johnggrg Report post Posted February 3, 2011 I have a question. I have been told to measure the center of the spine then the thickness of the spine add 1/4 inch to it and split it in half and mark that on either side center. Then V gauge it then remove material in between with a french bevelaer. Question is if I remove this material won't it show if the inside of the cover is unlined??? Does anyone have a picture of this so I can see what this may look like??? This would help alot. Thank you. John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 3, 2011 Can ANYONE explain this better???? Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeee! John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pete Report post Posted February 3, 2011 Well of course it will show if the inside is unlined. What are you asking? The reason for the steps is to make the book fold and close easier. If you don't want it to show- then line it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Well pete thank you for the reply. As to 'What I mean """ Does anyone have a picture of this so I can see what this may look like??? This would help alot. Thank you.'''' That is what I mean pete. Being as I am just starting out and don't know any better. I guess from time to time a beginer may ask some stupid questions. but to me and alot of other people the only stupid question is one that is not asked. If it is upsetting to you then don't reply. I thought this would be a place for a person to ask questions and maybe learn from the people who know. John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pete Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Sorry for the reply- I guess it did seem a little terse having re-read it! To make the book close easier, lay flatter, and keep unnecessary bulge out of the spine, measure the spine width and add a little.. Say that your spine is marked with lines 1/2 inch on each side of the centerline. Start with one outside line and groove it top to bottom. Do it again next to it. Again until you have reached the center line. THEN GO TO THE OUTSIDE OF THE OTHER LINE. DON"T just keep going across. Work the other one to the center also. This way you will have parallel and straight lines as a channel for the spine. Use a french beveler and take out the "rows" so that you gave a smooth swath down the spine of the cover. I just finished 2 bible covers. When you slip the front and back into the new cover, you don't even see the UNLINED spine area- it's covered when its open, and closed its tight against the spine. If you ARE concerned about the spine showing, just add the thickness of the lining material to the spine measurement , glue it,work it in and smooth it down well. Hope this helps- sorry for the earlier post pete Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scary Leatherworks Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Here's a few pics of unlined covers. one is a sketch pad you can see the groove I didn't have a v-groove at the time so it was cut with a knife so it's a little wavy. the other will be a zippered case that I grooved. I don't usually line my covers. I prefer to make them more industrial so I sand the flesh side smooth then saddle soap it. hope this helps. Also I don't usually cut my grooves all the way. I tend to leave around 1/4" -1/2" on the ends so the groove doesn't show on the edge when the cover is closed Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 5, 2011 Thank you Pete and Murse for your replies and pictures. Pete don't worry about it. I do have a question Pete. When you say add the thickness of the linning to the spine? What do you mean exactly? Murse I like the idea of leaving 1/4-1/2 at the ends good tip. I think I am going to go with a linner of 2/3 oz veg tan black goat skin. I thought about it and since I have never linned anything before why not try it now. Pete when going with a linner. I only glue around the edge and on the spine right? Or would I cover the whole linner with glue? Thank you. john Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pete Report post Posted February 5, 2011 Thank you Pete and Murse for your replies and pictures. Pete don't worry about it. I do have a question Pete. When you say add the thickness of the linning to the spine? What do you mean exactly? Murse I like the idea of leaving 1/4-1/2 at the ends good tip. I think I am going to go with a linner of 2/3 oz veg tan black goat skin. I thought about it and since I have never linned anything before why not try it now. Pete when going with a linner. I only glue around the edge and on the spine right? Or would I cover the whole linner with glue? Thank you. john If I line something then I glue the whole thing in. When I said to allow for the spine/lining, I meant that you shouldn't just close the book and measure across the spine. You need to allow a bit(maybe 1/16th) extra as it will bind a little if you simply groove the spine area the exact width. The outside needs to fold around the spine and that's where measuring it closed edge to edge comes in. I just like to add a little both tho allow enough to close it and have it lay smooth. What you scoop out with the french edger you will be adding back with the liner as you are basically filling it back up again! Glue the center down well and bone it so it's really bound. Then you can do either side at your leisure rolling and working it towards the edges and getting all the wrinkles out. Chan Geer likes to do one edge/side, and gently lay the rest over his hand with the cover drooping over semi closed and push the lining up into the spine and across to the final side. I've tried it both ways and prefer finding the center of the lining/cover, lining them up, cementing the entire spine and boning it completely first. Then I have no glue anywhere and feel more free to spread it on one side and stretch and work and trim it then the other side. Note- when you do line it you must have the cover at about a 45* angle (partially shut) when lining.If you line it flat you WILL get wrinkles when you fold it shut no matter what you do! Semi fold it shut as you work the liner across and you won't. If there are still tiny ones that you can't get out they will stretch out when you open it fully. I have a 2 sided dough roller that I love. One roller is flat like a 4" or so rolling pin, and the other side has curved ends. I use it as much as I do my boning tools! Let us know how it's going. and again...sorry for before. pete Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 6, 2011 Thanks alot Pete. Big help on this for me. Murse thanks for your contribution and pic's as well. Also some good idea's. Big help guy's really appreciate it. John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 22, 2011 Would Barge cement be good to glue the lining in? John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pete Report post Posted February 22, 2011 Barge or Master is fine if it is permanent and you are not going to sew it. if you are then you can use rubber cement as it can be moved around and still stick. The last cover that I did- I had an idea that worked well so I am going to do it from now on. Because the cover (I used 3/4 oz) is thin and the flaps only cover a few inches on each side (to hold the book flaps) then there is a piece in the middle that has only the one side and that's hard to burnish. I cut a strip about 3/16ths, skived the ends, and tucked them under the flaps on each side leaving leather all the way across the spine.. This way when you look down on the top or bottom of the cover it looks as though it is 2 thicknesses all the way across. I did this so that I could get a nice burnish ALL the way around the cover and not just on the flaps. Let me know if this confusing and I'll take some fotos. pete Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnggrg Report post Posted February 23, 2011 So any rubber cement will be good if I am going to sew the lining in right? John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pete Report post Posted February 23, 2011 So any rubber cement will be good if I am going to sew the lining in right? John correct. -p- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
