Move along and save or maybe take a risk

[Webicons]

Hello Folks, 

So I’ve been away for quite some time from leatherworking but the bug bit me again and this time I would like to explore shoe making in more depth than I have. 
I found this unit near me.  The owner hasn’t responded with the model number but I wanted to get your take on it and I am positive that someone here can identify it.  The asking price is a few hundred but am I throwing money at a paperweight?  My usual response is to save up and don’t buy someone else’s headache but sewing machines are a bit daunting.  I would like to ease into it.  I figure I can cobble together a brushless motor and speed reducer for this one (or even just hand spin) but are parts available and can a typical repair shop even service it?

As always, thanks for the advice! - Ed

 

[Handstitched]

@Webicons It looks similar to a 153 or 133k8 

If you are able to get in contact, see if you can try it out, if possible. Some of the more experienced  on here may help you regarding parts and servicing.  It seems to be in good condition . Not bad for a few hundred . 

HS

Edited September 11, 2023 by Handstitched

[bruce johnson]

Look fairly similar to my 17-1 except for the press foot. I like this machine a lot. My wife sews wallet interiors and thinner work like that on it. Pretty bullet proof. 

[Matt S]

It looks a lot like the 17s I have owned. Seiko is cloning it to this day as the TE and several Chinese firms too so many parts, as well as needles and bobbins, are readily available. It's about as simple a machine as will sew leather, runs very smooth and quiet. It's quite an old fashioned design so has a few issues with things like bobbin size and reluctance to climb over seams but the things just run and run. Convenient small cylinder arm.

Perhaps worth noting, it's a drop-feed-only machine without reverse. Should work with v69/tkt40 thread, might do v138/tkt20 but don't bank on it. Intended for sewing lighter leather and fabric items without too many changes of thickness. Wallet not holster. The wheel presser can be changed out for a regular foot IIRC but is better for doing rapid and smooth changes of direction. Probably was setup for closing shoe uppers. You might get some dog marks on the back, but these are often easy to deal with or hide.

From memory the shuttle driver will be pinned to the shaft so about the only timing adjustment will be needle bar height. Simple so long as nothing's damaged, a nightmare if it's banjaxed.

For a few $hundred if it turns over I'd break the seller's hand off.

[TomE]

You might enjoy Harry Rogers' book on shoe making.  It is a detailed guide. (I haven't attempted making shoes)  https://www.amazon.com/MAKING-HANDMADE-SHOES-STEP-STEP/dp/B0BM57TF35  His YouTube videos put a smile on my face.

[Webicons]

Thank you for everyone’s response!  I knew that I could count on the knowledge base here, especially when it comes to sewing machines! 
It definitely seems like a Singer 17-X and it’s comforting to know that the Seiko clone parts might fit.  
I’m going to give it a go.  If nothing look’s especially mangled then it seems that a few hundred would be worth the risk.  
I read some past posts about the 17 series and how a small amount of movement on the bottom feed may indicate a shot machine  but hopefully it’s something that can be fixed.  
I am a fairly handy guy doing a fair bit of my own machining and machinery repairs but when it comes to sewing machines I blank out looking at the innards.  More like a watch movement than anything I'm comfortable working on.  Hopefully I can learn on this unit and not bungle it up too much. 

[Webicons]

I am going to look at the machine on Wednesday.  The seller does not know anything about it nor has he ever used it. 
Is there anything I should be extra cautious about checking out? Any deal breaking conditions I should look out for? Most that I can do at this point is to eyeball the unit and make sure nothing’s cracked or obviously visually wrong (or maybe missing) .

Are seriously worn dogs a no go or can it be fixed? 
Thanks again! 

[Handstitched]

4 hours ago, Webicons said:

Is there anything I should be extra cautious about checking out?

If theres a needle in it, perhaps try a piece of scrap leather that you intend to sew, put it under the foot turn the machine  by hand and see what happens, listen for anything out of the ordinary ?  It would be good if the owner has some thread to try out,  but that might be a big ask. 

HS

[Webicons]

On 9/10/2023 at 11:52 PM, bruce johnson said:

Look fairly similar to my 17-1 except for the press foot. I like this machine a lot. My wife sews wallet interiors and thinner work like that on it. Pretty bullet proof. 

Hello Bruce - Thanks for the photo (it’s definitely worth a 1000 words).  I see the treadle mechanism that you hooked up.  Is this something that you put together or is it the original Singer mechanism? Because you have a treadle, what is the belt attached to the pulley connected to? Do you also have a servo?  
I’m going to check out the unit tonight (I thought the deal was off)! 

[Webicons]

So after a bunch of frustration dealing with Facebook Marketplace I finally picked up a machine (well two) for $150.

One is a Singer 17-41 and the other a 17-16.  The 17-41 seems to work ok while the 17-16 might need some work.  They both are eyesores as rust has started creep in but the plan is to clean them up as best I can and cannibalize the 17-16 if I need it. 
Since I will primarily be using it for shoe uppers I will need to replace the presser foot with a roller. 
It seem that I will also need to replace the throat plate (flat) with one that will work with a roller?  Does this also mean I need to replace the dogs as well? 
Is anyone familiar with this process? Can someone direct me to a source for both parts and advice? 
Again, thank you for your kind assistance to this point.  
 

[Handstitched]

$150.00 is a bargain, $75 ea , thats great  . While I can't help you with the throat plate, some pics would be good 

HS 

[Webicons]

Here are some pictures.  Now that I pretty much know that it works (more or less) I’m going to start the disassembly process so I can properly clean and repaint the machine. 

Apart from wanting to change the presser foot to a roller foot, I believe that i might be missing some part of the tensioner, a nut for the reverse function and a latch that holds onto the tensioner is broken (not sure if I need it).   I’ll be machining that piece though. 

Thanks again for the support and information! 

[Webicons]

Oh. And here’s the donor 17-16.  I took off a couple of pieces and put them on the 17-41.  Not sure if I will fix it or not.  

 

[dikman]

Sounds like a bargain for what you paid. As for re-painting, if it was me I might repaint the bottom arm as that is pretty worn but I'd leave the top half alone as it still looks good and still has the nice Singer brand on it.

[Handstitched]

The first one doesn't look too bad at all, some surface rust on the second machine, but that can be cleaned up . I quite like the ' aged' look , gives the machine a bit of character, but thats just me .

If it was me, I get them both up and running, there are advantages to having two machines. 

Well done  

HS

Edited September 21, 2023 by Handstitched

[Webicons]

Yes. The more I work with it, the more I appreciate the patina.  I’m just going to brighten up the rusted spots and call it a day. 

On a different note, I am working on dialing in the stitching. Frontside stitches are nice but the backside is questionable.  From the pictures, is this the best that I can get or do I have a lot to learn! 
 

[Burkhardt]

Shorten the stitch length will help and then see how the look. The bottom never looks as good as the top.

[Handstitched]

And maybe tighten up the top stitch a little bit, but otherwise, looks good. 

HS

[Webicons]

I have to say how convenient it is to have a sewing machine now!  After the learning curve (that I’m still going through), a machine just opens up a world of possibilities. 
Was going to toss a heavy duty tie down strap that the stitching was coming undone.  It wouldn’t be worth my time to hand sew but with this light duty machine, it made quick work of it. 
Definitely going to fix up the second machine and maybe use it for canvas work by making a small top rest. 

Thanks for the help everyone!