Gun Belt Tips

[BOOMSTICKHolsters]

I've seen some good tutorials and videos on making belts. I even have a couple books that go into the basics of belt construction (can't recall which ones off the top of my head - I'm at work). However, I don't recall seeing any of them related to gun belts specifically.

Howdy, particle.

For you folks that make and sell gun belts to go with your holsters, I would appreciate hearing from you some basics of how you build your belts. Some things I'd like to know...

Howdy, particle. The best belt advice that I have is to use high quality components like premium leather and solid brass or stainless steel hardware. There are certain mistakes that you should avoid or they will give your inexperience away, like sewing straight across the belt, using a very curved buckle that crimps the edges, or dying the backing layer so it bleeds onto a customer's clothing. Also do what you can to make the buckle lay as flat as possible, so the belt doesn't scream GUN BELT, or draw any unwanted attention; things like only using the top layer to fasten the buckle instead of folding the double layer over, use a belt punch that makes a hole big enough that the tongue can lay flatter through the belt, etc..

Do you cut your own blanks?

I cut my own blanks from backs that I order specifically for belts. I make two main belt styles, a CCW belt and a range belt. The CCW belt is made from two layers of 7 oz cowhide, and the range belt is an 8 oz. cowhide top layer backed with 7/8 oz. horsehide.

If you buy your blanks, where do you buy them?

I don't buy blanks, but there are several sources that make theirs from Hermann Oak leather. Springfield Leather is a good place to start.

What hardware will I need for a double layer 8-9oz (1/4" thick) belt for a removable buckle (snaps - what size, type, etc.)?

I'm not that fond of using snaps for belts. Chicago screws are stronger and lower profile so the belt can lay flatter at the buckle. The length of the screw will be totally dependent on the thickness of your belts. I use two different lengths depending on the style of belt I am building.

Do you reinforce them with Kydex, etc? Or is a basic double-layered belt enough for most people?

A double thickness belt made of good quality leather is enough for most applications. For law enforcement professionals or firearms instructors, I recommend a range belt to support the load that they typically must carry, i.e. the pistol, extra magazines, a radio, hand-cuffs, etc.. In my experience, stiffeners are not necessary unless you are trying to run a high-ride holster on a narrow belt. It is important that you have a good belt-slot-size to belt-size relationship between your belts and holsters so the belt has the opportunity to stabilize the holster, but is also not too difficult to thread through the slots.

I guess that's about all I can think to ask at the moment. I'm at the point of needing to order the supplies for belts, and want to make sure I order the right stuff.

You will probably find the following items useful if you plan to do everything in house:

strap cutter/draw gauge

1 1/2" english point strap end punch

1" oblong punch/slot punch

3/16" belt punch/hole punch

maul and poundo board

lexol/bick 4 or other appropriate conditioner

neatsfoot oil

foam brushes/sponges

wax block

1/8" to 3/16" edger

layout tool/scratch awl

wool daubers

awl

staples

stitch groover or edge creaser, depending on your preference

glue pot

Thanks,

Eric

[particle]

For what it's worth, I finally got a response from Weaver regarding what and where their blanks come from. Here is their response.

Thank you for your email.

I apologize for the delayed response. All of our leather is a tannery run. (approx 50% c – 25% b and 25% a) We do not offer the hide by grade. The leather is sold and we use tannery run only.

Our belts are made from a 8/9 oz leather. We use the natural tool and strap and the bridle.

Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.

Edited May 19, 2010 by particle

[particle]

Thank you Boomstick for the thoughtful response. Can I ask what you use the staples for? I'm guessing maybe to hold the keeper closed until the belt can be assembled, but I really have no clue... Would you mind posting a pic or two showing how you fold over the end of the belt at the buckle?

Thanks again,

Eric

[BOOMSTICKHolsters]

The staples are to connect the ends of the keeper. I just use industrial staples and crimp them on with needle nose pliers. I make the holes for them with a stitching awl. Unfortunately, I can't upload any pictures right now. My computer went the way of the Dodo, and I have a temporary solution but the current computer I am using doesn't have a card reader, nor does my camera have a USB port.

Here is a picture that I already had that might give you an idea of what I was talking about with the buckle end.

[particle]

Here is a picture that I already had that might give you an idea of what I was talking about with the buckle end.

Thank you - that tells me what I needed to know. I built a belt for myself a while back, but it was entirely hand sewn. I haven't come across any tutorials showing start-to-finish on building a basic gun belt. Guess I'll make a video of it one of these days... that is, after I figure out exactly what I'm doing!!

Thanks again.

[K-Man]

Call me stupid I guess, because I've been doing things a bit different than what's mentioned above when it comes to making the gun belts. I two layers of 6/7 oz H.O. leather (backs) that are glued and stitched together. There's a single layer extension of sorts from just beyond the slot for the buckle tongue. Where that double layer ends, just before the single layer rolls over to the backside, I sew straight across at a 90-degree angle. I've made approximately 500 belts that way and have never had an issue arise. The other thing I do is dip-dye the total belt. That means front and back get dyed whatever color. Then the belt is sealed with an acrylic finish. Never have had a report of the dye wearing off on a customer's clothes. I guess I must be doing it wrong.

Edited May 19, 2010 by K-Man

[BOOMSTICKHolsters]

Hey, Kevin.

I quit dying the whole belt after an unhappy customer complained that the black dye stained their pants when the belt got wet. At the time, I only sprayed my belts with acrylic to seal them (live and learn, I guess). Now I dip them in acrylic, but I still don't trust the sealant for long term use enough to dye the inside layer.

It looks like we fasten our buckles in a similar manner, with the exception of stitching straight across the belt behind the buckle. Dad taught me early on never to do that because it weakens the straps more than necessary. He compared it to perforated paper, ie "tear along the dotted line". You may have seen used horse tack before with the buckle torn off because it was stitched straight across (I know I have). Also, did you ever notice that the decorative stitching on western belts is in a pattern that curves or angles across the belt in a diagonal pattern, but not straight across? Supposedly, that is because it was considered a bad idea among old timers to sew straight across a belt.

There are some practices from saddle making that I don't use for modern holsters (like treating them with neatsfoot oil or creasing the edges to seal them better), but there are other practices that I still believe are beneficial to what I am doing. I can't think of a good reason to sew straight across the strap, but there are some possible drawbacks to it. Better safe than sorry, IMO.

[K-Man]

Stresses on the leather are generally much greater on horse tack than on a leather gun belt. I've seen horse tack that's been torn along the "perforated" line. I've been wearing one of our belts, carrying a 1911-frame style of gun nearly every day, and cinch the belt up tightly to some extent. I've been wearing this particular belt for over 2 years, every day. I'm yet to see any separation along that stitch line. So while it seems that you would potentially experience the same result on the belt as you do on the horse tack, it just doesn't happen. I'll just keep on being stupid I guess.

Edited May 20, 2010 by K-Man

[particle]

I'll just keep on being stupid I guess.

Who said you were being stupid?

K-Man - I tend to agree with you. Compared to a horse, the forces a human body is capable of expelling are minuscule, at best. Depending on the stitches per inch, I feel like there is very little chance of the belt tearing under normal use. That being said, I've heard a prosthetist talk about children and how hard they can be on their prosthetic limbs. Titanium, carbon fiber, stainless steel - they build them supposedly strong enough to support a pickup truck, but children still break them all the time. I'm an amputee myself from a motorcycle wreck in my college days. I have a fairly large build, am a bit overweight - yet I've carried loads my prosthetist would cringe if she knew, hauled thousands of pounds of stones and lumber (took a few trips...), skied, snowboarded, etc. All that, and I still managed to shatter one of my legs when I simply lunged forward to grab a shopping cart that was about to broadside a lady's car - and I have very little strength in my amputated leg...

[abn]

Who said you were being stupid?

I don't think anyone called anyone else "stupid," but I'm guessing K-Man disagrees with Boomstick's advice that sewing straight across the belt and dyeing the inside are rookie "mistakes." K-man -- far from being a rookie -- suggests he employs both techniques for good reason.

I suppose this thread just proves if you ask six leatherworkers the best way to tie a shoe, you'll get six different responses. (In which case, you get to consider each of the different techniques and choose the one that works best for you.)