Best Way To Speed Up Rusting On Steel Wool For Vinegroon

[LilRay]

Got steel wool, very little rust. Is there a way to accelerate rusting?

God Bless, Ray

[dbusarow]

You do not want rust (ferric oxide) you want ferric acetate. Clean the steel wool of any oil it may have, I soak in acetone and then squeeze and allow to dry. Put the clean, dry steel wool in the vinegar and let it sit.

Dan

[LilRay]

I've already put the wool pieces in the vinegar. However I didn't degrease. Is that absolutely neccessary or will it work otherwise?

I can pour it out and start over, I've got a whole bag of wool and more vinegar.

God Bless, Ray

[dbusarow]

Absolutely necessary. They put the oil on there to keep the wool from rusting in the bag, in the store. The oil works just as well keeping your vinegar away from the steel too. Start over.

Dan

[LilRay]

I don't have any acetone, will Iso Alcohol work, or am I headed to the store?

Thanks for helping.

God Bless, Ray

[dbusarow]

It should work just fine. Be sure to dry it off well before adding to the vinegar.

Dan

[LilRay]

It should work just fine. Be sure to dry it off well before adding to the vinegar.

Dan

Thanks so much for your help Dan! I've got the wool soaking now. I'll leave it for a half hour or so, turning it now and again. Then leave it overnight to dry, and start over tomorrow.

Thanks again.

God Bless, Ray

[Frank]

Ray,

If you boil the vinegar with the steel wool for a couple hours, let cool overnight and then start over the next day with the boiling, the process will speed up.

Also, it's easier to pour alcohol or lighter fluid on the steel wool and then burn off the access. When it's cool then throw it in the vinegar.

Frank

[LilRay]

Ray,

If you boil the vinegar with the steel wool for a couple hours, let cool overnight and then start over the next day with the boiling, the process will speed up.

Also, it's easier to pour alcohol or lighter fluid on the steel wool and then burn off the access. When it's cool then throw it in the vinegar.

Frank

Frank, I let the wool sit and soak for about an hour in the alcohol. I've since taken it out to dry. Are you saying I should light the wool, or light the alcohol with the wool soaking in it?

Thanks!

God Bless, Ray

[Frank]

Ray,

I should have been a bit more clear. You really do not need to soak the wool in the alcohol or lighter fluid for an extended period of time. Both will get rid of any oil residue on the steel wool fairly quickly. After removing the wool from whatever you put it in to remove the oil, put the wool in an old metal pan/dish and then light the wool on fire until it burns out. This will remove any remnants of oil and whatever liquid that you used.

You can throw the wool directly in the vinegar after this, just make sure the pan is cool enough to handle and that you burn the residue off in a well ventilated area.

Frank

[LilRay]

Ray,

I should have been a bit more clear. You really do not need to soak the wool in the alcohol or lighter fluid for an extended period of time. Both will get rid of any oil residue on the steel wool fairly quickly. After removing the wool from whatever you put it in to remove the oil, put the wool in an old metal pan/dish and then light the wool on fire until it burns out. This will remove any remnants of oil and whatever liquid that you used.

You can throw the wool directly in the vinegar after this, just make sure the pan is cool enough to handle and that you burn the residue off in a well ventilated area.

Frank

Thanks Frank. I'll let it dry as much as it can tonight, then I'll light it up in the morning

God Bless, Ray

[dirtclod]

Steel wool will burn by it's self. So if your going to light it have something i cover the pan with to put the fire out.

[lazybum]

Actually by right the vinegar itself will dissolve the grease on the steel wool won't it?

I remember hearing about using vinegar to clean grease before.

Though I guess cleaning out the oil first will make things faster

Edited April 5, 2011 by lazybum

[ChuckBurrows]

1) for making vinegar black there is NO NEED to rust it. In fact rusty iron can be counterproductive when making blacking.The use of rusty iron comes from the wood workers who want redder tones when staining wood.

2) While I recommend that one remove the oil with all due respcect it is NOT absolutley necessary by any means - over the last 40+ years I have more than once produced a batch with steel wool straight out of the package without removing the oil or burning it first. It's the acetic acid, one of the strongest acids known to man, and the fumes from the acid that do the job of dissolving the iron.

Edited April 6, 2011 by ChuckBurrows

[marine mp]

Chuck,

Not meaning a hijacking of this post, but seeing we're on the vinegar black.....I make mine out of steel mill shavings and have successfully done several pieces that have turned out great. Question....is it common for the concoction to form a thin film on the top if not shaken from time to time. I usually let it set from one use to the next and there is a brown film on it when that breaks up when I shake it up. Thanks. Semper-fi MIke

(PS...I still have several cups of shavings put aside for anyone who cares to try their hand at the vinegar black. )

[LilRay]

1) for making vinegar black there is NO NEED to rust it. In fact rusty iron can be counterproductive when making blacking.The use of rusty iron comes from the wood workers who want redder tones when staining wood.

2) While I recommend that one remove the oil with all due respcect it is NOT absolutley necessary by any means - over the last 40+ years I have more than once produced a batch with steel wool straight out of the package without removing the oil or burning it first. It's the acetic acid, one of the strongest acids known to man, and the fumes from the acid that do the job of dissolving the iron.

Ok everybody, I've got two jars "brewing". One I degreased, one I didn't. Respectively they look like this;

No degreasing;

Degreased;

The question I have now, is rather or not this stuff is looking right? Looks like black coffee now. It's been just a couple days. I stir/shake at least twice a day.

What do y'all think?

:D

God Bless, Ray

Edited April 6, 2011 by LilRay

[marine mp]

Lil'ray,

Your original question was "is there any way to speed up the rusting" on 'roon. There is "nothing" fast about vinegaroon other than the actual way it turns leather black. It does this in 2 minutes flat. (at least thats how long I keep it in the mix. It could take a shorter time than that). A 'roon concoction takes time, like a good wine does. About 2 weeks minumim to a month for the steel shavings. Maybe less for the the steel wool. I've only used the shavings. Now, it will turn leather black in a couple days. Both of your 'roon cococtions look like their on their way to being good stuff. If your a military man, remember KISS?? "KEEP IT SIMPLE".. Don't over-think this stuff. Its to easy. Let the vinegar do it's work. If you need to "black" a piece, do it. Just dip it for a minute or two. Let it set...dip it in a mix of water an baking soda for a couple of minutes to stop the process and help with the smell. (Some say this is unnecessary???? I do it...it's cheap) Then hang it in front of a fan for several hours. But-a-bing. It's done. Read the posts from Chuck Burrows...he's the man. Now grab a cold ice tea and let the mix brew!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Semper-fi MIke

[LilRay]

Lil'ray,

Your original question was "is there any way to speed up the rusting" on 'roon. There is "nothing" fast about vinegaroon other than the actual way it turns leather black. It does this in 2 minutes flat. (at least thats how long I keep it in the mix. It could take a shorter time than that). A 'roon concoction takes time, like a good wine does. About 2 weeks minumim to a month for the steel shavings. Maybe less for the the steel wool. I've only used the shavings. Now, it will turn leather black in a couple days. Both of your 'roon cococtions look like their on their way to being good stuff. If your a military man, remember KISS?? "KEEP IT SIMPLE".. Don't over-think this stuff. Its to easy. Let the vinegar do it's work. If you need to "black" a piece, do it. Just dip it for a minute or two. Let it set...dip it in a mix of water an baking soda for a couple of minutes to stop the process and help with the smell. (Some say this is unnecessary???? I do it...it's cheap) Then hang it in front of a fan for several hours. But-a-bing. It's done. Read the posts from Chuck Burrows...he's the man. Now grab a cold ice tea and let the mix brew!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Semper-fi MIke

Semper Fi Mike! I'm not military (have Cerebral Palsy and can't serve) but nearly half my uncles are. So I'm well aware of KISS.

Thanks brother!

God Bless, Ray

[lazybum]

Chuck,

Not meaning a hijacking of this post, but seeing we're on the vinegar black.....I make mine out of steel mill shavings and have successfully done several pieces that have turned out great. Question....is it common for the concoction to form a thin film on the top if not shaken from time to time. I usually let it set from one use to the next and there is a brown film on it when that breaks up when I shake it up. Thanks. Semper-fi MIke

(PS...I still have several cups of shavings put aside for anyone who cares to try their hand at the vinegar black. )

I get that too, and am interested in knowing if that is normal.

I suspect there is too much steel and tool little vinegar, causing the unreacted steel bits suspended in the vinegaroon on the surface to rust and form the brown film on top.

[c4ck4]

I think it depends on how much oil is on the steel wool to begin with. I got some ultra cheap steel wool from the 99 Cents Only store that came in three sizes #2, #1 and #0. None of them had any detectable oil present on them and they dissolved almost completely within 1 month. After only 1 week or 2 the vinegar was already dark red/black but wasn't strong enough to do more than a charcoal grey dye so I let it sit longer.

[LilRay]

I think it depends on how much oil is on the steel wool to begin with. I got some ultra cheap steel wool from the 99 Cents Only store that came in three sizes #2, #1 and #0. None of them had any detectable oil present on them and they dissolved almost completely within 1 month. After only 1 week or 2 the vinegar was already dark red/black but wasn't strong enough to do more than a charcoal grey dye so I let it sit longer.

Well my 'Roon is two weeks old today. I just took a belt out of it and it's as black as coal. Started with 0000 Steel wool. I don't know if that makes any difference though.

God Bless, Ray

[c4ck4]

Yeah I used one pad of the #0 sized wool. I just tried it today after one month and my leather came out dark rich black. I'm guessing for me at two weeks I had less iron dissolved because I started with #0 instead of #0000. I actually just posted a more complete article on my process over in another thread here. http://leatherworker...pic=14946&st=30

Have you read the other posts that talk about pre-soaking the leather in tea before the 'roon to increase the tannin levels for a stronger reaction? I haven't tried it yet but it's next on my list.

[LilRay]

Yeah I used one pad of the #0 sized wool. I just tried it today after one month and my leather came out dark rich black. I'm guessing for me at two weeks I had less iron dissolved because I started with #0 instead of #0000. I actually just posted a more complete article on my process over in another thread here. http://leatherworker...pic=14946&st=30

Have you read the other posts that talk about pre-soaking the leather in tea before the 'roon to increase the tannin levels for a stronger reaction? I haven't tried it yet but it's next on my list.

I've read the posts, but I'd hafta buy tea, I don't drink it. And my Pop's a coffee nazi. Likes to drink it and would consider that a waste.

I used two pads of 0000 wool in about 1/2 gallon of old vinegar. Both cider and white. To be honest I don't see a need in getting a stronger reaction. Getting rid of the odor faster I'd be down for though.

God Bless, Ray