Thanks guys really appreciate the reply back. Bob appreciate the chart and will definitely check it out. Wiz if you have never heard of a #17 needle (with all your experience) that probably explains why there isn't much info out there on the net. In checking the needle package that came with the machine, it reads Schmetz , Germany, system DPX17, not sure what the word "system" stands for or mean? If it were you, would you go with the correct size thread for the #16 or the #18 needle? From what I have read about the different industrial size needles, the #17 is more for heavier fabrics, canvas etc and lt wt leathers ...the #16 more for the heavier leather. My first project is going to be to sew up a (leopard print) horse saddle pad with 1/2" foam in the center, I'm thinking the #17 needle should work fine for that...just got to figure out the correct size thread, has to be durable and strong since it will have to stand the weight of the saddle and rider for hours on the trails. Thanks again for helping a newbie out!