LW and IE

[CitizenKate]

We are very appreciative and grateful that most of you have been very supportive of our efforts to improve this site. However, I am seeing a few posts in regards to the upgrade that are not especially constructive, to say the least. We do understand the frustration, and anticipate there is going to be a little venting as we sort through things and get things running normally again. That is to be expected during any kind of major upgrade. Although it is understandable, it is not especially useful in helping us sort out the problems.

Suffice it to say, we are well aware of the problem with Internet Explorer while visiting this site. We have confirmed the issue, are able to replicate it, and ARE GIVING THIS FIRST PRIORITY UNTIL THE PROBLEM IS 100% RESOLVED.

I have also become aware of some astonishingly harsh and presumptuous messages that a few people have sent to Johanna, demanding immediate resolution of the problems we are experiencing. I'm not going to call out anyone publicly, but may I take this opportunity to point something out:

This site, and everything in it, is here because of a mountain of blood, sweat, and tears put forth by Johanna and the rest of us over a number of years. She was up all night Sunday, babysitting the server as it worked to complete the upgrade. To date, neither she nor any of us gets paid to build and maintain this site that so many of you (and we as well) now enjoy at no charge. She is not some corporate executive sitting up in an ivory tower, impervious to the needs of this community. She does understand how vital a part of your businesses LeatherWorker has become to many of you, and does not take it lightly. The changes we are making now are the culmination of years of listening to members' feedback about the site, and what we can do to better meet their needs.

This would not be the growing, thriving community it is if Johanna didn't listen to your feedback. But we cannot continue to grow without having to make changes occasionally. You all owe Johanna as much patience and encouragement as you can muster as she leads us through this process. You all have something to gain.

So play nice, people - we'll get through this!

Peace out,

Kate

[frontpost]

I think you ladies have done a fine job, and this site is second to none. I use Mozilla, so I have no issues. Please keep up the good work.

[TimKleffner]

Kate,

Thank you very much for the posting and have seen my fair share of whiners. I'm fully aware of all the work that goes into this project upgrade.

Keep up the good work both you

TimKleffner

[Tkleather1]

I too apologize if any of my comments were taken that way I was jsut trying to point out some of the issues that "I" have had and meant in no way that you guys were not doing a fantastic job, because you are doing a great job. I like the new layout and will like it even more when all of your hard work is complete.

[King's X]

Props to the LW crew, especially Johanna. I am drinking a cold one and have just placed a fresh one right next to mine for you Johanna. Sidenote: I hear the local grocery store has a sale on ground beef for repacking that @#& after that @#$ chewing.

Be patience. I am sorry that "harsh" comments have been received by the Leather Lady, but I just think that some people "think" negatively, some "speak" negatively and some just don't really give a hoot. But we all love you!!

Can we all just get along?

[Bree]

I have been away for awhile and today is the first time that I saw the new site. I don't even know when it deployed to production. My first reaction was surprise and then a mixture of both good and some bad feelings about the site design.

I am an experienced, professional webmaster working for IBM so I know something about website design. It does not surprise me that some people would react strongly... some positive and and some in a negative way. Don't take it personally. Pay close attention to your clients. They are the lifeblood of the site. Their wants and needs are extremely important. If you listen and keep improving a little bit all the time, you can't go wrong.

As far as the developers and admins go... there is no doubt that this is a big job done primarily out of love. Every now and then the subscribers need to be reminded that this is basically volunteer work and more thanks is needed than criticism. No one likes thier work criticized especially when it is given gratis or for low return.

Still anytime you put work into the public forum you are exposed to the risk of criticism. That is the nature of the beast. Fact is that crtique and dialectic are what drive innovation and improvement. We just need to keep it balanced, focused, and constructive.

I won't go into the things that I find positive or negative in this post. You can email me and I would share my thoughts privately if desired. I will say that you folks have the best resource for the Leatherworker on the Net. You can be proud of it! And you deserve a strong THANK YOU!! from each and every one of the subscribers. You have my THANK YOU! Keep up the good work. But keep listening and improving too! Then everyone wins.

[whinewine]

I likewise also apologize; I came in from a show on a long, hot day & couldn't even get into lwn [permission denied], so i couldn't even read any posts about this whole thing happening (I got up for the show at 4:30am & didn't check the site before I left). Next day all I saw was blue/grey. I still don't particularly care for it [yet], for numerous reasons, but I have never demanded that anyone go back to the old ways. If anyone took my venting [& that's all it was- frustration & venting] as a personal attack on anyone, please- it was just venting & frustration over familiarity of what I knew in the old system vs the unfamiliarity of the new system . Johanna, Kate, everyone involved in this: I meant no harm! (I have a very good command of the language, & I can/have (all too often) hurt with a word- it's my 'superpower', & in this instance, I used it for evil, not for good).

Mea culpa.

russ

[iwannabeacowboy]

I'm running with IE and the only issue i'm having is it's really slow.

Charlie

[Johanna]

No offense at all taken, guys! No one wants this board to be down, least of all me. I'm grateful for the feedback from all of you, and the help coming from all sorts of unexpected places. I'm thankful to Kate for her patience and diligence. With some hard work and a little luck, soon we'll have a new and improved board with some better security features and a few bells and whistles to keep you all entertained. Thank you for your patience- I won't quit until I get everything in order for you all. Keep the comments coming- good and bad, so we can make better decisions for YOUR board.

Johanna

[CitizenKate]

Hey guys, it was not taken personally at all, and no apologies are necessary. As I stated in my original post, we DO need to know what you are experiencing (good, bad, or otherwise), and the more factual details you can provide us, the more helpful it is. It's understandable people are going to vent... but while it may help you feel better, it really doesn't solve anything.

I get the impression that some of you are concerned that we're going to just shrug off the issues and allow it to continue running this way. Please rest assured this is not what we consider "normal" operation, and we have no intention of allowing it to continue running this way. Many of you have provided very useful feedback in helping us document the problems and send them to the developers of this forum system for resolution, and progress is being made by the hour. Thanks for your assistance!

Cheers,

Kate

[whinewine]

Hey guys, it was not taken personally at all, and no apologies are necessary. As I stated in my original post, we DO need to know what you are experiencing (good, bad, or otherwise), and the more factual details you can provide us, the more helpful it is. It's understandable people are going to vent... but while it may help you feel better, it really doesn't solve anything.

I get the impression that some of you are concerned that we're going to just shrug off the issues and allow it to continue running this way. Please rest assured this is not what we consider "normal" operation, and we have no intention of allowing it to continue running this way. Many of you have provided very useful feedback in helping us document the problems and send them to the developers of this forum system for resolution, and progress is being made by the hour. Thanks for your assistance!

Cheers,

Kate

One of the problems I am still experiencing is that I need to sign in each & every time I reenter the site. most of the time I forget. This is annoying (& yes, I haven't deleted my cookies). It is also still very slow in comparison to what was, even on FF3. I haven't tried to enter from the browser I use for everything else (I don't even know what it is- it's through my msn/dsl connection).The last time I tried, everything locked up.There are other things i don't like (yet), but I'm hoping to, whenever the bugs are worked out. So far, I'm not impressed,(& I see no new features that I can particularly use yet, or any that particularly wow me), but I'm trying to be positive. So I'll just shut my mouth & exhibit some well needed patience & wait.

russ

[rdb]

All I see is the great potential of the new software. It has all the things I've been hoping for, with the promise of even more. The buggaboos will get fixed, and this too will be forgotten with a little time. Look how many people here don't even know about the "Big Crash"

IE seems to be the big problem, but that's understandable. Microsoft has always tried to bully its way into being THE standard, while the rest of the world developed a cooperative standard. MS just doesn't play well with others. Teacher Parent conference will be necessary...lol.

The feed back from users here has, I'm sure greatly helped J&K and the others to make this work, and they've done a helluva job, right in front of everyone, not behind super closed doors. That takes guts, I tell u.

There are a lot of people who don't like change. It works for me! Why fix it. I really do understand their feelings, but change is the most basic of human development. Some do get left behind. Others get mad and go elsewhere, but the majority work with what they have. Whether that's good or bad, I can't say. I'm just hoping we don't lose a single User. We all need each other more than we know.

I still consider this forum, to be an historical part of Leather Working. The Guild of all Guilds. It's definitely not something I thought I'ld ever see.

Meanwhile, when I click "view new posts" the first time comes up "no new posts". If i click again, up comes the new posts. I happens quite often (this is on firefox 3.5.2).

Speed has definitely increased. Page loads take a few time units longer than they used to, but I think the adverts loading has more to do with it than anything else. A few milliseconds is not that important to me, especially if it helps pay the bills, and informs the leatherworker of new potentials.

Thanx Johanna, and everyone else who have worked so hard!

[jbird]

ok Kate you rock and you tell it I back you 100%.

you both have done a great job thanks.

Josh