Your Opinion On Gun Belts...

[Rayban]

My experience has been that single-layer belts will sag - sooner rather than later. In addition, a test for me is if I can pinch the top and bottom edge of the belt over with my fingers. I've been able to do that in every instance with a single-layer belt.

Thanks, I tried that with this 14 oz. (1-1/2" wide) belt I just made for myself, no can do.

[Rayban]

Most of the belts I make are cut straight through, but if I'm making a heavy strap gun belt, and say the person is a small waisted lady or a guy with a beer belly, comfort can be an issue and this is where I would make one with the dip in it. It is true "most" belts will dip after a couple uses, but I thought we were talking about belts that aren't supposed to give....

It's MO that "giving" to the contour of your body, and "sagging" from the weight of a holster/gun, are two different things.

[BOOMSTICKHolsters]

I had an acquaintance that swore up and down his single ply 14 oz. Hermann Oak belt was "just as good as" the double thickness belts that I make. He even teased me about it occasionally because he knew that I disagreed. This went on for a little over a year, until his "just as good" belt developed a bit of sag and some wrinkling on the edges. He was still very convinced that it was still serviceable and as good as ever, though. I finally gave him a double layered belt for free and told him to let me know what he thought after a while. He has been using this belt for daily carry for almost three years now, and he recently admitted that the double layer belt has proven far superior in comfort, wear and stability. Sometimes you don't know what you don't know.

A single ply belt may be good enough for specific applications, but don't kid yourself; it is not as good as a quality built double ply belt of the same weight. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, all belts will eventually wear out, but a double thickness belt will wear better longer. Physics are physics, and that's the way it is whether we want to acknowledge it or not.

[horsewreck]

It's MO that "giving" to the contour of your body, and "sagging" from the weight of a holster/gun, are two different things.

A real stiff single or double ply belt can cause a comfort issue bad enough to where the customer will stop wearing the belt before it "gives" enough to feel comfortable , my point is that most belts that "sag" are belts that may also "give " easily to the body shape. Simply put on gun packers that may experience comfort issues from a stiff belt due to their body build it may not be a bad idea to build the belt on a contour. As I stated on most of belts I build I don't build them on the contour, but cut them straight away,and that's on single and double ply belts. I brought up building them on contour as a reply to Madmax who had noticed a long break in period on a ladies work belt. Also as K-Man noted due to some body shapes belts cut on a contour don't tend to have these comfort issues in the first. I'm sure we have all heard of Galco Holsters, they have been making their CB4 & CB3 belts on the contour for many years, and I like many other leather guys I proudly stole their design several years ago. If body build is an issue I use the contour, if it is not an issue I don't..... Jeff

[cowhide]

I've read on another forum a discussion concerning thickness of gun belts, meaning concealed carry types.

"They say" that two thicknesses of leather is stronger than one layer of leather that's equal to the same thickness.

In other words, two layers of 1/8", glued and stitched together is stronger than a single layer 1/4" thick.

My opinion is that, while in theory "they" may be right, it's splitting hairs in regards to a gun belt.

I can't believe a single layer will cave-in with the weight of a holster/gun hanging on it, any sooner than two layers will. Especially when we're talking 1/4" thick.

I have an "experiment" going on now with a fella that carries everyday....pictures to follow.

Meanwhile, I would like to hear/read what ya'llz think.

Thanks,

Rg

Rg, I agree with you. a 9/10oz double shoulder or 9/10 double butt is not going to cave in. the first thing that will give out on a stitch belt is the stitching.

[BOOMSTICKHolsters]

Rg, I agree with you. a 9/10oz double shoulder or 9/10 double butt is not going to cave in. the first thing that will give out on a stitch belt is the stitching.

The fact is, 9/10 single ply belts do sag and cave in. I cited an example earlier of a 14 oz. belt cut from quality leather that sagged after about 14 months. A single ply belt of the same weight will wear out sooner than a double ply belt of similar quality with the same total weight. A double ply not only has more top grain leather, which means it is stronger, but it also has additional tension between the layers that adds sheer strength, and helps resist rolling or sagging.

[gregintenn]

I just finished my first double layer belt made from 7/8 oz leather. There is no single leather I've seen, except for maybe rawhide, that is as stiff as this belt. I have to believe, that while there's more labor involved in the dual layer belt, the final product is woth it. While hand stitching the belt, I couldn't help but think that I'm waaaaaaaaaay too big around!

Edited July 10, 2010 by gregintenn

[Billsotx]

The cut of leather is the primary factor. Belts should be cut from the back as previously noted. I've seen a lot of belt straps cut from shoulders, which I wouldn't waste time on. I cut my belts from the top third of a side, and I prefer to cut the billet end from the butt. I used 8/9oz. and lightly taper the billet on the liner and the fold-end of the outer. I have looked at a lot of the later Bruce Nelson's belts and I copy what I think he did. Nelson is probably the first custom holster maker to build contoured concealed carry belts. He said that he got the idea from the heyday Hollywood buscadero belts. Galco, Milt Sparks and other top notch gun leather is also contoured. Contoured is comfort. If belts are 2 inches wide or less, cut them straight, glue them up, case them and lay them flat on your workbench and with the flats of your hands put the curve in the belt that you want. You can eyeball it or you can make a form (jig if you will) to shape it around. If you're building the belt for a male, lay the billet to your right and gradually work in the contour. If you're building for a female, lay the billet to your left and then curve it. Let it dry thoroughly and then stitch it. I know a guy (who will remain un-named) that used to work for one of the above mentioned makers and they make their belts in this way. They build belts all day, and at the end of the day, they dip the belts in a tub of gum trag (but water will work in my experience) and then lay them on a table and shape them. Wider belts, western rigs - buscaderos, will have to be cut on a contour. You can only bend so much leather. Surf around the saddle makers on this forum. They shape breast straps in this manner. Anytime I'm around a saddle guy or gal, I listen, they know stuff ... yeah, some of them are old ... lol! I'm keeping an eye on horsewreck, sounds like he's been there done that, walked away from it, didn't crash and burn ...

[billymac814]

I can't believe I never thought about casing them and then curving them that way! I've never really considered cutting them on a curve because it seems like there would be more wasted leather but more importantly I think every body shape would require a different curve, mine has an odd shape to it after wearing it for a while, it's not a smooth gradual curve. I have a few orders for belts so I may try this on them, it should really help cut down the breakin period.

I make my belts double layered, glued and stitched. I don't think there's any comparison between this and a single layer for the reasons already stated and in my opinion the finished product looks much better and slides through the belt loops easier since both sides are smooth, It is at least double the work which makes them more expensive but there's plenty of cheap belts out there if someone wants a cheap one.

[Billsotx]

OHG billymac I thought I was having some kind of flash back. Did I answer my own question ... lol! Surfed over to you web. Nice looking stuff. I thought your pillon pad was a sissy bag, but google educated me. We don't need no stickin' fenders on our bikes ... LOL! Let us know what your clients think about your upcoming belts. You DO and we LEARN!