How Fast Can I Turn My Cowboy 4500 Up To

[Kcinnick]

I currently have my Cowboy 4500 set at 18 for two layers of 7oz leather, but I feel the machine can go faster, and I know I can go faster now. How fast can I crank the machine up?

It has the newer digital motor on it, not the knobs.

[Wizcrafts]

I set my motor at full speed; 3800 rpm. The servo motor is still controllable enough to slow down with my tippy toe, to 1 stitch per second.

3800 rpm at the motor, with a 2" pulley, divides by 4.5 via the large 9" pulley on the speed reducer. The small 2" pulley on the reducer feeding the large 8" pulley on the machine gives another 4:1 reduction, for a total of about 8.5:1 reduction. 3800/8.5 = 447 rpm. 447/60 = ~7 stitches per second, maximum.

To sew at this speed I had to replace both belts with almost perfectly true belts that didn't have sideways motion. I also loosened the motor bolts and repositioned it for minimum side pull on the belt to the reducer. I also moved the reducer inward, toward the machine, to get the machine pulley directly inline with the small pulley on the reducer. Without those modifications the machine shook everything off the pedestal table at full speed. Now it just shakes a little.

I purchased a 64 inch belt at the same time that I replaced the 39 and 58 inchers. By hooking the 64" belt to the middle pulley on the reducer I can sew at about 15 stitches per second. The shaking is only slightly worse than at 7.4 spi. The trueness of the belts and alignment between the motor, reducer and machine pulleys makes all the difference in the world, if you need to sew fast.

Also, I tightened down every nut and bolt on the pedestal base and table.

Edited April 7, 2012 by Wizcrafts

[Rayban]

I currently have my Cowboy 4500 set at 18 for two layers of 7oz leather, but I feel the machine can go faster, and I know I can go faster now. How fast can I crank the machine up?

It has the newer digital motor on it, not the knobs.

What are you stitching?

And what's your hurry?

[Kcinnick]

What are you stitching?

And what's your hurry?

Gun belts. I am running 15 or so a week and will be expanding with a couple of stores stocking my products.

[Kcinnick]

Are there signs to look for that I am going too fast? I just want to cut down my sewing times, I have cut a lot of time out of my process with using a bluegrass edger, a roller to apply glue, making templates for all my holes and the areas of the belt I don't glue. I want to be as hand made as possible, but speed things up. I have a full time job and currently sell EVERYTHING I make. Within minutes of posting an unpaid order for sale, its GONE. I had a glock holster a guy backed out on last 15 seconds! I am just trying to make some more $$$ so I might be able to make this a full time gig, and to get some more equipment.

Nick

[Steven Kelley]

Kcinnick,

You'll know you are going too fast if you screw something up. The machine will stitch just fine at a high speed, you just won't be able to control the placement of the stitches very well. If you have an edge guide, that will help. Speed isn't everything. I learned that the hard way. Just turn up the speed until you get to a point where you don't feel like you are in control. If you go too fast, and ruin a belt, you'll have to remake it. Those few seconds you save by going as fast as possible will be lost 100 fold when you have to remake that belt.

[Kcinnick]

Kcinnick,

You'll know you are going too fast if you screw something up. The machine will stitch just fine at a high speed, you just won't be able to control the placement of the stitches very well. If you have an edge guide, that will help. Speed isn't everything. I learned that the hard way. Just turn up the speed until you get to a point where you don't feel like you are in control. If you go too fast, and ruin a belt, you'll have to remake it. Those few seconds you save by going as fast as possible will be lost 100 fold when you have to remake that belt.

What is great about the motor is the speed settings. I can feather the peddle to get different speeds, I can set the start speed at whatever I want, and the top speed. I have the slow setting, must be 1/2 a stitch a second, it is where I do the point at that speed, heck, I hand wheel the last stitch at the point. I am not looking to go super fast, but, would 2-3 stitches per second be reasonable? I have an edge guide, it works amazingly well, but I think i want a drop down style one for more versatility. The machine came set up at 18, I didn't know if there was a reason for it or not, but I assume it goes to 100... When I sew holsters I drop it down to 6 since 1/2 the work is free hand, but I just want to speed up belt straight lines.

Nick

[Steven Kelley]

I have the same machine. You should be able to sew 2 - 3 stitches per second easily, especially on a belt. I think I stitch faster than that on holsters (not around corners, but on straight sections). You just need to experiment with the speed settings and find what you are comfortable with. We can't tell you what speed setting to run. Just get some scrap leather and experiment.

[Kcinnick]

I have the same machine. You should be able to sew 2 - 3 stitches per second easily, especially on a belt. I think I stitch faster than that on holsters (not around corners, but on straight sections). You just need to experiment with the speed settings and find what you are comfortable with. We can't tell you what speed setting to run. Just get some scrap leather and experiment.

I can tell my limits, I just want to know the machines limits!

[Wizcrafts]

I can tell my limits, I just want to know the machines limits!

That's easy: 800 RPM at the machine.That equals about 13 stitches per second. Keep it very well oiled if you sew at that speed on a regular basis.

The same speed applies to the Cowboy 3500 and 5500, Cobra Class 3 and 4, and all other brands of 441 machines.

Due to vibration issues, I would limit the top speed to 10 stitches per second on the big stitchers, or 600 RPM at the machine.

[Kcinnick]

That's easy: 800 RPM at the machine.That equals about 13 stitches per second. Keep it very well oiled if you sew at that speed on a regular basis.

The same speed applies to the Cowboy 3500 and 5500, Cobra Class 3 and 4, and all other brands of 441 machines.

Due to vibration issues, I would limit the top speed to 10 stitches per second on the big stitchers, or 600 RPM at the machine.

Thanks, I keep it well oiled at any speed!

I will have to figure out what the # settings translate into RPM's! But I guess I am good to crank it up a few, I don't want to get anywhere near 13 inches per second.

[Bluesman]

The way I have always looked at it is this way. First, become effective. Whatever you are doing do it right and with as much perfection as you can. When this is accomplished go for efficiency, kick it up a notch. Effective is quality and efficiency is speed. Junk fast is still junk. Outstanding slow is still outstanding. Outstanding, fast is more money. Simple................

Jon

[Kcinnick]

The way I have always looked at it is this way. First, become effective. Whatever you are doing do it right and with as much perfection as you can. When this is accomplished go for efficiency, kick it up a notch. Effective is quality and efficiency is speed. Junk fast is still junk. Outstanding slow is still outstanding. Outstanding, fast is more money. Simple................

Jon

I look at it like USPSA shooting. I started out going for points, now I am trying to keep my points and increase my speed.

Same thing with the belts, I don't turn out junk. I make basic Hermann Oak double layer gun belts, and its pretty straight forward til you get to the tip, and thanks to the great guys here I can turn out Great Looking tips every time!

My belts are even better now.

[philippe]

I find sewing to fast will create so much friction that it causes my thread to break (or melt). When I figured that out I slowed it down and can now complete a belt faster than going full speed and breaking the thread. I too also have a cowboy 4500.

[Art]

Highlead makes a big heavier 441 for production work. I use one for blankets. It has a clutch motor and runs about 900spm. A regular 441 gets a little bouncy above 500-600spm. The big Highlead scares the women and children so I run it in a separate space, I had an schizophrenic shepherd that would run to our bedroom and hide under the bed when I ran it. It runs smooth though, doesn't jump like the 441 did.

Art

[Wizcrafts]

I should clarify that when I sew fast on a 441, it is usually into about 1/8 to 3/16 inch of medium temper chrome tanned leather. Most of the fast jobs are large production runs of rifle slings and guitar straps (two parts each). The #138 thread is pre-lubricated and the needle is a Schmetz #23 S point. It is not unusual for me to have to sew 2 to 4 dozen for delivery the same day.

On these large runs I usually have a spare bobbin loading in the bobbin winder as I sew. Downtime to reload is minimized this way.

It is not unusual to see smoke coming from the needle as I sew these straps. I have never burned or broken the lubricated thread from speed sewing. I have broken it when I don't get it to release the tension disks all the way! I hate having to pull the top thread out of the take-up lever by hand, so I balance the tensions to allow the top disks to fully separate when the floor pedal is depressed.

When I am sewing saddle bags, cases, holsters, or hand stamped straps, I slow down to about 3 or 4 stitches per second. Very thick projects are usually done at 1 or 2 stitches per second, but they aren't for production runs. If I have to do a production run into thick leather, I use my Union Lockstitch machine, flat out at 800 RPM.

Highlead makes a big heavier 441 for production work. I use one for blankets. It has a clutch motor and runs about 900spm. A regular 441 gets a little bouncy above 500-600spm. The big Highlead scares the women and children so I run it in a separate space, I had an schizophrenic shepherd that would run to our bedroom and hide under the bed when I ran it. It runs smooth though, doesn't jump like the 441 did.

Art

Art;

I'd like to learn more about that machine. Is it still in production?

[Art]

It is labeled GA2688-1. Artisan sold it as the 4000P, I have one of each, they are identical. I have the 2688 set up with blanket feed (triple feed and big presser feet.

Art

[Kcinnick]

Runs of Belts I settled on about 2 stitches per second. It is double layer Hermann Oak 7oz veg tanned leather, I hand wheel the English Point, it is faster than feathering the pedal and gives me very accurate, nice looking points. I run 12-15 at a time 2-3 times a week on belt weeks. On Holsters, I go really slow, like a stitch every 1/2 second, only because stitching is about 5% of the time I spend with a holster and is 100% of the time the step I mess one up!

I should clarify that when I sew fast on a 441, it is usually into about 1/8 to 3/16 inch of medium temper chrome tanned leather. Most of the fast jobs are large production runs of rifle slings and guitar straps (two parts each). The #138 thread is pre-lubricated and the needle is a Schmetz #23 S point. It is not unusual for me to have to sew 2 to 4 dozen for delivery the same day.

On these large runs I usually have a spare bobbin loading in the bobbin winder as I sew. Downtime to reload is minimized this way.

It is not unusual to see smoke coming from the needle as I sew these straps. I have never burned or broken the lubricated thread from speed sewing. I have broken it when I don't get it to release the tension disks all the way! I hate having to pull the top thread out of the take-up lever by hand, so I balance the tensions to allow the top disks to fully separate when the floor pedal is depressed.

When I am sewing saddle bags, cases, holsters, or hand stamped straps, I slow down to about 3 or 4 stitches per second. Very thick projects are usually done at 1 or 2 stitches per second, but they aren't for production runs. If I have to do a production run into thick leather, I use my Union Lockstitch machine, flat out at 800 RPM.

Art;

I'd like to learn more about that machine. Is it still in production?