Advice Wanted On Pricking Irons/stitching Awl

[Grey Drakkon]

So after some looking around, I've decided on the Joseph Dixon pricking irons ( http://www.josephdixon.co.uk/products/One_Inch_Pricking_Irons.html ) I still haven't decided on a stitching awl. Does anyone have any input on either or both of these things? Anyone have Dixons? What do you think of them? What kind of awl gives you good results with them? I'm not looking to make super fancy items (..............yet.) but something decent that will last.

[25b]

That all depends on what size pricking irons you bought.

[Grey Drakkon]

Good point. 1" no.8 with 9 teeth.

[25b]

Well, I'm not sure how wide the teeth on those are. Mine are #10 and the tooth width on mine is 1.2mm, so I got the smallest size awl Dixon makes and they work perfectly together.

Did you order the "slimline" version or just the standard one?

Edited November 14, 2014 by 25b

[Grey Drakkon]

I haven't ordered them yet just in case someone tells me that they're lemons. The ones I'm looking at are the ones I linked to. I figured 8 sounded like a good compromise between really coarse and too fiddly.

[25b]

I have a couple of Vergez-Blanchard #7 and the teeth are wider on those.

The Dixons I have are all #10 and are 1.2mm tooth width. Some have said that you have to specify that you want "slimline" teeth on the Dixons, but that is only on the lower stitch-per-inch (SPI) ones. The higher SPI ones, they make the teeth less wide so it'll be proportional.

As far as the SPI you choose, that's generally dictated by the size of the items you're making. ..*generally*. There's always exceptions, but I use the #10 on watchbands, Field Notes cases, wallets, etc. I use the VB #7 for cases and satchel type bags.

The #10 looks great for very fine items and is similar to fine English leatherwork. Works great for saddle-stitching...I use V92 bonded polyester with John James 004 needles and it turns out pretty nice.

[Grey Drakkon]

Thanks for the input! My next few projects will be arrow quivers and bracers so it sounds like I'm in the right range.

[billybopp]

I don't know about the pricking irons, but I would recommend a straight or very slightly tapered awl. The "wing awls" or "Saddler's awls" will leave a smallish hole on the back side of the hole and a large one at the front .. and the difference is more pronounced the thicker the leather. Take a look at the following picture. It shows a wing awl, three sizes Seiwa straight awls, and a Tandy (pretty sure Osborne) fine tapered awl side by side.

Other than that, What fits your hand best!?

Hope that helps

Bill

[DavidL]

Dixon's sizing and vergez sizing are one number off. A vergez 7 is a dixon 6, they could be fractions of a mm off. If you are planning to buy more irons at the same size then you may want to get the same brand so they are same sized hole and distance. If I was buying an iron now I would get a portmanteau, the corner stitches angles are uninterrupted vs the regular iron that goes upwards rather than portmanteau downward stitch. Regular irons - stitches are flat around the corner, portmanteau angled downwards around the corner.

[JonH]

Appologies for highjacking your thread but has anyone tried these https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/209814602/leather-craft-tool-3pcs-stitching-punch?ref=shop_home_active_12

Look nicely made but the points do look a little "fragile"

Any thoughts??

[Macca]

those look way too fragile, expect them to snap quickly

[Macca]

Dixon's sizing and vergez sizing are one number off. A vergez 7 is a dixon 6, they could be fractions of a mm off. If you are planning to buy more irons at the same size then you may want to get the same brand so they are same sized hole and distance. If I was buying an iron now I would get a portmanteau, the corner stitches angles are uninterrupted vs the regular iron that goes upwards rather than portmanteau downward stitch. Regular irons - stitches are flat around the corner, portmanteau angled downwards around the corner.

the sizing shouldn't be one off, blanchards have the SPI & the number of teeth stamped, the dixons only stamp the SPI so if you read it incorrectly the blanchards could be different, but when ordering by SPI they are the same spacing.

[Grey Drakkon]

I agree with the others, unless you're using them for really thin leather I'd be leery of those irons, and even then I'd be careful with how I used them.

As for the Joseph Dixon irons, I've ordered them and am anxiously awaiting them. Has anyone in the U.S. ordered from them? How long did you wait for them to arrive? I keep checking the mail every day for them.

Appologies for highjacking your thread but has anyone tried these https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/209814602/leather-craft-tool-3pcs-stitching-punch?ref=shop_home_active_12

Look nicely made but the points do look a little "fragile"

Any thoughts??

[DavidL]

the sizing shouldn't be one off, blanchards have the SPI & the number of teeth stamped, the dixons only stamp the SPI so if you read it incorrectly the blanchards could be different, but when ordering by SPI they are the same spacing.

When I measure the Blanchard number 9 It gives me 9 Teeth per inch and 8 stitches, my number 7 dixon gives me 7 stitches. Anyone else get the same thing?

[Macca]

When I measure the Blanchard number 9 It gives me 9 Teeth per inch and 8 stitches, my number 7 dixon gives me 7 stitches. Anyone else get the same thing?

Thats a number 8 you have then, not a 9

8 SPI 9 teeth is a No.8 - 9

Should be two numbers marked on it, the number closest to the teeth is the SPI, the other is the number of teeth.

They have 16 versions of the No.8 from No.8 - 2 (2 teeth) to No.8 - 20 (20 teeth)

Dixon only mark the SPI & you order by width (in half inch increments), not number of teeth.

[Oldtoolsniper]

Here is a picture of the irons I own.

Blanchard 7 8 and 7 2

7 indicates 7 stitches per inch 8 tells you the number of teeth on the iron.

Again 7 indicates stitches per inch and 2 is the number of teeth on the iron.

As you can see on the ruler 7 is the number of holes or pricks produced in an inch.

I'm not sure how other folks measure an inch but I'm betting if it says 7 stitch per inch then most reputable tool makers will shoot for that when they make or sell a tool.

As close as I can get it the tip measures at 1.8mm or about 0.071" but they obviously get wider as they go deeper into the leather.

[Macca]

wow, thats terrible, especially for the price of blanchards !

[25b]

wow, thats terrible, especially for the price of blanchards !

I don't get it. What is terrible?

[Oldtoolsniper]

wow, thats terrible, especially for the price of blanchards !

Not sure what you mean either.

[Macca]

Maybe it's just a bad angle on the picture, but that looks as though you would get 6 and a little bit SPI with that iron, not 7.

I'd have returned that, guess this is the issue David has seen with his.

For comparison , I just checked a few Dixons irons and they are absolutely spot on

[Hi Im Joe]

Maybe it's just a bad angle on the picture, but that looks as though you would get 6 and a little bit SPI with that iron, not 7.

I'd have returned that, guess this is the issue David has seen with his.

For comparison , I just checked a few Dixons irons and they are absolutely spot on

I think he needs to center the slits on the line instead of lining it up at the outside edge. That would help a bit but you are right that seems pretty off.

[Oldtoolsniper]

Here it is from a better angle.

Edited December 10, 2014 by Oldtoolsniper

[DavidL]

I believe vergez measures using Teeth per inch the same way saw's are measured. Unless they recently changed it to Stitches per inch, or they could be defects like you said.

[Oldtoolsniper]

I must be lost. I count seven holes from the zero line to the 1 inch line on the ruler. That would give me seven holes to fill with thread in one inch. That says there are seven teeth to the inch or seven stitches to the inch.

What am I missing or not understanding? I am new to this and I'll admit it is a little confusing to me. The fact that most if not all pricking irons come from countries who use the metric system of measurement, but then they have teeth per inch or stitch per inch measurements.

If you ask how big the teeth are most everyone gives that as a metric measurement. This is also how I see the gaps between the teeth are measured.

DavidL I'm an avid woodworker with hand tools, I sharpen all of my handsaws by hand with a file. I'm not sure how they are counted different. A five point per inch rip saw has five points per inch, the saw is stamped 5 or listed as 5PPI.

[Hi Im Joe]

I must be lost. I count seven holes from the zero line to the 1 inch line on the ruler. That would give me seven holes to fill with thread in one inch. That says there are seven teeth to the inch or seven stitches to the inch.

What am I missing or not understanding? I am new to this and I'll admit it is a little confusing to me. The fact that most if not all pricking irons come from countries who use the metric system of measurement, but then they have teeth per inch or stitch per inch measurements.

If you ask how big the teeth are most everyone gives that as a metric measurement. This is also how I see the gaps between the teeth are measured.

DavidL I'm an avid woodworker with hand tools, I sharpen all of my handsaws by hand with a file. I'm not sure how they are counted different. A five point per inch rip saw has five points per inch, the saw is stamped 5 or listed as 5PPI.

It takes two holes to make a stitch. So if you have 7 holes in a one inch span you got six stitches.