Iwb - Sig P239

[particle]

Well, took a stab at an IWB for the first time. The customer has an El Paso Saddlery holster that he really likes for a different gun, and asked me to make something similar to it for his Sig. I didn't want to outright copy their design, so I made a few tweaks and built this.

Overall, I'm very happy with the way it turned out - although, it's VERY thick... Perhaps too thick? I suppose this design, with the location of the snaps, will have no choice but to be a tad portly. The customer wanted to make sure it didn't collapse, so I marched forward with my current stock of 8/9oz Herman Oak for all the parts. Thus, the overall thickness is about 2.2" thick... It's for a Sig P239.

Any comments/suggestions greatly appreciated, including preferred leather weight for projects such as this... My Don Hume IWB is maybe 5/6oz, and it doesn't have any problem staying open with it's leather-reinforced opening...

[Denster]

Eric

Nicely done. Good job on the stitched in sight rails. You might want to consider 5/6 for the holster body but all in all really good.

[particle]

Do you think 5/6oz is a good general purpose thickness for almost any holster? I'm about to run out of this current hide and need to order some more leather. Should I just go ahead and get 5/6oz this time, and maybe 2/3oz for linings?

[dickf]

I'm using 7/8 HO and I like it a lot.

[MADMAX22]

Nicely done. I must say those stitched in sight rails are a really cool idea.

[Denster]

Do you think 5/6oz is a good general purpose thickness for almost any holster? I'm about to run out of this current hide and need to order some more leather. Should I just go ahead and get 5/6oz this time, and maybe 2/3oz for linings?

I use 5/6 for IWB bodies, 6/7 and 7/8 for OWB envelopes with mouth reinforcements depending on gun size and 7/8 and 8/9 for OWB pancakes without reinforcements. I try to get away from lining holsters because it is more work and accomplishes nothing however if the customer insists I've got a couple of sides of 2/3 that I got on sale from Tandy that is pretty nice and I don't feel bad as long as Hermann is on the outside.

[BigRiverLeather]

Very nice. I might try to bring the curve of the leather up a little higher on the slide for a couple of reasons. It will bring the belt higher on the gun, closer to the center pulling it in tighter which will increase both concealment and comfort. Secondly it will cover the trigger gaurd a little more. What you have covers the trigger fine, but I'm learning that some people like the gaurd covered as much as possible.

I did a new one this weekend similar to your. After my thrid pattern cut out I found I got it deep enough for what I need. I think my next one I am going to make it even deeper bringing the leather higher up on the slide yet. There is still plenty of room to get a good grip if I do, then it will be concealed better and more comfortable.

EDIT: I forgot the reason I replied.

On this one I used 6-7 oz which I think is the minimum I would use. I normally work with 8-9 but I'm thinking on my IWB's from now on I will be using 6-7 or 7-8 depending on the model of holster and gun. I'm a big fan of 8-9 and have been using that on most of my IWB's except for those for subcompacts usually.

I was bummed when the dye did not turn out to be even on the reniforcement and the belt loop. If anybody asks, it was intentional. This was my first time using the airbrush and except for black, I am sold and this is the way all will be done from now on.

Did you try this one on and wear it? How comfortable was it for you?

I'll say this, your fit and finish appears to be awesome. Your edges especially look great.

Edited March 8, 2010 by BigRiverLeather

[particle]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. BRL - yes, I tried it on, and it rode very well in my opinion. It felt a little thick, but was comfortable. The muzzle put a little pressure on my thigh, but I have a good bit of muscle atrophy in my right thigh (BK amputee from a MVA about 15 years ago).

[Tac]

WoW! I would consider purchasing that holster myself... (if is could stand to wear IWB) You sir have a very good eye for detail and talent to match. Everything about that holster looks first rate, from your stitching, edges, design and finish. I wish I could get that perfect of an edge burnish and cut to my holsters every time. Also, your photography looks very professional as well.

Inspiring.

-Tac

[particle]

Thank you Tac for your compliments!

An update to the holster - the customer received it yesterday, and as BigRiverLeather suggested, I'm going to have to revise the top cut line and build him another one. He was very pleased with the quality of the holster, but it didn't sit low enough inside the waistband and it flopped out at the top a bit. No worries though - it was my first IWB attempt, and I learned a valuable lesson right off the bat with this one. I'm going to order some thinner leather before I build it again. Here is a quick Photoshop'd example of what I will be revising.

Before:

After:

[BigRiverLeather]

Like the rest of us, you will soon have a large box of holsters that are REALLY nice but can't do much with them :D

I recently did a belt carry pouch for a Sig P238 subcompact. After pouring HOURS into that in design and coming up with a whole new design by the time I was done, the customer decided that that type of carry was not at all for him. I ended up making him an IWB, but I learned a lot about making a pouch and next time I should be able to whip through it fairly quickly.

I don't even feel right selling my prototypes. CCW is a serious matter that should not be comprimised so I just suck it up.

[olliesrevenge]

Thanks for posting again Eric,

I really like the two tone look of the combined 'flesh side out' body w/ grain side out reinforcement piece. For an IWB it makes a huge amount of sense. May I ask how you finish the flesh side? Did you just airbrush your final finish product on at the very end (I'm guessing some type of diluted acrylic)?

[particle]

I'm still up in the air with the best finishes to use. But, someone told me recently that he spoke with Tucker (Tucker Gunleather), and Tucker said he uses CR42 (Leather Sheen) finish spray, which is what Mr. Tucker (Tucker Gunleather) recommended as the sealant and uses on his holsters.

That being said, I took a scrap piece of leather, sanded it just like I did this holster, then coated half with Leather Sheen, and the other half with Satin Sheen. The Leather Sheen, once dry, left barely and noticeable change in color. The Satin Sheen left it quite a bit darker, and seems to pretty much negate the reason for leaving rough-side out.

If anyone has any better suggestions, I'm all ears.

[Rayban]

Particle...I'm about to try my first IWB. You mentioned in your OP that the holster was a little thick because of where you installed the straps. I'm planning on putting them on either side of the holster, on what I call the "wings", as I'll start out with a basic pancake type pattern.

Question about the snaps themselves...are they just your regular line 24 snaps, or is there something special about them.....I was wondering if you could take a picture of them unsnapped so I could get a better visual on how they are installed.

I'm also planning a stop at Cabelas where they have several holsters I can check out.

As always, thanks for your help.......your finishing is of the level I hope to achieve someday.

R

[particle]

Hi Rayban - thanks for the compliments. It occurs to me that I never updated this thread with pics of the final holster I built for this customer.

I used Pull-The-Dot snaps. I believe I remember someone here comparing them to standard line 24 snaps - his conclusion was the PTD snaps are more lose fitting (wobbly when snapped), and overall thicker. Of course, they do offer added security over standard line 24 snaps.

I bought the small T-studs from Lowes, and screws too. I don't have the sizes handy that I purchased, but can look them up tonight if you need me to. I installed the studs between the reinforcement piece and the holster body.

I bought 5-6 oz leather, but felt the leather was too thin, so I ordered some 6-7 oz for my next attempt. This holster was built out of 7-8 oz.

[Rayban]

Just so I get this.....by screwing the snap in, it allows you to loosen it in order to adjust the angles of the straps?

Is that it? (rather than using the rivet fastener that comes with line 24?)

Is this what yours looks like under the snap?

[BigRiverLeather]

I think I can speak for him when I say yes, that is the type of setup he has used, as do I. A #6 T post with the barbs on it goes between the layers of leather before you glue. Some put it all the way through from the back but it looks so much cleaner with the T post between the layers. On his IWB you would not / should not put it all the way through as it would make contact with the gun of course.

The screw I use most of the time is a #6 x 3/8" screw, button head or flat head scew with an allan head if available. I have an assortment of both black and stainless for different applications. I keep some 1/4" and 1/2" around too, as well as #6 T posts without the barbs for certain uses.

You can now easily adjust the angle or replace belt loops for different size belts or if and when they wear out.

[particle]

Everything BRL said is on the money with what I would have said. I have a hard time making a holster with permanently affixed straps that will be subjected to daily folding. Eventually, those straps will crack and fail, and the holster would simply have to be tossed. By using screws, the owner can order new straps when/if it becomes necessary.

BRL - where are you ordering your T posts from? The only ones I've found (locally) from Home Depot are for use with brads - they have tiny holes to nail a brad through - they don't have barbs on them. I have only made an IWB for one customer so far (the one shown in this thread), but he sold the gun that went with this holster so I can't get any long term feedback from him. I assume the contact cement will hold the post from turning for a while, but I'd rather buy them with the barbs for future holsters.

[Rayban]

Thanks guys...on my way to HD soon to see if I can find some.....Lowe's is right across the road...but if there's a place to order them from, I'd like to know too.

Thanks again!

[BigRiverLeather]

http://www.mcmaster.com/#

You can also get your finsih washers there, black, stainless or brass. Brass looks good, but the phillips screw heads strip out real easy. They are your one stop hardware shop

[particle]

http://www.mcmaster.com/#

You can also get your finsih washers there, black, stainless or brass. Brass looks good, but the phillips screw heads strip out real easy. They are your one stop hardware shop

Thank you for your help BRL - to confirm, is this the t-stud you buy from McMaster-Carr? Item #90975A007? Do you have to trim the barbs any to prevent them from poking through the leather?

[rccolt45]

Hey P,

Did you spary the leather sealer on before you started to work the leather or when it was all done?

[particle]

Hey P,

Did you spary the leather sealer on before you started to work the leather or when it was all done?

You have to apply sealers after all of the forming is done, otherwise it won't properly absorb water for the forming process.

I airbrush the dyes on the individual pieces, assemble, wet, form, dry, oil, burnish, then finish - in that order.

[rccolt45]

You have to apply sealers after all of the forming is done, otherwise it won't properly absorb water for the forming process.

I airbrush the dyes on the individual pieces, assemble, wet, form, dry, oil, burnish, then finish - in that order.

Thanks so much. I can never keep natural leather clean when I work with it. Yours looks so clean I was just thinking maybe you seal it forst.