Re-Dyeing A Western Saddle

[Julesinnola]

I'm a somewhat experienced leatherworker (I've been doing this for about 4-5 years, 30 or so hours a week, although I tend to make *cough* specialty items for adults. I've of course made my share of dog collars and belts as well Tack and saddle is something I don't usually work on, and particularly not working items (I've done some cleaning and conditioning on antiques/items that are out of use).

Someone local to me has asked me to re-dye a black Western saddle that is losing its color. I haven't seen the saddle or pictures of the saddle yet, so I'm not sure what leather we're talking about (veg-tan etc). I've re-dyed tons of boots with great success, including some color changes, but my concern would be color transfer from the saddle onto her riding pants.

My thoughts were: saddle soap -> strip/deglaze -> pro oil dye -> mink oil or aussie -> acrylic resolene.

Any input would be greatly appreciated. My google-fu has so far told me that many folks experience dye transfer after attempting DIY re-dyes, however, I'd imagine these are mostly folks taking on their first dye project.

[rickybobby]

Hi,

I have done touch up work on black saddles. I deglaze (I use acetone), Lincoln black dye, Meltonian black spray dye, seal with Fiebings Tan Kote or Bag Kote

The Meltonian spray dye keeps the color transfer from happening.

[CSMcK]

Jules - I've had some success using vinagaroon (good threads on this site) to touch up black saddles. It won't always penetrate old glazed leather, and it only works on the veg-tan, but at least there is no dye to transfer.

Chris

[Julesinnola]

Thanks for the replies! I still don't know what type of leather this is. I'm pretty sure this person believes I can just wave a magic wand. She wants a price quote, and I want pictures of the saddle before I will give her a quote. We're at a stalemate, and I'm OK with that I'll link to the picture here if/when I get one. I've thought of vinagaroon- it doesn't have an issue combining with the old dye?

I can also get my hands on Meltonian spray, I'll have to try playing with that.

[rickybobby]

Thanks for the replies! I still don't know what type of leather this is. I'm pretty sure this person believes I can just wave a magic wand. She wants a price quote, and I want pictures of the saddle before I will give her a quote. We're at a stalemate, and I'm OK with that I'll link to the picture here if/when I get one. I've thought of vinagaroon- it doesn't have an issue combining with the old dye?

I can also get my hands on Meltonian spray, I'll have to try playing with that.

Remember, to make it a nice job it should be as disassembled as possible (unscrewing conchos, removing latigo hangers, pulling apart stirrup leathers/fenders) this all takes time then putting it all back together. For a complete retouch of a worn black saddle you may have 4 to 5 hours in it and $40.00 to $50.00 in materials.

Give her a scarey $$$ quote, one that you will make some money on, that usually separates the serious customer from the bargain shoppers. If it all goes well (it never does) you can charge her less and still turn a profit.

Customers tend to put their problems on us to solve (as cheap as possible) I quit doing it that way, They need to pay for my time/materials or they need to do it themselves. They will never respect you for charging them to little or appreciate the great job you did losing money working on their saddle.

A wise old saddle maker once told me "I can starve to death sitting on my butt, I don't need to do it working on someones saddle"

Just my .02

[Julesinnola]

That wise old saddle maker is right! It took me until last year to really stop accepting jobs that aren't worth my while or drive me nuts.

When she first contacted me, I told her that dyeing a pair of boots from brown to black starts at $50, that I'd need to disassemble parts of the saddle, and that she'd be looking at $50 in materials and an hourly rate based on how long it actually took. I really didn't expect her to continue pursuing this once I told her that boots were $50 lol, but she did, so here I am. She also wanted me to do this in two nights, and I told her that two weeks was possible as a rush job if the saddle cooperated. She's continued to ask for a firm quote, and I've told her twice now that I can't tell her anything more price-wise until I see the saddle or some damn good pics. I figure if my hourly rate is worse than the saddler, she'll just go elsewhere. I wouldn't be heartbroken if she did. I was hoping there was some standard going rate for this kind of dye job.

I often get people asking me for cheap, and I answer them that I can give them good, but cheap isn't worth my time or their money. What bothers me is when people don't listen to what I'm saying and keep asking for a miracle when I've given them a set of options.

[rickybobby]

That wise old saddle maker is right! It took me until last year to really stop accepting jobs that aren't worth my while or drive me nuts.

When she first contacted me, I told her that dyeing a pair of boots from brown to black starts at $50, that I'd need to disassemble parts of the saddle, and that she'd be looking at $50 in materials and an hourly rate based on how long it actually took. I really didn't expect her to continue pursuing this once I told her that boots were $50 lol, but she did, so here I am. She also wanted me to do this in two nights, and I told her that two weeks was possible as a rush job if the saddle cooperated. She's continued to ask for a firm quote, and I've told her twice now that I can't tell her anything more price-wise until I see the saddle or some damn good pics. I figure if my hourly rate is worse than the saddler, she'll just go elsewhere. I wouldn't be heartbroken if she did. I was hoping there was some standard going rate for this kind of dye job.

I often get people asking me for cheap, and I answer them that I can give them good, but cheap isn't worth my time or their money. What bothers me is when people don't listen to what I'm saying and keep asking for a miracle when I've given them a set of options.

She is trying to make her problem yours and you will end up loosing (money/time)

My .02 cents is to tell her MINIMUM of two weeks in your shop and $600.00 She is asking for a firm price but not letting you see the saddle, you must protect you time investment. It appears you have already spent and hour or more just "fussing" with her (now I have time invested in her! lol!!).

Also let her know that once you see the saddle you may turn it down anyway. This also keeps you in control of the transaction, this is important! Once a customer can take control of your investment of time and talent they ride you like a rented mule. It will never be good enough, cheap enough, or fast enough.

Send her down the road, I'm tired of her and I haven't even spoke to her! lol!!

Watch out for you first,

[Julesinnola]

She is trying to make her problem yours and you will end up loosing (money/time)

My .02 cents is to tell her MINIMUM of two weeks in your shop and $600.00 She is asking for a firm price but not letting you see the saddle, you must protect you time investment. It appears you have already spent and hour or more just "fussing" with her (now I have time invested in her! lol!!).

Also let her know that once you see the saddle you may turn it down anyway. This also keeps you in control of the transaction, this is important! Once a customer can take control of your investment of time and talent they ride you like a rented mule. It will never be good enough, cheap enough, or fast enough.

Send her down the road, I'm tired of her and I haven't even spoke to her! lol!!

Watch out for you first,

You've got great advice. It's easy for me to get focused on providing "good customer service" and not realize that I'm screwing myself. My bottom line is a lot clearer for the types of orders I do frequently, it's harder for me to estimate when the job itself has unknown elements. But you're right- I'm busy enough with other orders, so I'm shouldn't deal with someone who can't do things like give me pictures when I ask for them!

[PAMELA GOOD]

I HAD A ORIGINAL PRICE SADDLE MADE TWENTY YEARS AGO AND IT IS STILL IS IN EXCELLENT CONDITION AND I WAS WONDERING HOW MUCH THIS SADDLE WOULD BE WORTH IF I SHOULD CONDIDER SELLING IT SINCE I DONT RIDE HORSES ANY MORE. THE NUMBER ON MY PRICE SADDLE IS 3,314,121, I WOULD REALLY APPRECIATE ANY HELP YOU COULD GIVE ME, THANKYOU, PAMELA GOOD