How do you keep your workshop warm?

[UKRay]

The time has come to expand my workspace. It only seems a few minutes ago that I moved into a huge space but now it is overflowing and I need more room. I'm planning to erect a timber frame building in my yard but have concerns about heating it in the winter. I know that many of you guys have amazing workspaces in some pretty wild places but how do you keep them warm enough to work and still manage to pay the heating bills?

Do you rely on good insulation? What sort of heater do you have? Have you designed your building to conserve heat? What did you do?

Any suggestions before I start building would be very helpful and I thank you for your time.

Ray

[TwinOaks]

Depending on your budget, you might consider geothermal heating and cooling. The ground (deep) stays at a fairly constant temperature year round. One way to do it is to install pipes fairly deeply, at least 15 meters, then route the pipes through the internal walls/floor of your structure. Once that is done, it's simply a matter of circulation. In the winter, the ground (and piped water) is warmer than ambient air temp, and in the summer it's cooler. After the initial installation, you essentially only have to pay for the power to run a pump. It's on a closed circuit (same water keeps going around and 'round). I don't think you'd have a balmy 80 degrees or any such, but mid to upper 60s (F) doesn't seem too outlandish.

Likewise in the summer, it wouldn't be the same as an AC, but it'd be a good start.

[rhall]

As the cost of heating/cooling increases every year, you should spend some up front $ on good windows/doors and plenty of insulation.My walls are R19 and the cealling is R38 so it takes very little energy to keep it comfy.Upright Freezer running and lighting seems to keep it livable in Winter,but if Humidity is High (Wash.DC) then I turn on the wall unit for cooling.The 6" walls ,2x6 on 24" centers are cheaper to build ,so it makes perfect sense to plan it that way.I took a solar energy course in college and about half the time was devoted to Insulation Tech.Good Luck on Your expansion!

[rhall]

TwinOaks makes a good point, but those systems can be pricey.here in maryland our Ground temp stays at about 58f below the frost line(36") So if you used closed loop tech you would only be raising the temp from that baseline to livable room temp of say 70f.A ground loop heat exchanger/heat pump cuold prove effective but there is no sub for a good insulating package!

[wildrose]

I have a Vornado space heater. Among space heaters, it's not cheap, but it's the best!

[Randy Cornelius]

I have a wall mounted 100% effecent ventless propane furnace. It does a very nice job heating my 20 X 30 work shop. Even during the coldest times here in Kansas I never turned it up above the #2 setting.

For around 200.00 I am very pleased with it. I have some ceiling fans to move the air around and could not ask for more.

Randy

[TwinOaks]

Appologies, y'all, I forgot to mention the insulation.....Yes, there should definitely be insulation in the exterior walls, the windows, and the ceiling/roof.

I've been surfing a bit, and looking at vertical wind turbines....hmmm. It isn't hard to use pulleys (use your SR2 in reverse!!!) to increase your speed, and run to an automobile alternator. Then all you'd need is a 12V DC pump, and some 12V DC LED lights, and you'd have the lighting, heating, and cooling for the shop taken care of....as long as the wind blows. Of course, I guess it'd possible to attach a treadle to the generator..........

As far as keeping MY shop warm.....well, I don't have one. I use the dining room table, and that keeps my wife steamed enough that I don't worry about additional heat.

Edited July 12, 2009 by TwinOaks

[tonyc1]

I use bottled gas and a fan assisted gas heater. My workshop is 52' x 16' and running it on the low setting keeps it warm enough to work in most of the time. It has a 12 hour timer if I need it to come on early. My ritual of a morning is to turn the heater on then read the paper and do the crossword and then when I go to begin work it is nice and warm!

Gas is good as one of my customers delivers it when I need it.

Tony.

Edited July 12, 2009 by tonyc1

[jbird]

We'll Ray

i think that a guy should insulate very well makes a huge difference, and Windows wow huge, then for heating I think all the ideas would work just fine but remeber that you can't have it all

there are ups and downs to each one so choose wisely good luck and don't use body heat LOL.

Josh

[celticleather]

Ray

Obviously insulation - walls, roof and floor (if possible!) - is important to preserve whatever heating you do utilise.

I use a portable Super-Ser Calor gas heater. The heat is instant, controllable, and I particularly like the fact that it is pay-as-you-go . . . no shocks when the gas bill arrives!

I bought it from http://www.tgsindustrial.co.uk/, and incidentally, they also sell cast iron gas rings (see Heating Creasers thread).

Terry

[rickybobby]

Ray,

You could move to Phoenix Az. It's 110'f right now and it cools down to 95'f in the evening!! lol!!!

Insulation is a great investment and will keep your heat in and the cold out. Also dual pane windows, spend the extra $$$ up front to save later on!!

Rick Jorgenson

[Deb59]

Hi UKRay - We purchased a used wood pellet stove for my husband's 30 x 30 shop that he uses in the winter. He is not finished insulating yet but it kept it pretty comfortable. I don't know if those are available in the UK or not. - Deb

[UKRay]

Thanks for all the suggestions, guys. The insulation is a given. I've planned to build 6 inch thick walls and they will be stuffed with it. The ceiling too. I hadn't thought about the floor so thanks for that, Terry.

I couldn't find a Vornado in the UK, Holly. With a 240 volt mains supply I guess I'll have to pass on that one.

Ground source heating is a bit above my budget right now Mike - but maybe the next workshop will have it... great idea though!

The interesting thing was that nobody mentioned wood burning stoves... Is there any reason why you don't use them?

I like the idea of instant gas heating - your wall mounted furnace sounds interesting, Randy, and I hadn't thought about fans to move the air around.

52' x 15' eh? That isn't a workshop, Tony. It is a hanger... but I wish mine was going to be as big!

Although the wood pellets are very attractive, I don't have a source of supply locally so I think gas is probably the best option for me - I'd be interested to hear the downside of the gas heating story - what about drying out leather? Does bottled gas give off a lot of moisture? How about the danger from naked flames in a dye shop? Anyone had a problem with any of these?

Ray

[tonyc1]

I was going to put a wood heater in originally but they take up too much room. The worst thing about wood heaters is you can't turn them off instantly, they keep warm for ages!

52' x 16' may sound large but I wish I had made it twice as wide. You can never have too much room!!!

Tony.

[Randy Cornelius]

The reason I did not go with wood heat is that I did not want my leather smelling like wood smoke. The open flame with a wall gas heater is an issue, I just turn it off when I get the glue out. I have not had any problems.

Randy

[Double U Leather]

Ray,

Here in Colorado, I use a basic propane heater combined with an electric space heater. My shop is only about 10' X 20' at the most. The third element I use if it's really cold and I have work to do out there is the trusty Carhart method. However, Carhart's can be quite binding and cumbersome, so it makes tooling far more difficult!!

That's it.....I've just stumbled onto something. If I tool a project that doesn't turn out right, I'll say it was because I was wearing my Carhart's!! Kinda like when I play golf....I always try to play on a windy day so I have an excuse for why the ball doesn't got where it's supposed to.

[wildrose]

An alternative to wood logs is to get a pellet stove. (My dad's in the business) They burn wood pellets, the smell isn't as strong as logs, and it's very efficient.

[jbird]

Have you thought of a unit like this http://www.heatersunlimited.com/item395036.ctlg

I built homes a couple years back with my buddy and we used these in the garage they work good.

Josh

ps here's a propane one as well. http://www.heatershop.com/mrheater_propane...er_mhu45lp.html

Edited July 13, 2009 by jbird

[bluebeard]

If one does not mind going out in the woods and getting fire wood then I would make a small building a short ways from your home/shop. In it would be a wood fired boiler . The hot water would be used for your heat and your domestic use.

I'm living in Australia for a time But Iv seen it done in my home town where we get a good amount of snow and its cold.

When I get back home I will use this type of heating...And as they say when using wood, it heats twice , once when you are out in the woods getting it and then at home when you burn it..

Bluebeard

[gary]

UKRay, Deb and Wildrose,

Wood pellet stoves are becoming more fashionable here at the moment and you can get enclosed ones so smoke shouldn't be a problem. I also think that, in the UK, as there's a trend for ecologically sound building practices that there may be some Government financial incentive or assistance (direct or indirect) if you buy/use one. We were/are looking at getting one and there's a massive amount of choice; open, enclosed, hideous and quite tasteful designs, automatic feeding systems, and so on.

My brother-in-law's company has just bought one for heating a very large church and accommodation/office complex and he reckons it's pretty effective.

Round here (where there are a lot of trees) the wood pellets are produced at the local sawmill and they deliver but in huge amounts (tons rather than sacks).

Bluebeard - Wood heats three times if you collect big bits 'cos you have to cut them up to get them stove-sized.

My solution in my new workshop (12' by 24') so far is insulated walls and double-glazed windows (cheap as the supplier had made them the wrong size for a job and wanted to get rid of them and my workshop's made of wood so you can make the apertures fit the windows). I have a portable LPG heater if needed. Mind you, it hasn't been through a winter yet so I may find a few shortfalls. It's at the end of our stable block so one wall is insulated with bales of hay as it backs onto the feed room and I'm sure the warmth from the horses helps at night. The drawback is the faint whiff of ammonia and dung - but hell, you can't have everything.

Gary

Reason for edit: To point out that the ammonia and dung smells come from the horses.

Edited July 15, 2009 by gary

[Shorts]

Ray,

You could move to Phoenix Az. It's 110'f right now and it cools down to 95'f in the evening!! lol!!!

Insulation is a great investment and will keep your heat in and the cold out. Also dual pane windows, spend the extra $$$ up front to save later on!!

Rick Jorgenson

I was going to suggest Texas. We're on a streak of +100* days.

Anything over 98 is just splitting hairs

[UKRay]

No danger of me moving to Texas anytime soon. Tn maybe.... I'd definitely like to visit though. What is Fort Worth really like?

Right now I'm in design and build mode. I have been looking for a source of those wood pellets here in Shropshire but can't find a single supplier. They sound like they could be the ideal solution as long as they are cheap enough. Apparently you can build a kind of hopper on the end of your building so you never need go outside to get fuel. Now that sounds like my ideal arrangement!

You can't turn the fire off when you are glueing though... Hmmmm, more thought needed here.

Ray

I was going to suggest Texas. We're on a streak of +100* days.

Anything over 98 is just splitting hairs

[celticleather]

I have been looking for a source of those wood pellets here in Shropshire but can't find a single supplier.

Ray

I bet these people would know where to get the pellets locally: http://www.clearviewstoves.com/wheretobuy.htm.

They must be practically on your doorstep!

Terry

[gary]

Ray,

You can also try http://www.bsw.co.uk/ as they are a big supplier and have sawmills all over the place.

Gary

[TroyS]

Move your shop to Florida! It's HOT here! Heat index of 102 yesterday!

(sorry, couldn't resist)