form it to the gun before you sew it. This way you can let you leather dry out completely before you stitch it. Use Masters Leather Cement and you won't have any trouble with the glue not holding. If you sew you holster closed before you form it, then you are only guessing at how much leather you need to fold over. It in my experiece it far easier to make a holster or a knife sheathe to fit well if you know exactly where you need to be. Sure you can force something down in it, if you have enough stretch in you leather. But what if you don't? Leather will only stretch so far. Form it before you sew it. Another suggestion is to use an awl to hand stitch it together if you don't have a sewing machine. Drilling those holes out doesn't allow the holes to close up around the thread like awl holes will. Thats my 2 cents worth.

Ross Brunk

www.nrcowboygear.com

Edited August 11, 2009 by RWB

[Jared]

RWB, as a question, whats your retention like after that fact? The glue not holding would certainly not be what I thought would be a worry. I was thinking that if you sewed then fit with wet leather you could force it. That might be a trial and error ordeal in too tight or not tight enough, but its guranteed to be extremely tight, and for my personal wear thats what I would want. What keeps your leather taut if you haven't caused it to hold, or do you mean that you glue it, and form it? If thats the case then what happens if you glue too far, or not far enough? I know there is a guessing game to it, but if you make two and are keeping the patterns then you should be able to adjust on the following ones. Sorry I had more questions than I originally thought.

[okie44]

I know, from reading many posts,that if you ask ten of these experienced holster makers, you will likely get ten different answers. Everyone has their on favorite way of doing it. I think the most of the ones that form before stitching, are using a press with rubber pads to form the leather to the real or blue gun.

I personally go along with the idea of making the holster a little tight, then stretching the leather after sewing. This way, you get a good fit, and don't have to worry about the holster getting loose later. That way, you maintain retention over a long period of time.

The way I stay out of too much trouble is in the layout process. Along the spine or top of the gun, I allow the thickness of the gun, then on the trigger guard side, I only allow about the thickness of the leather for the stitch line. Some time on a revolver, you need to allow a little more across the cylinder. After you have done one or two, you get a pretty good idea of how much the leather will stretch.

So far, I have made a number of holsters, and I haven't made any too small to use this way. I've screwed a few up in other ways! Sometimes I do get a little nervous when I start the stretching process, that this may be the time. I wet the leather thoroughly with water, or rubbing alcohol. Both work, but alcohol won't rust your gun, and tends to make the leather harder. Works for me, but like I said, many very experienced makers use different methods, because the like the way their process works. Hope this helps, and not just add confusion. John

[Bingo]

My thought on this is number one.. get the glue on as much surface as possible.. but to do that you really need to know how far to go.. and then you might as well stitch first. Second wouldn't it also allow for a tighter fit if you force in after stitching? You can just look at the old holster and figure out where to stitch to be closer? Meaning look at how far out from the guns shape you put the stitching and tighten it up? Not sure how everyone else does it.. but just things that went through my head on the subject.

The way I glue is I set the gun on top of the inside piece of leather (for a pancake holster). Then I outline the gun with a pencil and just basically glue in the outer areas, leaving a space of about an inch (could probably go smaller) between the gun line and the glue.

I figure without the constraints of the stitching, I can mold the leather perfectly over the gun, and have a tighter, more defined mold. Then I can drill the holes and stitch as close to the gun as possible. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the closer you can stitch to the gun, the more durable the mold will be and the tighter the leather will hold the gun. It'll also look aesthetically pleasing as it'll follow the mold outline perfectly (or as near perfect as I can do it).

I hope that makes sense.

I would suggest that you get you leather wet and form it to the gun before you sew it. This way you can let you leather dry out completely before you stitch it. Use Masters Leather Cement and you won't have any trouble with the glue not holding. If you sew you holster closed before you form it, then you are only guessing at how much leather you need to fold over. It in my experiece it far easier to make a holster or a knife sheathe to fit well if you know exactly where you need to be. Sure you can force something down in it, if you have enough stretch in you leather. But what if you don't? Leather will only stretch so far. Form it before you sew it. Another suggestion is to use an awl to hand stitch it together if you don't have a sewing machine. Drilling those holes out doesn't allow the holes to close up around the thread like awl holes will. Thats my 2 cents worth.

Ross Brunk

www.nrcowboygear.com

How much space do you leave between the glue and the gun?

Thanks, all, for the responses.

Edited August 12, 2009 by Bingo

[RWB]

Jared,

The retention is great. The leather has been molded to every curve and bulge of your gun. I do this with a Horn or similar tool to mold it around the object. I fold my leather over, mold it, glue it and then let it dry completely before I sew it together. Really the only reason I mentioned the Masters glue was because Bingo mentioned that the glue he was using was waterproof; so is the Masters Cement. If you are worried about the holster not being tight enough then, after you form and before you glue it down, fudge a little and subtract about a 1/16 or an 1/8 of an inch. Or just make a mental note to sew it in further, again about a 1/16 or an1/8 of an inch, and then trim were you want your edge. Another thing to think about is that most of the stuff I make is stamped. Either set stamped or flower stamped. You can't stitch that holster or knife sheath together and then stamp it. You have to stamp it as is drying out and flat on your bench. I also like to put a antique finish on my stuff and keep my stitches white. The only way to do that is to put a finish on it before I sew it, other wise the stitches gunk up with antique. And I can't put the finish on wet leather. But like John said ten different people are going to do it ten different ways. So whatever works for you. If any of this didn't make sense fire away with the questions.

Ross

P.S. Bingo, I glue up to the edge of the gun. As far in as I can glue. I also generally put a spacer or a plug in were I sew, so that there is 3 pieces of leather that I'm stitching together. A bottom, middle and top piece. That spacer will help to fit the gun better. If I'm not making sense just let me know.

Edited August 12, 2009 by RWB

[Shorts]

The stitch pattern that's on the template that gets transferred to the outside gets transferred to the inside. Then glue outside the lines.

As for width of your stitch lines, you're close going with half the width of the gun.

[carljc72]

+1 on Monica's reply. That's what I do.

Carl