KelseyR89 Report post Posted December 25, 2014 Hello! I started leather work in February and have been hand stitching all my stuff. I really LOVE the look of it and how consistent you can get it, but it can be time consuming I got so busy with Christmas orders I actually had to have someone I know sew my stuff on their sewing machine because I just couldn't keep up. I was really excited to see what the sewing machine stitching would look like, but I was really disappointed about the quality. He just wasn't able to consistently get a straight line, and he's had 30+ years of leather experience and has used a sewing machine for such a long time I don't think it's his skill level that is the problem. But maybe it is, that's why I'm posting on here And another thing I don't like is the pressure foot leaves an indent on the leather and I just don't like that! So, my questions is - is that how all sewing machines are, or is there sewing machine that I could use to get the same consistent quality of hand stitching I'm used to? I attached a picture of my hand stitched stuff, and I'd really love a sewing machine that could get similar to that. I appreciate any input! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DANDTON Report post Posted December 25, 2014 Hi Kelsey, Yes, the cyclinder machine's stitching like handstitching very much, but if you check it carefully, you will see the difference. The stitching line is wave. The shape of the machine stitching line due to what kind of needle you use and the distance of each stitching, if you use No.23 needle, and set the distance 3.5-4mm, it like handsewing very much, but if you set the distance as 2.5-3mm, you will see it absolutely sewed by machine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ferg Report post Posted December 25, 2014 I know what you are getting at and I concur with Dandton. My next comment may rile you and some others but anyway, your hand stitching isn't all that great. Back side isn't very good at all. Your awl holes are too big for the thread you are using. Mostly due to lack of experience. Experience at doing leatherwork is very important and that means many hours of practice. Keep at it. Machine sewing gets a bad rap some times. When done properly it has a fantastic look and can outlast hand stitching. Plus, when your hands are as arthritic as mine, you will learn how to do a lot of stitching with a machine. Take samples of your leather to machine dealers. Let them show you the stitches the machine is capable of. I am sure you would be able to find one to do what you wish with the proper needles and spacing. ferg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TwinOaks Report post Posted December 25, 2014 Sewing machines shouldn't leave marks in leather except the stitches. If your friend's machine is doing that, then it is not properly adjusted (presser foot tension), or not properly set up (aggressive feet and dogs). And I've never seen a machine that couldn't sew a straight line....unless you're talking about a zig-zag machine. The machine isn't set up correctly, or maybe it's not a leather sewing machine. Or it's operator error, plain and simple. I don't mean to insult your friend, just provide some thoughts. I suggest doing some searches here on the forum for hand sewing examples by "Katsass". 100% hand sewn work, using saddle stitching methods with waxed thread and two needles. You'll see plenty of stitching that's 'as good', but very little that's done better. As far as the question "can a machine sew like hand stitching?" the short answer is NO. Sewing machines use a lock stitch or chain stitch, hand sewing typically uses a saddle stitch. The thread path is completely different, and not interchangeable. With that said, some sewing machines CAN and DO produce excellent quality stitching that is consistently tensioned, evenly spaced, and looks good. The best looking machine stitching is done by needle and awl machines, but those are not as common as they once were. Still around, just not common, as most folks use a rotary hook machine these days. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGGUNDOCTOR Report post Posted December 25, 2014 Just because someone has been doing something for a long time doesn't automatically mean perfection. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tramps Leatherworking Report post Posted December 26, 2014 I agree with Ferg --- most quality machines will produce some very nice stitches if you know how to set them up properly and have some experience operating them... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DANDTON Report post Posted December 26, 2014 I know what you are getting at and I concur with Dandton. My next comment may rile you and some others but anyway, your hand stitching isn't all that great. Back side isn't very good at all. Your awl holes are too big for the thread you are using. Mostly due to lack of experience. Experience at doing leatherwork is very important and that means many hours of practice. Keep at it. Machine sewing gets a bad rap some times. When done properly it has a fantastic look and can outlast hand stitching. Plus, when your hands are as arthritic as mine, you will learn how to do a lot of stitching with a machine. Take samples of your leather to machine dealers. Let them show you the stitches the machine is capable of. I am sure you would be able to find one to do what you wish with the proper needles and spacing. ferg Hi Ferg, Thank you very much for your honest comment especially from an old experiential leathercrafter, I think we have the same viewpoint: Sewing machine is not as Hand sewing, just "very like". I born from a sewing machine family, mother father and grandfather are old leathercrafters, but they work in factory and operate sewing machine. grandfather "play" sewing machine about 50 years as you, mother more than 20-30 years. They are skillful leather machine operators. I learn a lot from them, include repair and adjust all kinds of sewing machines sewing machine can't offer perfect "chisel holes", I will show you two pictures of what the chisel I am using, you can compare the effect with other chisels and machine holes. The reason why the machine sewing doesn't like hand sewing because lots of reason: 1, the hole shape. Sewing machine can't offer prefect hole shape as chisel, I used hundreds of needles to compare, needles from German is perfect, it likes but not perfect that chisel. 2, the thread you use. for sewing machine, you use silicone oiled thread as “nylon thread” (nylon 6.6 or 6), it is not wax thread or “flaxen wax thread”, so when you sew it on, you will see the thread will be a little loosen or tighten, I don't know if you can understand the meaning, but you if you hand stitching, you will see that. 3, you said "Machine sewing gets a bad rap some times. When done properly it has a fantastic look and can outlast hand stitching.", the reason why Machine sewing gets a bad rap some times because the coordination system of upper thread and bottom tthread, sorry for my translation, you know what they are. If you loose the upper one and fast the bottom one, you will get very smooth rap--Very,, not sometimes, but all the time. Anyhow, as a young guy, I accept your comment modestly, and Merry Xmas! Yours, Daniel Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ferg Report post Posted December 26, 2014 BIGGUNDOCTORYour right it doesn't but it sure helps! ferg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGGUNDOCTOR Report post Posted December 26, 2014 Ferg, sometimes it just means they have perfected the wrong way to do it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jwalker Report post Posted December 29, 2014 no problems with my cobra class 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KelseyR89 Report post Posted January 9, 2015 Hi Kelsey, Yes, the cyclinder machine's stitching like handstitching very much, but if you check it carefully, you will see the difference. The stitching line is wave. The shape of the machine stitching line due to what kind of needle you use and the distance of each stitching, if you use No.23 needle, and set the distance 3.5-4mm, it like handsewing very much, but if you set the distance as 2.5-3mm, you will see it absolutely sewed by machine Thanks for the response! How come the smaller distance makes it more obvious that it's done by a machine? I would think it would look more like handstitching because the distance on my hand stitched stuff is closer to the 2.5-3mm! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KelseyR89 Report post Posted January 9, 2015 Sewing machines shouldn't leave marks in leather except the stitches. If your friend's machine is doing that, then it is not properly adjusted (presser foot tension), or not properly set up (aggressive feet and dogs). And I've never seen a machine that couldn't sew a straight line....unless you're talking about a zig-zag machine. The machine isn't set up correctly, or maybe it's not a leather sewing machine. Or it's operator error, plain and simple. I don't mean to insult your friend, just provide some thoughts. I suggest doing some searches here on the forum for hand sewing examples by "Katsass". 100% hand sewn work, using saddle stitching methods with waxed thread and two needles. You'll see plenty of stitching that's 'as good', but very little that's done better. As far as the question "can a machine sew like hand stitching?" the short answer is NO. Sewing machines use a lock stitch or chain stitch, hand sewing typically uses a saddle stitch. The thread path is completely different, and not interchangeable. With that said, some sewing machines CAN and DO produce excellent quality stitching that is consistently tensioned, evenly spaced, and looks good. The best looking machine stitching is done by needle and awl machines, but those are not as common as they once were. Still around, just not common, as most folks use a rotary hook machine these days. I agree, I think it was operator error. I just iddn't think that would be it because he's had so much experience, but it sounds like he definitely had some settings that were off. Which that's good know, that makes me more open to looking at buying a sewing machine! It doesn't have to look JUUUST like hand stitching, but the closer it is the better obviously. Anyways, I'll definitely go to my local machine store and see what I can found out further. Thanks again! no problems with my cobra class 4 I've heard good things about Cobra's! I'll have to look into those Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
