Singer 111W113 Cannot Change Stitch Length - Help

[jjs111w]

First post help!

Just bought a Singer 111w113 for sewing leather auto seats covers. It works fine but no matter what stitch length setting we make on the knob at the pulley we get approx 6/in. I have read prior posts about how the eccentric is suppose to work, have studied the "x-ray" view in the manual but still cannot visualize what is suppose to happen that changes the stitch length. We have followed the procedure in the manual for setting the minimum (6) length, but when we back off the said knob say to 20/in, we still get 6.

Machine was supposedly serviced prior to purchase. So what actually changes when you back off the setting from the 6 minimum. I see the conical tip of the adjusting rod spindle would back away from the "feed driving eccentric regulating screw" part number 200429, but what moves? What does the spring opposite the regulating screw suppose to do? Looking at the photo should be see a change?

What am I missing?

Thanks

jjs111w

111w old style stitch length info.bmp

Edited September 19, 2014 by northmount

[CowboyBob]

Maybe this cutaway diagram will help.It pivots on screw D because of the spring .Are the threads broken on the shaft for the stitch length adjuster?You have to pull the whole shaft out.It's either that or you need to take out screw A & turn screw B in more to contact the adjuster shaft.

[jjs111w]

CowboyBob

Thanks for the great cutaway. I never saw this view before which does make it clearer as to what is suppose to happen. Yes the threads on the pulley are broken but I can lock the adjusting bar (L) in your cutaway by means of a hose clamp so it does not move once set.

I think I understand now what is to happen, but if it is suppose to pivot around screw D, then screw D should not be tight? Looks like mine is tight. Is screw D suppose to be a shoulder bolt? Also the screw opposite it (screw C) also should be not tight (also a shoulder bolt?). Looks like mine is tight and there is a lock washer between screw C and eccentric housing. Did someone LOCK the adjustment function by doing to stop any thread adjustment?

The other thing I notice is your drawing differs from what is in my user manual which I included in my post. Your drawing shows a different configuration than mine. Look at the photo I included of my machine. The screws C and D are facing the thread adjuster knob, where as they are opposite on yours. Different machines?

Looks like the attachments that I reference are with the duplicate post. Do not know why they did not show up here?

Am I really off base in trying to diagnose this? Help again?

By the way, the page you showed with the cutaway, where did you find that? I have looked allover the Web for a service manual for this machine (111w113). Could you share the info?

Edited September 18, 2014 by jjs111w

[CowboyBob]

Yes,it sounds like somebody locked it down,since there's a lockwasher on it.I think this came from a Singer 107W & the parts may be alittle different but it's all I could find so I scanned it.You can push the adjuster all the way in & then turn the B screw in & out.

[jjs111w]

Thanks again CowboyBob. I will try to loosen screw C and remove the washer and see what happens. Problem is there is no room to get the blade of the screwdriver on to thead. I will have to find a right angle screwdriver or bend one of mine. I post the results.

Thanks

jjs111w

[jjs111w]

Removed the lock washer and the screw C is a shoulder bolt. By doing so the spring pushed the slotted area all the other way to the other end of the slot from where it was. I noticed there are fine graduations on the eccentric and a "0" is stamped at one end. There is also a "0" stamped on the mating piece. They were line up before I loosened the screw.

Tried to sew that way and there was no movement at all, Zero threads per inch. Played with the adjusting screw and nothing. Will not move or stitch. Re-installed the screw with lock washer, this time half way between where it was to begin with and where it was relaxed (zero stitches). Now am getting 12 stitches per inch. The adjusting knob still does nothing. So I can live with that for now, but there is still something wrong or that I still do not understand what is going on. Anyone else care to weigh in?

Thanks

jjs111w

[pcox]

Remove the lock washer from c and re install nut. remove screw A turn L in all the way (ccw) turn screw B in (cw) you should see the cam come up towards the top. now check your stitch length. if it is long then turn L out and see if the stitch shortens if it does replace screw A. you should be able to adjust your stitch length. If you turn L out too much you may not be able to turn it back in till you back screw B out install L then readjust. Do not force L as you can bend B or break the threads of the main shaft.

[J Hayes]

Are the threads on the main shaft under adjustting knob "L" broken? I have a 153w101 with the same type of stitch length adjustment and pretty much all my threads are gone. Someone spread the slot on the shaft giving more tension and now I just push it in or pull it out for adjustments. Set it at 6 and it hasn't moved, I don't sew on it much though.

Edited September 19, 2014 by J Hayes

[jjs111w]

pcox, I will try your procedure again, firs time I did by turning screw B in with L turned all the way in, nothing happened, nothing moved. I will try again. As for the threads on the pulley, they are gone just like the photo J Hayes posted. I just pull the rod L in and out. If I can actually get the stitch length to adjust, I plan to use a hose clamp around the knob L and the pulley which will prevent it from moving while sewing and keeping the adjustment in check.

I will post tomorrow if we have any success.

Why would someone have locked the ability to change the stitch. Maybe because the threads are gone and just gave up.

jjs111w

[pcox]

In the shoe factory I worked in the management would have the mechanics lock the adjustment to keep the operators from changing them

[J Hayes]

Why would someone have locked the ability to change the stitch. Maybe because the threads are gone and just gave up.

jjs111w

I think thats exactly why someone would lock it. I think I remember gottaknow (sp?) posting that he will sometimes lock the length on the machines in the factory to prevent accidental adjustments. You may find a certain length you like that fits what you do and just leave it.

[jjs111w]

The mystery is slowing being solved it appears. As I indicated I do have it locked again and it is giving me about 12/inch. All I was getting initially was 6. Not having done any leather auto seat upholstery I am now wondering what might be the optimum stitch lenght. The next project will not have any threads appearing for decorative reasons. Any comments?

But I will still try to get the adjustment to work, other wise I will just lock it at the optimum value and sew on.

Thanks to all

jjs111w

[mk1madnesd]

For leather seat covers I'd have left it at 6/inch, and 5 looks better on the decorative French seams etc , I use up to 3/inch on my seats in some cases on the decorative stitching over thick foam etc because a stitch starting out at 5/16 inch can end up nearer a 1/4 when sewn over 3/4 scrim foam on a non walking foot machine , you would be better off with a joys or yamata or typical pf5318 , all the same machine under different names , these are in my opinion the best value for money walking foot machine available on which you can produce really nice quality work , they never drag the thread in and jam , have large capacity bobbins and you can buy a good second hand one for £300 here in the uk . I keep one as a back up machine to my seiko lsw8bl .

Regards Craig

[jjs111w]

mk1madnesd

Now that I know how to manually lock the thread lenght if I cannot get the adjustment mechanism to work, I can set it back to around 6. Right now the machine is all apart trying to install a home made speed reducer as this motor is 3500 rpm and way to fast. I have no prior experience with and industrial machine so practice and slowing down is in the cards.

We will let all of you know how we make out.

Thanks

jjs111w

[mk1madnesd]

Also lengthen the arm on the motor at least 8 inches that gives you much more control of the motor , you're gonna struggle with that motor though you want s 1400 rpm or a servo motor really !

Good luck

[jjs111w]

I got the stitch length working so thanks to all. Turns out I was missing screw A, screw B was the wrong one (not long enough). Got the right parts, unlocked the eccentric and seems to be working. Only issue is the threads on the hand wheel are gone so I am using a hose clamp around the adjustment knob to lock it to the pulley wheel..

Thanks to all for the help.

jjs111w

See my separate post for the home made speed reducer.

[Scarolamade]

Quick question, I have a 111w103 with the same stitch length adjuster.

I am having trouble removing the spindle to replace the timing belt. Am I missing something ?