Help with wet forming a knife sheath please.

[Jerkeejoe]

Hi everyone. I'm new here and pretty new to leatherwork. I've got a question about wet forming leather for a knife sheath. How do I wet form the leather to get a clean look that follow the exact lines of the knife. In the past I was only taught to clamp the leather down around the piece you're forming to, but this doesn't seem to yield the cleanest look. The leather does not full all of the curves and angles, but only drapes over the entire piece. ( I hope this makes sense.) Also, what is the best order to do this in? Glue, form, sew; form, glue sew; etc... Thanks in advance for the help.

Here is a picture of what I'm trying to do:

[Hedge]

Welcome, Jerkeejoe.

I'm no expert on sheaths. I've made a few case and sheaths and can only share what I've learned.

If I understand you correctly, you want more definition in the outline. The problem is going to be the thickness of the leather.

The thicker it is, the less definition you'll get. You'll get fine defition with 2oz leather, but it isn't going to make a good

sheath.

One idea might be to give it the appearance of following the lines of the knife by tooling the sheath to simulate the look

of the knife.

Is the sheath in the pic one you made? It looks good to me. Has a clean look. The only suggestion I'd have is that you'll

probably need a lanyard on the knife. Doesn't look like there's enough room to get enough purchase on it to withdraw the

blade.

[smudley]

I have made a few molded knife cases for different shaped knives. I have experimented with a few different ways of forming them and I personally like to make a "mold set". What I do is I get a piece of either 3/8 plywood, or 1/2 or 3/4 craftwood (which is uaually pine, from Lowe's) that is big enough to clamp my mold to, and use this as my base. For most of my molds, this is about 3"x6". I then get a piece of plywood the same size, and draw the outline of the knife that the case will be for, making sure I leave enough room for the thickness of the leather around the knife. I have also used Plexiglas for the base and the form (the outside part)

I cut this out and wax (if it's wood) the form so it won't hold the moisture from the molding process. Make sure the knife will be able to be removed from the completed case. If I want to use the knife as my actual mold, I make sure it is wrapped well in cellophane to protect it. If I want to use a wood plug, I make it the same thickness as the thickest part of the knife, then cut or carve the recesses and curves on the part that will be the top when molding. Again, make sure this plug will be such that the knife can be removed from the completed case. Then I also wax it to prevent molding. Then I screw it to the base from the back side, so the screws wpn't leave marks in the case.

I cut my leather oversized, of course and soak it well, usually 1/2 hr or so in warm water, till it is completely limp. Then I use a wood roller to squegee some of the water out, so it will set faster. Put it on the form of choice, and using "C" clamps draw the outside form down over the knife or plug. This makes the leather stretch to the knife or plug and take it's shape. I make sure the clamps are tight and leave the setup over night to "cure" If you want to do a little carving, let it set till the moisture content is right, then carve while it is still clamped, but be careful as the leather is bieng stretched, and will have a tendancy to spread the cuts! After the leather is dry, remove the form and continue with the assembly process.

I hope this makes it as clear as mud. I know I can't explain exactly what I'm thinking, but I do the best I can.

[Sharpshooter]

The simplest way to get the perfect wet molding on a sheath is to dampen the leather, slide the knife into the sheath and wrap it in a couple layers of papertowel. Put the entire thing into a vaccuum food packing bag and suck it down tight, leave it sealed for about 30 minutes before opening he bag and it's done. Way fast and easy.

[TwinOaks]

Hi, and welcome!

Something to consider is that many knife sheaths have a welt on at least the edge side. The welt prevents the blade from cutting the thread. So not only do you have the thickness of the leather, but also the welt to deal with.

For forming...try glueing some pretty stiff foam (seat cushion stiff) to a plywood backer, then use the foam to press the leather into shape. Use some weights on top of the plywood to hold it there. This will get the general shape for you, but for really crisp lines, you'll have to use a 'bone folder/creaser' of some kind to trace the contours. Modeling tools work well for this, too.

[Jerkeejoe]

Thanks for the help and quick replies everyone.

Hedge: This is actually a knife and sheath made by a member on another forum I post on.

Smudley: It took me reading your post a second time to see what you were talking about. Now that I understand, I think that this will work really well. I'm excited to try it.

[RWClark]

I have made one or two sheaths in my time. Here is the skinny on what you are trying to do.

Because of the style of the sheath you chose (pancake instead of clamshell) and the style of knife, you will not get alot of real detail in molding. If you pressure of vacuum mold that style, the leather boddy will sink below the welt, which will not look very good.

The block method is OK, but as you have found, unless you get a perfectly shaped and smoothed block it will end up rough. You need to make the sheath first, soak only the front panel. The insert the knife and use a bone folder to form it to the handle. You can then go back in and illusion as much false detail as you want with the folder.

Bottom line is to not expect too much detail. It is just the nature of the beast.

If you are really looking for that detail, next time use a clamshell fold over sheath and taper your welt. You will see alot more of the knife's shape.

[Pip]

The simplest way to get the perfect wet molding on a sheath is to dampen the leather, slide the knife into the sheath and wrap it in a couple layers of papertowel. Put the entire thing into a vaccuum food packing bag and suck it down tight, leave it sealed for about 30 minutes before opening he bag and it's done. Way fast and easy.

Neat idea, never thought of that, thanks

[TomBanwell]

I'm no expert at making sheaths, but I can tell you how to get that sharp definition you want. The key is to cut out your shape in a piece of sheet acrylic (or something similarly smooth), and use the outer part as a form. Place the cased leather with the top-grain side down onto the form and press the leather into the form opening. You can see an example of this here http://www.tombanwell.com/sigurdkit.html halfway down the page the leather pieces with the serpentine design were done this way. What it accomplishes is that sharp definiton where the edge of the acrylic form is.

[John D Dennehy]

Jerkeejoe,

Welcome! As you can tell by now there are numerous ways to skin a cat. I am fascinated by some of the methods described here. I am interested in trying some of them myself. I have made a few sheaths in my time as well. Here is my input.

First off - match the weight of leather to the project. For instance, it looks to be about a 3" drop point Loveless style knife in that sheath. For a knife that size and the stlye of sheath I would not be reluctant to use a 6-7 or 7-8 oz leather. The larger the knife the thicker the leather.

You also need to find a good leather. Do not use belly leather and nothing spongy.

You will need to properly case the leather and everyone has an opinion on this. For this project I would cut and assemble it and then case the leather to form it. Give the sheath a good dunking in warm water and put it in a plastic bag overnight. Take it out early the next morning and let it dry out until it looks like the natural color but is cool to the touch.

Protect the knife with saran wrap and insert it in the sheath. I start molding by just pressing around the handle with my fingers. Then use a large rounded bone folder of some sort. To get the fine detail you will finish with a modeling tool.

You can achive very nice results like the one shown without making molds and stuff if you start with good leather.

Just my input,

John D