lacing up saddle skirts

[Cowboy Crafts Online]

Flipping though the High Country Cowboy Company catalog today. I got to thinking about lacing up saddle skirts. It looks like they do not have thier skirts laced together. I for one lace my skirts. Just wondering if anyone else does not lace skirts and why they do not?

Ashley

[greg gomersall]

Ashley I quit lacing mine 2 to 2 1/4 " from the back of the skirts. My last lace holes are covered by the jockeys. The reason for this is to allow lots of flex in the skirts over the horses back. Less chance of the skirts rubbing or digging a horse on the back. Greg

[bruce johnson]

Ashley,

Two ways to skin the cat. I don't know if it is a regional thing or personal preference.

First if you lace all the way, the thought is that the back skirt edges will rub on the horses back. They will if the skirts tend to flip down because you cut a straight line where they meet. By cutting a forward wedge (fuller at the back) where they meet and lace all the way, the back edge will ride up. If the rear jockeys pull down, it makes a tight closure over the back bar tips.

The other guys lace only to the end of the back bar tips, and the skirts are independent past that. Theory is that it allows freer movement. The rear jockeys cover the lacing of the skirts.

Personally, I like to lace all the way, but have them ride up. I have seen some of the open rear skirts that curl on those corners, less attractive to me.

[Cowboy Crafts Online]

Thanks for the info.

Greg are you going back down to the WRCA finals? I need to get a hold of Mark and see if he is going to have my bit finished.

Ashley

[bruce johnson]

I have had a couple of emails from folks not understanding what we are talking about. I have attached some pictures to help illustrate. On the roughout, these skirts are laced all the way to the back. One problem with doing this. If the skirts do not exactly line up at the rear, the difference of even 1/16 of an inch is noticable. On mine I cut the rear corners at about a 1" or little better radius on all my skirts whether they are square or rounded. This gives a bit of relief, and allows a small side to side difference from setting the skirts to not be as noticable.

The tooled saddle is one of mine, actually my wife's. The skirts are a bit shorter than usual, but they are laced back to the start of the curve. The rear jockeys cover them up, as Greg described. On longer skirts, the non-laced areas would show more.

Edited July 18, 2007 by bruce johnson

[mulefool]

I've done it both ways depending on what the customer wants and the type of horses. When I lace all the way I do cut the skirts so there is relief in the channel. Bruce I sure like the swivel kniFe work on the back of those skirts.

[bruce johnson]

Mulefool,

Thanks for the compliment, I like it too. It was done by my neighbor and not me. I am in a saddlemaker rich area. Probably at least 30 people within 40 miles making saddles on some level. This was a trophy saddle that I bought from my sister-in-law and resold. There was other swivel knife scrollwork on it that was good too. The cuts really dressed up this roughout. If I didn't get my price, it was going into my tackroom.

I had an email from someone asking me how much wedge to cut to raise the rear of the skirts. I checked my pattern, it has a scant 3/8" wedge from 3-1/2" in to the back edge. It can sure be overdone. I have seen some saddles that look almost like rockers. The back of the skirts sit 2" off the pads.

Just as a point of reference. I appreciate the emails, but generally if you have a question, several others do also. Don't be shy, post it to the forum and everyone can have input and benefit from the answers. Don't be afraid to start a new topic, and for sure, don't hesitate to go back and post in old topics. We won't all agree, and sure don't all do anything the same way. I just want to wake up smarter tomorrow, and this group will help.

[steve mason]

I think lacing the skirts is a personal preference kind of thing, if done properly both methods will work. As long as the back line of the skirts are cut proper and are blocked in enough they will not rub a horse's hind end. Many very good saddle makers lace all the way, and many don't lace all the way. Usually if you lace all the way you have square points on the back of the skirt tips, if you don't lace all the way usually you have rounded points. Now this is not written in stone, do whatever you like, just do it clean. Personally I like to lace most of the way, I stop lacing about an inch from the skirt edge, and have a rounded point, I do the same line on the jockeys. I like the same line on my skirts and jockeys, so I do not use a square point or a frog on my jockeys. As I mentioned before, as long as there is enough relief on the back of you skirts, either by the skirt line and blocking or by leaving the skirts split, you will not hurt a horse.

[davnasca]

Is it possible to use a frog for the skirts? I didn't cut quite enough wedge on my skirts and if I lace them they will curl down and I'm afraid it'll sore the horse. If I don't lace them, then there will be about a 3/4" gap between the two skirts at the back. I figure if I put a frog on them, I can adjust the angle to be appropriate without the huge gap. Is this something that can be done/ are there any issues with doing this? Is there another way to go about this issue short of cutting new skirts?

Thanks and sorry to drag up this old post.

[bruce johnson]

My thoughts would be to cut a new topline on the skirts and raise them up and lace. If the gap is 3/4", then if you fix them, it would take 3/8" on each side. Unless you have a pretty small shallow pattern to start with, that 3/8" shouldn't matter much. Cut a topline, reblock them to account for the raise, and go right on. My thoughts with a frog is that you might have problems with the stitching coming loose or tearing through. There is some flex on the skirts that is not there on the jockeys. How's everything else going with it?

No apologies necessary for going back to an old post either, in fact our collective thanks are in order. Having a topic all in one thread just makes it much more searchable. It is easier to have everyting in one place for future reference and new folks joining. We encourage everyone new or old to go back and add to old threads as necessary.

[davnasca]

My thoughts would be to cut a new topline on the skirts and raise them up and lace. If the gap is 3/4", then if you fix them, it would take 3/8" on each side. Unless you have a pretty small shallow pattern to start with, that 3/8" shouldn't matter much. Cut a topline, reblock them to account for the raise, and go right on. My thoughts with a frog is that you might have problems with the stitching coming loose or tearing through. There is some flex on the skirts that is not there on the jockeys. How's everything else going with it?

No apologies necessary for going back to an old post either, in fact our collective thanks are in order. Having a topic all in one thread just makes it much more searchable. It is easier to have everyting in one place for future reference and new folks joining. We encourage everyone new or old to go back and add to old threads as necessary.

Everything else is going quite well actually, I'm following the Jeremiah Watt video series and I have the gullet, cantle back, groundwork and swell cover in. I've been taking pictures all along and when I'm done I'll post.

I'm worried that if I lift and reblock the skirts, then the corners wont lay up nice in the hand hold and if I just lift the trailing end of the skirts, they wont be level with the ground. What if I made the frog out out a lighter more flexible leather? I have some nice 10 oz stuff thats pretty soft and flexible. I also remember seeing a saddle on this forum (I think, I could be completely making this up) with skirts that didn't meet behind the cantle, they were rounded. I believe they were called swallow tail skirts. Is that an option?

Thanks!

[bruce johnson]

I would recut the whole topline of the skirts including the point that goes up into the handhole. That will raise the whole skirt front to back and keep the bottoms even, then reblock them.

There are some barrel racing mother hubbard rigs that are frogged at the back, but what I see as the difference is they are shorter skirts almost tight to the bar points, and the good ones flare up across the middles. I am still more comfortable with lacing, but that may just be me.

[DianaT]

Hi all, I'm new here and this is my 1st post. So excited to find this thread...I recently bought an old Simco barrel saddle (round skirt) that I love EXCEPT the skirts are digging down into my horse's back, as described in one of these posts. As far as I can tell the bottom skirts are not laced, and the jockeys have a patch (is that what a frog is?) holding them together. That patch thing is making the skirts angle downward.

So, my question is, what if I just take that thing (please excuse my completely un-technical terminology) off? Could it be that simple? If not, is this fixable? Or would it be simpler sell this one and find a different saddle (which sounds like a huge pain and not very simple at all to me)?

Thanks so much, nice to meet you all:)

Diana

[Randy Cornelius]

I have had a couple of emails from folks not understanding what we are talking about. I have attached some pictures to help illustrate. On the roughout, these skirts are laced all the way to the back. One problem with doing this. If the skirts do not exactly line up at the rear, the difference of even 1/16 of an inch is noticable. On mine I cut the rear corners at about a 1" or little better radius on all my skirts whether they are square or rounded. This gives a bit of relief, and allows a small side to side difference from setting the skirts to not be as noticable.

The tooled saddle is one of mine, actually my wife's. The skirts are a bit shorter than usual, but they are laced back to the start of the curve. The rear jockeys cover them up, as Greg described. On longer skirts, the non-laced areas would show more.

Bruce was going through some old posts and seen this one and was wondering if you could discribe or draw a picture on how you do this type of lacing. I have been doing this and it never comes out this good looking? Could you post some kind of instructions, hole size and spacing also? I like to lace the skirts simply because when you throw the saddle on the horse your hand don't slip through the skirts and drop the saddle.. lol

Thanks Randy

Edited April 29, 2011 by Randy Cornelius