Prefered Sewing Methods?

[billymac814]

I used to saddle stitch everything and used its strentgth as a selling point. Once orders picked up though I had to either get a machine or quit taking orders and now after machine sewing at least a 1000 holsters or so and not having a single one return because of broken thread I'm convinced its strong enough. Also like others have said the cement I use is doing more to hold it together than the stitching. I also used to go to great pains to either glue the ends of the thread or burn them and when I moved my shop I kinda got away from it and haven't had any problems because of it.

When I do saddle stitch now I do it with an awl and two needles and definitely taper the threads. All of the cords get tapered and inserted through the eye, you don't just cut a few cords off and insert the remaining or it can make a mess. It is a PITA though and even harder with pre waxed thread. Ohio travel bag sells pre tapered threads BTW. I tried them and they were OK but that's about it.

On repair work I will use a needle from a McKay stitcher, often called a Jerk needle or Hook needle and do a lock stich, this is similar to using one of those stitching awls but much easier especially if you're always using a different color thread. I only do this on repairs though and only if I can't get it on a machine.

I never got into short cuts about punching holes like using a drill press or drilling them, however I will admit that I would be tempted to do something if I had to handsew everything. I think I would choose the diamond awl blade in a non running drill press as this method would give the same results as I would get doing it with the awl.

[katsass]

From the grump -- again.

Bryan, you've asked a few questions and received more varied answers that you ever thought of. That's typical. Each of us has OUR way of doing things. The basic rule is: use the best equipment you can afford -- and practice, a lot.

That said, most of the diamond awls I see are too damned wide, and too damned dull. You'll need to learn how to re-shape one , and to sharpen it properly. Good harness needles are a must, in the smallest (thinnest) size you can work with easily --- I use #1 size needles. To try to use Grannie's sewing needles is a self defeating process. To find harness needles -- google "Harness Needles", you'll find purveyors of them all over hell and half of Texas. A good 'overstitch' tool is recommended, first to mark stitch length, and second, to 'set' your stitching when done. Practice and critique your work -- a lot. Mike

P.S. With a properly sharpened awl, you can (without too much effort) stitch things like this welt in one of my holsters. Those are layers of 7/8oz in the welt. (You need to work from both sides of the piece to align the holes)

Edited January 21, 2013 by katsass

[Bryan M]

Ok, I see what you mean there. The other day I was able to get into town and the local store, that happens to have some Tandy stuff, I got the stitching awl, over stitch tool, a swivel knife, and some needles. The needles are basicly upholstery needles. The exact same set I saw at a local super market but just in a Tandy package, and actually at the same price so I said what the heck and got them too. What I didn't see was the groover. Is that needed, or can you get around having one? I hate mail order. I would much rather just go to the store. Silly of me I know.

There were two types of awls, I didn't know which one to get so I got the one with the thin narrow leaf shaped blade that comes to a point. The blade is about 2+ inches long.

Byran

PS. Living in Central Alaska has its challenges, one of them being that there are very limited resources here. And prices tend to be much higher than the rest of the nation for just about everything. But when you include shipping it evens out when it comes to most items, usually. That is not always the case however. I'm going to have to bite the bullet and order leather, the closest place I've found happens to be the Tandy store in Anchorage. Which from what I've been reading is less than ideal when it comes to leather quality.

Long ps sorry bout that.

Edited January 21, 2013 by Bryan M

[billymac814]

You'll probably have to accept mail order soon. I'd be SOL without the Internet and mail.

You can get by without a groover, just make an indentation with a pair of dividers for now. You'll eventually want a groover. Surprisingly enough if you have a harbor Freight store nearby they sell a groover that comes with an edger and a gouge. I can't say how well they would work but I'd assume they are of very low quality but who knows, sometimes harbor freight surprises me.

Tandy usually sells leather in various qualities, the cheap stuff is low quality for sure, I never bothered trying their high quality leather as it is often more expensive than Wickett and Craig and HO.

Edited January 21, 2013 by billymac814

[Bryan M]

Nope no Harbor Freight. Closest one is almost 2000 miles away. I'm practicing and I'm admitedly pretty horrible right now. I would be shamed to show my carving and I havn't tried to stich yet. I have enough to get started though. I think I'll do some practice stitching tomorrow some time.

Bryan

[Bryan M]

I have some questions. If I'm doing the holes by hand, awl, how do I keep the cuts at 45 deg.? I need to back the awl some how, what is a good way to do that? I don't have a stitching pony, is there a decient subsitute?

My first attempt was a dismal failure. I don't think I did one thing right. It looks a total mess.

[gary]

I sew using a pricking iron to mark the holes - these help keep the right angle. I've also flattened a part of the awl handle where my thumb rests so I get it in the right and same position each time.

A sharp awl backs out easier than a blunt one. If you find you need to put finger or thumb pressure on the leather with the hand holding the awl, make sure you don't dent the leather with your finger nails.

Hope that helps.

Gary

[Matt S]

Bryan, try a wine cork for backing stitches. Champagne type corks fit my hand nicely, even if they're not Dom Perignon!

Sewing clams are quite easy. Take a foot or two of 2x4 and saw a slot 1 inch wide down most of its narrow side. Bevel the top jaws at 45 degrees or steeper and cover the tesulting sharp edges with leather. Add a clamp or bolt for pressure.

[Bryan M]

Ok I'll make a stitching pony then. I've been reading about how here on the site. I have the awl plenty sharp, I think I'll figure out a way to keep that angle consistant. Maybe a drafting triangle for reference with a T-square something like that. If I'm punching the awl straight down with a nylon boad behind it that may work for the hole. I have an over stitch wheel, got that the other day. The spaces are even just not the angles.. its kind of obvious on several of the holes. Is a round awl an option? Or do people just not use them for stitching?

[billymac814]

A round awl won't cut through the leather easy, it'll just push the material out, that goes for hand stitching and machine stitching.

You'll get the hang of the angle with practice, a stitching pony will make your life much easier. They are easy enough to make or they can be bought pretty cheap if you don't have the means to DIY. Also I'll occasionally stich my awl in a cake of beeswax, it makes going in and out a little easier.

When you get the pony done you'll be able to see where the awl is coming through on the backside, if it isn't where you want it pull it back through and push it in again, if your pushing it into a poly board or something you can't see where its punching through.

[ramrod]

bryan - what gary said about flattening your awl handle on one side is a great idea. i used to simply mark mine with a sharpey to "index" it. you absolutely must hold and insert the awl the same way every time in order to make the holes look consistent. it will definitely come with practice.

sounds like you're a willing student who's willing to learn and tackle everything.

good on 'ya.

[Bryan M]

Ok Ramrod, I'm getting the idea I think. I'll get the awl indexed and try to be more consistant. Life caught up to me today and I wasn't able to do anything. I'm trying to learn something that I know takes time to master. I don't believe in half measures. Also, I love to learn new things. I've been blacksmithing for 4 years and love that too. I'm ventureing into makeing knives and sheaths are a natural progression. So thats my basic motivation. But, I also want to do it correctly and well.

[katsass]

FWIW from the grump: Here's a pic of a #1 harness needle, the blade of my 30+ year old Osborne diamond awl and the resultant holes it makes, just to give and idea of relative sizes. Hope this helps. Mike

[Bryan M]

Thanks that picture helps a lot. Now I just need to get my awl sharp enough.

[Bryan M]

Ok so I got a little stitching practice in. On the left side of the picture I used the speedy stitcher, and on the right is some saddle stitching. Its somewhat better than my last attempt. I didn't take pictures of the back.. brrrrr... thats just aweful.

Bryan

[billymac814]

You'll get it. Do a couple belts, that'll give you some practice.

[Bryan M]

I read the pinned "How I make a belt" thread and there wasn't anything on stitching there. So, my next question would be, what weight leather would I use for that, considering I want to stitch it for practice?

Thanks

Bryan

[billymac814]

I think that thread covered a single layer belt which generally dont get stitched unless its just for decoration. Pretty much any weight will work, it just depends on how thick you want it. My concealed carry belts are roughly 1/4" thick so I normally use two layers of 8 oz or somewhere close to that. Some make them with one layer thicker than the other. You could also do 2 layers of 5 oz for a lighter weight belt.

[katsass]

My gumbelts are 12/13oz saddle skirting, lined with 2/3oz veg tanned. They take a bit of stitching. Mike

Edited January 25, 2013 by katsass

[Bryan M]

Oh good grief. I don't think I'm ready for anything like that. I'll make a normal belt I think. I have a few I can use as a pattern. But, I think I have the idea. Now I just need to convice the wife I need to spend the money on the couple of tools I need and the leather. I still need to get a groover and get/make a stitching pony. Or, failing that a couple of boards and a C clamp.

[Rayban]

I hand-stitched a belt once.

[Bryan M]

Lol Rayban, I understand your point. I won't be using a machine, I don't have one and I can't afford one anyway. This is just practice really. I figure after a few thousand stitches I may have a clue as to what I'm doing. Or not.

[billymac814]

Haha, I think that's all I ever hand stitched too, luckily it was for me and I'm skinny. I made sure I had a machine before I got any orders.

I hand-stitched a belt once.

[billymac814]

It is good practice so don't be discouraged. You'll be able to afford a sewing machine when you NEED one, that's pretty much how it works, assuming you take payments up front and charge enough anyway. Most of us have been where you are and worked our way up to a machine, others choose to handsew everything anyway, it just depends on what route you take. I actually said at one point that I'd never get a sewing machine and I planned to handsew everything. That thought didn't last long though and soon I had enough orders that I wouldn't have been able to finish them without a machine. Now I have about a dozen that serve different purposes. They have a habit of multiplying.

Lol Rayban, I understand your point. I won't be using a machine, I don't have one and I can't afford one anyway. This is just practice really. I figure after a few thousand stitches I may have a clue as to what I'm doing. Or not.

[Bryan M]

It is good practice so don't be discouraged. You'll be able to afford a sewing machine when you NEED one, that's pretty much how it works, assuming you take payments up front and charge enough anyway. Most of us have been where you are and worked our way up to a machine, others choose to handsew everything anyway, it just depends on what route you take. I actually said at one point that I'd never get a sewing machine and I planned to handsew everything. That thought didn't last long though and soon I had enough orders that I wouldn't have been able to finish them without a machine. Now I have about a dozen that serve different purposes. They have a habit of multiplying.

Well Billy, thats if you assume I'm ever going to do this as a business. I don't think at this time I will. I'll be making sheaths for the knives I plan to make. A knife sheath doesn't take near as many stitches as a belt. Or a saddle bag for a motorcycle. But other than that, I doubt I'll do it as a source of income. I just want to be good at it. And being good means doing it well. For that I need practice. My other hobbies are the same. I've studied, worked on, self trained, blacksmithing for several years. and am only now getting, what I would consider, decient. I don't make any money on that either. I do it for fun.