Firm But Thin Leather

[kevinp]

You could try here and ask if they have any off cuts for sale of the coloured finished shoulder.

http://www.metropolitanleather.com/shop/

[OurJud]

I don't mind helping answer questions but, I guess what is rubbing me the wrong way is you want all the answers (immediately) from all of us that have learned through instruction and diligently searching out the craft so you can make a wallet without all the work.

How can you say I want answers immediately? I post a question and then wait for an answer. I've never bumped a thread and reply gracefully to every reply I get. How is that demanding answers immediately?

And forgive me, but I thought forums were there so that people like me who are new to something can ask for help and advice?? If we all learned the craft 'the hard way' as you seem to be so proud of having done, people wouldn't need forums like this, would they?

May I suggest that if you feel you are flogging the proverbial dead horse, you refrain from replying to my threads

Have you looked at Le Prevo? http://www.leprevo.co.uk/hides.htm

Thanks, humperdingle. I like the prices there - UK based too. And they do dyed veg tan. I shall investigate them further.

You could try here and ask if they have any off cuts for sale of the coloured finished shoulder.

http://www.metropoli...ather.com/shop/

Another UK based company. Thank you.

Edited March 3, 2014 by OurJud

[Andrew Chee]

Couple of things. Stay away from things that say "napa". That usually denotes a very soft leather, for garments.

Veg tanning is simply a tanning process which usually results in a firmer type of leather (although that's just a general guide). Usually when you see something that just says "veg tan" it means be tanned leather that isn't dyed or finished. It is most often times used by crafts people who want to stamp/carve and have more control over the final product.

Bridle leather, harness leather. Those are terms used for veg tanned leather that have been dyed and finished. They are named so because they are designed for a particular purpose (for making bridles and harnesses). They usually don't come very thin because bridle and harness makers don't want thin leather.

The truth is, there isn't a lot of very thin, finished veg tan leather because there isn't a big market for it. Cow hide, when split down to the 1mm range loses most of its strength. Wallet and small goods makers that use it for card slots (I do) split it themselves down to that size. I understand that you want to make a wallet and want to use the right materials, but the truth is, it takes a lot of equipment to make the right product. For example, the exterior panel of your wallet. You don't want that to be 1mm because you wallet will fall apart rather quickly. You want it to be in the 1.5-2mm range. So now you will either have to buy two hides of two different thicknesses or have one hide and either make the card slots thicker than you like of the exterior thinner than you like. Or, you get a splitter.

So as for leather, this is why it's harder to find finished veg tan leather that's thin. That's why I suggested places like W&C that will split it for you. You can try calling dealers in the UK and ask them if they do splitting. Bear in mind, leather is dyed but the dye does not usually penetrate all the way through. So if split, the flesh side will be a light tan color. Tanneries have the ability it refinish the flesh side but distributors will not. This is why I like dealing with a place like W&C. They once allowed me to order a single hide where half of it was one thickness and the other half was another. Dunno if they still do that.

You can try calfskin which, because it comes from a younger animal has more strength when thinner than cow. The problem is I've yet to see finished veg tan calf. Maybe some people in Italy might do it. It would be beautiful (less blemishes) but will cost you an arm and a leg.

Anyways, hope this helps.

Andrew

[OurJud]

Thanks very much, Andrew.

I don't want to dwell on the unease between benlilly and I, and I must stress that all the answer so far have been helpful, but if I'd had a detailed reply like this earlier on, this thread would be half the length it is now.

Edited March 3, 2014 by OurJud

[Toolingaround]

Hi OurJud

I was thinking about what might work for you and had some other thoughts. Perhaps some of the wallet maker out there could let me know if I am on the right track.

I had purchased some of my tools and some scrap leather from an estate sale a couple of years ago. I have a couple of small scraps of a fairly firm, chrome tan, what looks like pig skin very very thin leather in black and dark brown. It is about 1 to 2 oz (.40 to .80mm). I think he had used it for the interior or his wallets. He had bought most of his tools and supplies from Tandy, Weaver and Hidecrafters. I think that it might be Mission Grain Pigskin Lining Leather or the Glazed Pigskin Lining Leather from Tandy or something like that. Both options would be very economical if you have a Tandy in the UK. Unfortunately I don't live anywhere close to a Tandy or I would go there and be able to identify the leather very easily.

Can anyone who has used the pig skin lining leather comment on the firmness of it for OurJud?

Here are the links to it:

http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/en-usd/home/department/leather/lining/9126-328.aspx

http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/en-usd/home/department/leather/lining/9128-329.aspx

Cheers, Toolingaround

PS as a starving artist type believe me I understand not having five dollars :-)

[OurJud]

Thanks very much, Toolingaround

I've had a quick look at those links and as I'm sure you can appreciate it's difficult to ascertain anything (the problems with buying online I suppose). I also searched for tandy leather UK and it seems there used to be a .co.uk version, but that has now moved to .eu. The store finder reveals their only UK store is in Northhamton - 150 miles away from me.

I contacted a UK seller on ebay who had a bag of dark scraps for a few quid, but she doesn't think they'll be big enough for what I want so she's agreed to take a look at what else she has in the colour and thickness I want. I'm waiting for a comeback, but at the price she'll be asking I think I'll just take the plunge and see what I get.

[DavidL]

Thanks very much, Toolingaround

I've had a quick look at those links and as I'm sure you can appreciate it's difficult to ascertain anything (the problems with buying online I suppose). I also searched for tandy leather UK and it seems there used to be a .co.uk version, but that has now moved to .eu. The store finder reveals their only UK store is in Northhamton - 150 miles away from me.

I contacted a UK seller on ebay who had a bag of dark scraps for a few quid, but she doesn't think they'll be big enough for what I want so she's agreed to take a look at what else she has in the colour and thickness I want. I'm waiting for a comeback, but at the price she'll be asking I think I'll just take the plunge and see what I get.

Springfield leather has 2/3 ounce tooling leather for $4.29 a square foot.

[JoeSnuffie]

OurJud, I'm using veg tanned goat for thinner wallets and card slots. It's thin and very stiff, even after dye, oil, finish and wax. Since you're not interested in dying and finishing yourself you should look for book binding leathers. They have some thin and reasonably stiff leathers that are already finished. Unfortunately, it can be expensive. Typically, though, goat will be a lot stiffer than cow at the same thickness. All of my 1mm veg tanned cow is a little soft, though it still takes stamping.

http://www.hollanders.com/index.php/bookbinding-supplies/bookbinding-leather.html

This wallet is from 1.75oz, or about .7mm - .8mm veg tanned goat. It is really easy to dye and work with.

Oh, and here are the pieces of goat before I stitched it up

[leatheroo]

Have you tried veg tanned kangaroo? Kangaroo has 59% more tensile strength than bovine leather at the same thickness. So it is very strong when very thin. Lovely to work with. Comes natural veg tanned or coloured, also patterned. The only problem may be access to hides where you live and the cost. If you can get hold of some to try and like it, I know some leatherworkers group together and buy kangaroo direct from australia. Check out http://www.packerleather.com and http://www.packerdirect.com.au

Very innovative company. They have just developed a leather that can be sewn into clothing that is washable.

Alternatively, you can buy single kangaroo on ebay. This seller seems to do all the export paperwork for you.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HIGH-FASHION-SCARLET-Kangaroo-leather-VEG-TANNED-800-mm-x-800-mm-/281239627020?pt=AU_Leathercraft&hash=item417b30250c&_uhb=1

cheers

Edited March 11, 2014 by leatheroo

[johnv474]

OurJud,

I think you have found some of the answers, but not yet a final solution.

I can't give a specific supplier but you may want to look for glazed / sole leather.

Of the two primary tanning processes (vegetable tanned and chrome tanned), chrome tanned tends to be soft/floppy, as used in clothing and upholstery. Vegetable tanned tends to be firmer, as in saddles. These are general statements.

Sole leather, as used for the sole of some dress shoes, is vegetable-tanned that is then glazed (i.e. compressed under a heavy pressure from a glass roller). This makes it both more dense/firm. Not all glazed leather is used for soles, however. It is also available in several thicknesses, and is often undyed.

For what it's worth, this leather can be dyed fairly easily (as well as sealed) with no odd equipment and few supplies. Even without dye, it will darken as it ages and develops patina as it is exposed to sun, skin oils, or any oils/waxes used to treat it. (You can search for undyed leather patina for image examples).

I think very thin leather is not easily found that is thin, firm, and dyed because there may not be enough consistent demand. Many suppliers (Wickett & Craig, and others) will split many leathers to the thickness desired for free. They sell veg-tanned, that is dyed and treated, and also split.

I hope this reply helps some, though it is a bit circuitous. If you don't mind, are you looking to make multiple wallets or just one or a few?

-JV474