Gun/pistol Companions

[Pounder]

Hello:

I have been a hobbyists for 30+ years but having retired I opened a leather business, it seems holsters will be my niche as that is what has sold the most.

My "noob" question is there anything that list the various models of frames that match? For example if I cut a pattern for a Colt Cobra.38 with 2 inch barrel what other guns would that pattern match? I have researched the web and libraries and cannot find anything but I may be looking for the wrong information.

I am hoping all you experts out there and help a feller out so I don't have to go flip burgers to supplement the retirement income. Thanks in advance to any and all who respond.

Pounder

[Red Cent]

"The Cobra is the same overall size and configuration as the famous Colt Detective Special and uses the same size "D" frame, except that the Cobra's frame is constructed of lightweight aluminum alloy as compared to the all-steel frame of the Detective Special. In the mid-1960s, the Detective Special's and Cobra's grip frame was shortened to the same size as that of the Agent."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Agent#Colt_Agent

I have an order for an Agent. I have not seen any of the above handguns for quite a few years. As you can see, any matching gun is about as popular as the one we need. May have to buy a blue gun if they make them.

[Red Cent]

And BTW, the customer informed me the SP101 is similar in size compared to the Agent. The SP101 is used often to mold holsters for the Agent. As I understand it the Cobra Agent is a factory tuned higher priced version of the Agent. AND, the Agent used to have the unprotected ejection rod under the barrel. The later Agents have the shroud.

[camano ridge]

The simple answer to your question is yes and no. There are terms like J frame, K frame N frame etc. However you will find that manufactures make changes to their models that some times do not match up with older Models. You could make a holster for an N frame then find out it does not fit a particular N frame because the cylinder is shorter etc. K frames some have an ejector shroud some do not. Same with the 1911, A holster for a Colt 1911 will fit a Colt 1911 unless it is a railed 1911. There are manufactures out there that make 1911's however they don't necasarily match other 1911's. It can be confusing, trying to make a holster that will fit several guns can be complicated and not always the best. There are blue gun models that will work for more then one model of a manufacture however there is no real key that will tell you that. You have to rely on the persons knowledge that is selling the blue gun or ask on these forums if a particuler model will work.

Edited January 4, 2014 by camano ridge

[Lobo]

Colt revolvers are generally linked via several frame sizes, but with different sights, cylinders, hammers, barrel profiles, etc. The Colt Cobra is made on the "D" frame, which was also the basis for the Detective Special Cobra, Police Positive, Bankers Special, Aircrewman, and Diamondback revolvers.

The Colt "P" frame is the basis for the Single Action Army, Bisley, and New Frontier models.

The Colt "O" frame is the basis for the Official Police, Three Fifty Seven Magnum, original Trooper, and Python.

The Colt New Service line (and Model 1917 US Army), New Army, and New Navy double action revolvers were all a bit different. Most of these have been out of production (and hoarded as collectibles) for the past half-century or more, and will seldom be the basis for a holster project.

Then there was the Mk III series including the Lawman, Trooper Mk III and others.

Finally, there were the big Anaconda revolvers. Pretty rare overall, but they do pop up from time to time.

Smith & Wesson has utilized several frame sizes as well. The J-frame is the basis for the Chief Special, Terrier, Centennial, Kit Gun, and Bodyguard line.

The K-frame is the basis for the Military & Police revolvers, K-22, K-32, K-38, and Combat Magnum line. Post-1968 brought model number designations such as Model 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 18, 19, and stainless steel variations using different model designations (64, 65, 66, etc).

The L-frame was introduced about 1980, intended primarily as a means for regularly shooting high-pressure cartridges such as .357 Magnum, which had proven to cause excessive wear to the K-frame revolvers in that caliber. Being slightly larger than the K-frame, and slightly smaller than the N-frame. Models 586, 686, 581, 681 and others were made in .357 Magnum, and later came the introduction of 5-shot .44 Special versions.

The N-frame evolved from the large Hand Ejector series such as the US Model 1917 revolvers into the .38-44 Outdoorsman, .357 Magnum (original), .44 Magnum, .41 Magnum, etc, with various trade names used. Post-1968 or so model numbers were assigned to each product line (Models 21, 24, 1950, 1955, 27, 28, 29, 58, 57, 29 and corresponding stainless steel versions generally numbered with a "6" prefix, i.e.: 627, 629, etc) and in calibers from .357 through .45.

The more recent X-frame is featured on the monstrous .500 Magnums, etc.

Ruger entered the double-action revolver market with the Security Six and Service Six models about 1971 or so, and those frame designs have evolved into the current GP-100 line.

Ruger later added the SP101, originally in .38 Special and .357 Magnum and later in .32 Magnum and .22 LR versions with either fixed or adjustable sights and several barrel lengths & profiles.

Finally, Ruger introduced the LCR (Light Carry Revolver), a very compact DAO revolver offered in .38 Special, .357 Magnum, and .22 calibers.

Within each of these product lines there have been many variations in calibers, cylinder capacities (fluted and unfluted), sights (fixed & adjustable), barrel profiles (tapered, bull, exposed ejector rod vs. shrouded, standard underlugs vs. full-length underlugs, etc).

Dummy guns are available for only a very few of the most common production guns. Over the years I have been able to acquire a handful of dummies. Owning one of everything might be a nice thought, but would require hundreds of thousands of dollars in investment. So for shop use I have a few dummies as well as a safe full of current and vintage revolvers that feature many of the different variations. For some holster projects I find myself using several forming pieces to duplicate different cylinder lengths and contours, barrel profiles, sights, etc. There are still quite a few specimens that I cannot complete a holster for unless the customer can make the actual handgun available for patterning and forming the piece.

When a customer inquires about a holster for a particular revolver I frequently find myself doing a Google search to find images of the revolver in question so that I can tell whether or not what I have on hand can be used to put together a holster for it.

Holsters for revolvers comprise an excellent niche in the business. As law enforcement agencies have transitioned to semi-autos over the past 30 years or so, and the civilian market has moved in the same direction, most major holster makers now offer very limited selections for revolvers, and even those are frequently "one size fits many" designs that leave many revolver owners with less than ideal equipment.

Not a complete history here, but perhaps sufficient to show that it is possible to make holsters for many of these firearms with a selection of dummies and actual revolvers of the same product line. One key to customer satisfaction is to make sure that each customer has a realistic expectation of the results to be achieved with what we have to work with.

Edited January 4, 2014 by Lobo

[Red Cent]

Good read Lobo. Having a few personal firearms does help in the holster making business. I would impress on the new leathercrafters to make sure the customer knows what specific handgun is in his possession. The New Agent could be referred to as an "Agent" but it ain't nothing like it.

[Pounder]

Again thank you to all that replied. Permit me time to really look at and research these answers and I am sure I will have additional questions. A big thanks to Lobo, that is really some in depth information.

I hope more keeps coming. By the way, picked up two holster orders yesterday.