Chinese patcher

[Singermania]

Quote

Its worth remembering that anything called a 'patcher' is a patcher.... not really designed for quality stitching on heavy leather work.    Yes in new machines the CB3200 would be ideal, but there are many other walking foot and compound feed machines out there that would do the job for you.

 

[Axeman]

Well, I guess I will have to stick with hand stitching for now. I am very appreciative of the advise given and You Darren are quite the stand up guy. Many machine dealers I am sure would have sold me that machine full well knowing i would be dissatisfied with its performance. You told me what I needed to hear, buy a proper machine for my task. I think I will save my pennies and make a drive to Toledo. Thanks again, Bubba the Axe man

[Darren Brosowski]

Serious machine sellers would rather point out the limitations of the machine that you think you want.

I am an engineer with marketing training and have worked in sales for most of my life and the main thing I have learned is that it costs a lot of money to attract a customer but nothing but honesty to keep them. When someone contacts me about a machine the first question I ask is "what do you want to sew" and we go from there.

Guys like Bob and Ronnie have built their business on doing this and that is the model I follow

[Martyn]

17 hours ago, Axeman said:

To be quite honest, the reason I want a machine, besides the bloodletting, is that when I punch my stitch holes with my 4prong diamond punch, the holes (backside) dont always land in my groove!!

....and you are using a groove because?

A good saddle stitch is a beautiful thing, but running it in a groove forces it to run straight and destroys it. The groove serves no practical purpose.

[Axeman]

3 hours ago, Martyn said:

....and you are using a groove because?

A good saddle stitch is a beautiful thing, but running it in a groove forces it to run straight and destroys it. The groove serves no practical purpose.

Uh... because I thought you were supposed to....and I bought a fancy tool that makes the groove. I am pretty new to leather work.

[dikman]

4 hours ago, Martyn said:

running it in a groove forces it to run straight and destroys it.

Martyn, of course, is quite right. I don't groove my holsters so I didn't even give it a thought. Not using grooves makes it simpler. Try using the machine like I said, to pre-punch the holes. If it doesn't work then use your punch. Either way do away with the Ezyawl, get the gear you need for saddlestitching and do it that way. I think you'll be pleased with the results.

(Al Stohlman's books tend to emphasize grooving so many people seem to think that it has to be used. It has its place, but not on everything).

[Martyn]

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Axeman said:

Uh... because I thought you were supposed to....and I bought a fancy tool that makes the groove. I am pretty new to leather work.

The groove just forces the stitch to run straight, so if you're not too good at stitching, it can make your work look neater, but there is a price to pay for it. A saddle stitch makes a zig-zag pattern like this....

If you run it in a groove, it flattens out the stitch. It stops it from laying naturally in a zig-zag and effectively destroys the look of the stitch. It ends up looking more like a machine stitch.

This is a good video for getting your head round saddle stitching. Like I said, it takes practice, but it's not rocket science and the result is well worth the effort. Best of all, it's a fraction of the cost of a sewing machine and the perfect solution for axe masks, knife sheathes and such.

 

Here4's another - it's a long video, but the technique is probably explained a bit better and he uses chisels to make the holes instead of an awl - which I think is an easier, albeit less traditional method.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0EL7K2NhYs

Edited October 31, 2016 by Martyn

[HobbledCobbler]

18 hours ago, Darren Brosowski said:

Leather point needles are available in 21/130 which at hand crank speed is more than enough for 138/M20 thread. Some of my 29k customers use the 21/130 needles for 138/M20 in their 29k patchers.

If you asked I would tell you that the bed of the Chinese patchers is adjustable and you could use the 134 class needle which is readily available in 22/140 leather point. Needle length is the same so no need to adjust the timing.

 

Yeah, I already figured out about the 134D on my own before I joined this group a couple of days ago. After doing a nonstop search for almost 2 weeks trying to debunk what the "manufacturers" stated couldn't be done! And losing a lot of sleep doing it.

I literally called them up and all I got was, "Oh no! You can't use a round shank needle in a system 15x1 machine! You'll destroy your machine!" "Oh, no! Don't try that, it can damage your machine!"

I am well-known to disprove that something "can't be done!" in a lot of situations but I'm not a sewing machine mechanic.

It didn't come with a manual. And I have no idea how you are supposed to "adjust the bed", whatever that means!.

Why would one need to adjust the bed if I found a needle that works????

What would adjusting the bed do for it? Carry a longer needle? That doesn't sound like it would work without also adjusting the needle bar, etc. And I'm no mechanic.

[Darren Brosowski]

3 hours ago, HobbledCobbler said:

Yeah, I already figured out about the 134D on my own before I joined this group a couple of days ago. After doing a nonstop search for almost 2 weeks trying to debunk what the "manufacturers" stated couldn't be done! And losing a lot of sleep doing it.

I literally called them up and all I got was, "Oh no! You can't use a round shank needle in a system 15x1 machine! You'll destroy your machine!" "Oh, no! Don't try that, it can damage your machine!"

I am well-known to disprove that something "can't be done!" in a lot of situations but I'm not a sewing machine mechanic.

It didn't come with a manual. And I have no idea how you are supposed to "adjust the bed", whatever that means!.

Why would one need to adjust the bed if I found a needle that works????

What would adjusting the bed do for it? Carry a longer needle? That doesn't sound like it would work without also adjusting the needle bar, etc. And I'm no mechanic.

If it works then no problem.

The needle point is pushed further to the left with the round shank so sometimes I need to move the bed - bottom arm - to bring the needle back to the right position. To do that I just loosen off the three bolts underneath, adjust then tighten the bolts up again.

I love proving people wrong too and I have sold hundreds of these machines when people in the industry laughed at me!! As they are so solid my warranty rate is virtually zero.

 

[Singermania]

You misunderstood Darren, we're not laughing at your machines we're laughing at your Hawaiian shirts.....;)