How to Dye Leather Black

[TroyWest]

After reading about some problems some folks were having dyeing leather black I thought I would share an effective method that you can make yourself and after dyeing it will not come out when wet . I have always hated dyeing anything black because it was so messy and this is simple and easy and I don't even mind occasionally dying a belt black for a friend anymore. This was told to me by an old saddlemaker who said many of the old black parade saddles were dyed in this manner. After trying it, I can believe it.

Ingredients:

vinegar, rusty metal....really...read on

I went to Walmart and bought a half gallon of white vineger, about a buck and a half. Went home, took the cap off and I had a bag full of rusty #3 nails and put rusty nails in that half gallon jug til the liquid came to the top. Then just put the cap back on. I tried it after about 3 days but it wasn't quite ready.After a week it was pretty good and after that it just gets stronger. Just as a side note, anything rusty will work, my brother put an old chain saw blade in his. It kinda takes on the appearance of a nasty tea. What I have done is just take a large kitchen bowl, put it in the sink, and pour in the solution. Then just take the belt and stick in one end and run it through, usually a couple of times, sometimes three.

You might think, oh man, this is ugly...ugly as a yellow yard dog...Actually I had a yellow yard dog that was quite handsome. Let's go with...ugly, ugly as an empty glass of buttermilk... cause it won't be purdy.

It will be kind of dark greyish brownish...Let it dry.. Then apply oil...It will turn the prettiest shade of black...black as the ace of spades and you can't rub the black out on your fingers. You'll really think that was way too easy!

I eventually took the nails out of my mix 'cause it kind of keeps digesting the nails, but I've had this mixed up for at least 9 months and it still seems as effective as ever. This is for veg. tan leather, like skirting so a holster maker could completely make a holster, then dip it in this solution with no problem.

The vinegar smell doesn't stay in the leather after a few days and I have had no problems applying a finish. I usually use Tan-Kote, but have applied Neat-Lac also, no problem.

Another thing I found was the leather dyed black all the way through and it did not affect the color of my thread at all, I use poly thread. I'm sure it would not affect nylon, I don't know about linen.

I recommend you mix up a batch, try it on some scrap first before a finished item. I really have had excellent success with this method. The items I have dyed black turned out really beautiful, and I don't mind dyeing anything black anymore.

Happy dyeing...not dieing..dyeing

[Randy Cornelius]

I knew there had to be a better way. I have got to try this. Does the metal have to be real rusty before you put it in?

Randy

[barra]

I will endorse Troys' method as that is also the method I use. I just use the cheapest steel wool I can find. Jam a heap in a glass coffee jar and cover with the vinegar. I did have a very nasty accident when I knocked over the jar. The black blotch annoyed me so much I just took the rest and painted the whole bench top. Wood workers also use this formular on timber. The most common term I have heard it called is Ebonising.

Barra.

Edited February 25, 2008 by barra

[Regis]

QUOTE: "It will be kind of dark greyish brownish...Let it dry.. Then apply oil...It will turn the prettiest shade of black...black as the ace of spades and you can't rub the black out on your fingers."

What do you use for oil? Neatsfoot or ???

[TroyWest]

Randy, my metal was already rusty, I never made it without it. Have you ever laid a nail on a piece of wet leather and then the leather turned black where the nail was? I'm sure the ferrous oxide in the metal leaches onto the leather and this process is simply a controlled method of that. My guess is that the nails or metal probably would not have to be. You could sure try it.

The oil I use is pure neatsfoot oil, but I experimented using my wifes vegetable oil and the effect was the same.

[Warren]

Thanks for the info, really appreciate it!

Warren

[ChuckBurrows]

A word of caution - I've been using this method - old timers in the USA called it vinegaroon - for better than 35 years and while this is a great stain there is an extra step that many folks don't use and should - that is one should neutralize, if you don't you can have problems later on with the leather disintegrating.

To neutralize I mix 3 tablespoons of baking soda in a quart of warm water (it may be best to use distilled water depending n the quality of your tap water. Once dissolved saturate the leather well and then rinse with clear water. Let dry and while still damp add a coat or two of your favorite leather oil.

Actually this is technically a reagent since the ferric acetate - the chemical name for iron mixed with vinegar which has acetic acid in it - reacts with the tannins and turns the leather black. You can also add a coat of strong brewed black tea first which will increase the tannins and help darken the reaction if need be.

Nicest part - there is absolutely NO rub off!

PS - for the iron you can use 00 or 000 steel wool - soak the steel wool in acetone first to degrease, let set for 5 minutes, then plop the steel wool in a heavy pan that has a cover - light the steel wool off with a propane torch - let burn for just a bit and then cover to put out the last of the flames. Or you can just use the steel wool after degreasing with acetone and let dry thoroughly then add to the vinegar. Using rusty iron/steel speeds the process up is all.

Edited February 25, 2008 by ChuckBurrows

[LarryB]

Thanks for sharing this. I'm going to make me some and give it a try. Sure a lot cheaper.... and easier to use like you said.

[LuisPaulo]

Hi.

I'll try this. Here I can't get good comercial dyes and blcak dye always rubs off.

Chuck, glad to see here, I'm your fan.

Just a little question : On sheaths and holsters, is there any problem on affect the metal ?

Regards from Brazil.

[barra]

A word of caution - I've been using this method - old timers in the USA called it vinegaroon - for better than 35 years and while this is a great stain there is an extra step that many folks don't use and should - that is one should neutralize, if you don't you can have problems later on with the leather disintegrating.

To neutralize I mix 3 tablespoons of baking soda in a quart of warm water (it may be best to use distilled water depending n the quality of your tap water. Once dissolved saturate the leather well and then rinse with clear water. Let dry and while still damp add a coat or two of your favorite leather oil.

Actually this is technically a reagent since the ferric acetate - the chemical name for iron mixed with vinegar which has acetic acid in it - reacts with the tannins and turns the leather black. You can also add a coat of strong brewed black tea first which will increase the tannins and help darken the reaction if need be.

Nicest part - there is absolutely NO rub off!

PS - for the iron you can use 00 or 000 steel wool - soak the steel wool in acetone first to degrease, let set for 5 minutes, then plop the steel wool in a heavy pan that has a cover - light the steel wool off with a propane torch - let burn for just a bit and then cover to put out the last of the flames. Or you can just use the steel wool after degreasing with acetone and let dry thoroughly then add to the vinegar. Using rusty iron/steel speeds the process up is all.

Good point about the neutralising Chuck. I will add just a slight word of caution. Now I realise that most are not going to use huge amounts of acetone but now that we are into the OHSA days we refer to this stuff as killa you dead chit. same as MEK we used to bath in the stuff. A lot of leather dye has acetone in it. I can not even enter one of those nail salons for the smell these days.

Barra

[Shorts]

This method sound great, I'll probably try it on the current holster. However, I'm a bit concerned with the step of adding oil after you've dyed and nuetralized to get the dark black color. Neatsfoot oil softens holster leather to the point it doesn't hold shape.

How do you go about it for holsters?

[Hedge]

Excellent tip, Troy. Works the same for rawhide. You can get various colors and tones by using teas and berry juices. I suspect

one could do a lot of experimentaion with any vegetable/fruit having a color since they all contain some acid.

[LarryB]

Well, my solution had sit awhile and I needed to dye a small item black so..... I dipped it in the vinegar 3 times and let it soak up good. then worked some oil into it. It was still gray looking so dipped it 3 times in the water and soda and I looked at it and it was black all the way threw. I really liked the color.. made it look old and no mess. Thanks for sharing this idea with us.

[dbarleather]

Great info. Can someone post a photo? I think that would help everyone to see the shade of black.

[Shorts]

Hi.

I'll try this. Here I can't get good comercial dyes and blcak dye always rubs off.

Chuck, glad to see here, I'm your fan.

Just a little question : On sheaths and holsters, is there any problem on affect the metal ?

Regards from Brazil.

In another forum I read that an unlined holster dyed with this solution can remove the blueing from guns. I would imagine neutralization after dying would help, but I do not know to what extent.

[Leerwerker]

Hi Chuck,

I asked the leather chemists once a question about Aluminum stearate in leather conditioners, and here is an extract from their answer to me (so it seems it is bets just to let the leather stay acid):

Aluminum stearate is just soap, though most would probably consider it more a grease than a soap. It combines a wax and humectant roll, but just as most leather experts warn against the use of saddle soap, I think you will quickly see that this soap really has little to offer your mix. The biggest issue with soaps and leather is that soaps are made under highly alkaline conditions, and unless that basicity (alkaline pH) is neutralized it can carry terrible consequences to the acid leather.

I hope this helps!

JOhan

A word of caution - I've been using this method - old timers in the USA called it vinegaroon - for better than 35 years and while this is a great stain there is an extra step that many folks don't use and should - that is one should neutralize, if you don't you can have problems later on with the leather disintegrating.

To neutralize I mix 3 tablespoons of baking soda in a quart of warm water (it may be best to use distilled water depending n the quality of your tap water. Once dissolved saturate the leather well and then rinse with clear water. Let dry and while still damp add a coat or two of your favorite leather oil.

.....

[whinewine]

Hi Chuck,

I asked the leather chemists once a question about Aluminum stearate in leather conditioners, and here is an extract from their answer to me (so it seems it is bets just to let the leather stay acid):

Aluminum stearate is just soap, though most would probably consider it more a grease than a soap. It combines a wax and humectant roll, but just as most leather experts warn against the use of saddle soap, I think you will quickly see that this soap really has little to offer your mix.

The biggest issue with soaps and leather is that soaps are made under highly alkaline conditions, and unless that basicity (alkaline pH) is neutralized it can carry terrible consequences to the acid leather.

Huh? I thought that a base (alkaline) neutralized an acid, according to what I remember from high school & college chemistry (which is why you neutralize the vinegar dye with baking soda)...

...but what you're saying is that a base (soap) does NOT neutralize an acid (leather) & so the base (soap) must be neutralized??? ...

I'm sorry...

I'm confused now...

Edited March 31, 2008 by whinewine

[Shorts]

Excellent tip, Troy. Works the same for rawhide. You can get various colors and tones by using teas and berry juices. I suspect

one could do a lot of experimentaion with any vegetable/fruit having a color since they all contain some acid.

I've been working on a brown dye all night. I'll post pics in the morning after the swatches dry.

[HorsehairBraider]

Huh? I thought that a base (alkaline) neutralized an acid, according to what I remember from high school & college chemistry (which is why you neutralize the vinegar dye with baking soda)...

...but what you're saying is that a base (soap) does NOT neutralize an acid (leather) & so the base (soap) must be neutralized??? ...

I'm sorry...

I'm confused now...

I don't want to speak for the chemist... but I think I get what he means. Leather "likes" an acid environment. It will perform its best in a slightly acid environment, but putting excess amounts of a base on it will caust it not to perform well and perhaps even disintegrate a little bit.

Natural fibers are like this too. Sheep wool likes a slightly acid environment; adding a capful of vinegar to the rinse water when you wash it helps it. It does *NOT* like a base environment, and that is why you must handle it so carefully when you use soap on it! If you do use soap on it you must be very careful it is not agitated or swished around in any way or it will turn to felt. Maybe some of you have felted and shrunk a sweater this way?

Plant fibers such as cotton are the exact opposite. They do *NOT* like an acid environment. Do you have a cotton T-shirt you are sick and tired of, and wish it would wear out so you could at last get rid of it? Just throw a little vinegar in your wash water. Soon it will look like someone threw battery acid on it and you can at long last consign it to the scrap pile.

[whinewine]

I don't want to speak for the chemist... but I think I get what he means. Leather "likes" an acid environment. It will perform its best in a slightly acid environment, but putting excess amounts of a base on it will caust it not to perform well and perhaps even disintegrate a little bit.

Natural fibers are like this too. Sheep wool likes a slightly acid environment; adding a capful of vinegar to the rinse water when you wash it helps it. It does *NOT* like a base environment, and that is why you must handle it so carefully when you use soap on it! If you do use soap on it you must be very careful it is not agitated or swished around in any way or it will turn to felt. Maybe some of you have felted and shrunk a sweater this way?

Plant fibers such as cotton are the exact opposite. They do *NOT* like an acid environment. Do you have a cotton T-shirt you are sick and tired of, and wish it would wear out so you could at last get rid of it? Just throw a little vinegar in your wash water. Soon it will look like someone threw battery acid on it and you can at long last consign it to the scrap pile.

Ok, that does makes sense, but I think vinegar with iron dissolved in it is too strong for the environment of the leather & must be neutralized to bring it back to the normal ph balance of the leather, whatever that may be.

As an absurd example, water is a very weak acid- to turn it into & make it a stronger acid would defeat its purposes & greatly harm the things around it that depend upon it (drinking, flushing out the body's toxins & wastes, cleaning things, allowing fish to live, etc...).

[Shorts]

Interpret:

In experimenting the last day or two, dropping in a swatch of veg tanned hide into a base solution of baking soda and water produces no visible chemical reaction.

Dropping a swatch of dyed with vinegar and water solution into a rinse of baking soda/water produces no visible chemical reaction.

Dropping a swatch dyed in vinegar into a rinse of baking soda and water produces a very visibly active chemical reaction.

[Leerwerker]

Here are some answers I got from the leather chemists when I asked them about this method of coloring leather:

1.

The black color is the reaction of Ferric salts or oxide with tannings, nice formula for leather crafts, but it is a pain in the neck in vegetable tannery.

2.

First: this is not a dye is an iron (ferric) salt.

Second: The leather may be damaged by the excess of acid: white vinegar is acetic acid and if applied in excess can give some problem according to what was stated in the post. Iron react with vegetable tannins giving a product that is black.

Neutralizing the leather is not wrong. In the industrial process this is also being used even though the term is confusing because it does not mean to take the leather up to the neutral pH condition or the 7.0 value. It means to neutralize some of the acid inside the leather to avoid acid damage. The final pH for vegetable leather can be around 4.0 and this is far from neutral.

3.

The process is sometimes used to make black leather through a process called striking. In fact, I believe there is a commerical product called Striker.

David used the process commercially back in Colombia. I still have the black leather hat that he gave me from this type of leather.

4.

You are right, I also used them in Colombia in order to save some money on dyes,on heavy veg retannage we used ferrous sulphate to create a nice black color all thru the cut replacing the expensive colored veg extracts "unitones". Other strikers used were copper sulphate, ferric chloride and titanium potasium oxalate ( for brown shades) an adittional advantage was the capacity of strykers to mordent the dyes uniform on veg retan or veg leather making a little better "coverage" if the word is correct of the defects as scratches, at least they were less evident. Limitation obviously was the necessity of veg extracts to create the complete system.

SO, it seems the best pH for leather is 4 - quite acid!

Hope this helps!

JOhan

[Shorts]

Thanks Johan, good info. (My use of the word "dye" was not in reference to the black solution)

My idea on my above observations was that the acceptable level of acidity in leather alone was not going to be reduced by putting it in a baking soda bath. Is that a relatively safe statement for the intensive purposes here?

[Leerwerker]

Thanks Johan, good info. (My use of the word "dye" was not in reference to the black solution)

LOL - When I put the word dye in 'dye' quotes, the one chemist guy did not see the tongue in cheek quotes! Of course I know it's not real dye, but he had to point that out to me!

My idea on my above observations was that the acceptable level of acidity in leather alone was not going to be reduced by putting it in a baking soda bath. Is that a relatively safe statement for the intensive purposes here?

I would want to caution on the side of acidity, but I must also admit that even my college chemistry is now getting to be more that three decades old ....!

[sodapop]

i guess what i would like to know since some of it went over my head...

all in all is this a safe method for the leather??

and if i understand it right...

1st dip in the dyeing mixture

2nd essentually rinse/neutralize in the baking soda solution

3rd let dry then apply oil etc??

is it after you apply the oil that brings out the black basically??

thanks

darryl