bluebeard Report post Posted September 30, 2009 Hey mates, Iv gone thru what iv thought is every leather braidding site on the web. Iv gone thru the whole braidding list on this site . I just would like to learn how to tie a" Button knot, stopper knot,or what ever the hell its called and how to back braid.. This is done on a herringbone 8 strand braid.. Really, Iv looked on the web for hours and searching images and sites And i have not found how to do this.. the pic shows what i want to make.. Iv got the Plating just fine, not so the button knot or the back braiding...The other knot a small turks head i think.. I think iv said that enough ways for some one to help me out... Thank you Bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maeve Report post Posted September 30, 2009 I don't see any back braiding on this bracelet so I am not sure what you are asking. Sorry! The way that this one is started is with 4 strings 4-plaited in the center then folded over to an 8 plait. The button is unique .... I think John does this one and the name evades me at the moment .... but you can do a gaucho, herringbone or whatever over a terminal knot. Is that what you need to know? How to do the terminal knot under the button? I have photographs documenting an 8-plait back braid if you want to see how *I* do it. Let me know and I'll post them for you (later this week, I'm afraid). Sheesh ... I feel like I didn't answer a thing! M Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted September 30, 2009 I don't see any back braiding on this bracelet so I am not sure what you are asking. Sorry! The way that this one is started is with 4 strings 4-plaited in the center then folded over to an 8 plait. The button is unique .... I think John does this one and the name evades me at the moment .... but you can do a gaucho, herringbone or whatever over a terminal knot. Is that what you need to know? How to do the terminal knot under the button? I have photographs documenting an 8-plait back braid if you want to see how *I* do it. Let me know and I'll post them for you (later this week, I'm afraid). Sheesh ... I feel like I didn't answer a thing! M Hey mate, Thanks for that. I guess after you said two fours to eight and new that I new this.. AS for the end knot I don't care how its made ,just as long as it looks like the one in the pic..Bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted September 30, 2009 (edited) The button knot is a Ginifer knot. I don't think you looked everywhere on the net for it. Here is a tutorial on that specific knot, Ginfer Knot Tutorial Brian... Edited September 30, 2009 by KnotHead Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted September 30, 2009 Hey mates.. ( great aussie word, I love it,..)is there a tutorial for this braclet some where...I live in aussie land.. I would like to sell them on the esplanade on sunshine coast..( ocean front)I am out of work and it seems no one needs a old pegleg pirate around.. Iv made a jig that gos on my pegleg, It holds my wares and makes my braiding platform... I will show pics when I can.. Im trying to find things that look good to me and i would like to make.. Bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rgerbitz Report post Posted September 30, 2009 If you are going to be doing much braiding I would recommend buying the book Encyclpedia of Rawhide and Leather Braiding. In it you will find all you need to make most any kind of braided gear. What you are showing here as a braclet is how some of us make what is called a San juan style hondo. You start in the middle of 4 strings and make about an inch of a 4 plait braid. You then make a loop and braided an 8 plait as long as is needed. Then thread every thing through the loop you previously made and tie some sort of terminal knot. Which you can cover with any variation of a turks head knot. If none of this is clear, buy the book. Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LBbyJ Report post Posted October 1, 2009 Hi BlueBeard, thanks for posting a picture of my bracelet to the board, I usually don't show off to much. The Bracelet is an 8 strand Gaucho braid over a 3 or 4 mm core and the end knot is a Aztec Button knot over a terminal knot. There isn't any back braiding to the bracelet I just use 4 strands to make the hoop (4 strand braid) and then bring them together for the 8 strand braid. The knots (and the braid) are from the Bruce Grant Encyclopedia mentioned above and the other knot by the hoop is a Gaucho knot. For your other pictures they look like a turks head knot or interwoven turks head knot. I believe it maybe possible to tie the end knots from the strands being braided but it is easier to use a separate strand to make the knot just use a terminal knot to end the braid and that'll give the cover knot something to bite on to so it won't fall off. Drop me a note if you have more questions, john Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rawhide1 Report post Posted October 1, 2009 (edited) bluebeard I agree about the book mentioned as being a great source to have if ya plan on doing any braiding. But if ya don't have the money to buy the book and ya don't understand something by all means ask until ya do. It wasn't that long ago that I had to keep asking questions to finally figure something out. And I know there's other folks on here who have done the same that's what this place is all about. So if I can help I will as will others. Keep after it and you'll get it. Mike Edited October 1, 2009 by rawhide1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted October 1, 2009 (edited) By the powers invested in me I now pronunce you 8 strand braid to become a terminal knot. O,, It didn't become a terminal knot. Damn, I wonder why Knot..So then how does it become a terminal knot. On this site I read that any# of strands can be made into a terminal knot. I can put a wall and crown on a 5part 4 bight braid..I can also stand on my head sometimes..But I can't tie it on a 8 plait..I know its done.. I see many examples of it on this site..Or rather ,I see what covers them , pineapple knots and turksheads..The book I do have I eventually get whats being shown..I tryed to tie the 5part 4bight turkshead over and over and.. lots.. finally I could see what I was looking for and now I tie very well..Anyway, I guess its one knot at a time...So apart from magic which i have none of, Hows one tie a terminal knot in a 8part herringbone braid.. P.S. this is my new roo stamp.. Bluebeard roo coming home6.bmp roo coming home6.bmp Edited October 1, 2009 by bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rgerbitz Report post Posted October 2, 2009 With what you are trying to build in making the wall or crown knot I would select only 4 strands of the 8 braid to make the knot you can use all of them but it seems to be a bit diffecult to get everything pulled down nice. Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted October 5, 2009 Thank you all for the help given. Good folks.. John, Im sorry that I used a pic of yours.. My apologies..I was just so impressed that i had to make one.. Thanks again... bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rawhide1 Report post Posted October 6, 2009 greybeard I don't know if this will help but here are a few pictures of a bracelet I'm working on. The first picture is of me crowning the the four strands. I know your using eight so just pick four strands to crown and and build your crown around the other four. Or you could double your strands when you crown them. But as Rob said it gets kinda of hard to get the knot pulled down tight plus you'll have a bigger knot to cover. The second picture shows the four strands crowned and pulled down. The third picture shows me covering the crown with a turks head out of roo. I will then cover this with a pineapple knot out of rawhide. But there are several knots you could use to cover the turks head. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted October 7, 2009 (edited) hey mate , thank you for that.. Iv got a handle on the wall and crown 4 strand and the 5 strand 4 bight turks head.. Iv tried twice now to tie a gaucho knot from a 7 strand 6 bight turks head but i get just about there and things don't seem to line up.. Mybe on my third try all get it.. It makes me wonder how these knots were thought of in the first place.. Thanks again.. Bluebeard(rawhide1, you are right to say graybeard because it quickly becoming that...) Edited October 7, 2009 by bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rawhide1 Report post Posted October 7, 2009 hey mate , thank you for that.. Iv got a handle on the wall and crown 4 strand and the 5 strand 4 bight turks head.. Iv tried twice now to tie a gaucho knot from a 7 strand 6 bight turks head but i get just about there and things don't seem to line up.. Mybe on my third try all get it.. It makes me wonder how these knots were thought of in the first place.. Thanks again.. Bluebeard(rawhide1, you are right to say graybeard because it quickly becoming that...) bluebeard No problem and I do apologize for getting your handle wrong. I must of had one of those moments that my wife calls having my head in my butt!! Good luck to ya. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alan Bell Report post Posted October 7, 2009 I don't know if this is necessary but I wanted to mention that Rawhide1 said he was crowning when in fact he was wall and crowning. They call it that because it flows off the tongue better but you actually crown then wall in order for the strands to come out going up. To crown you are crossing over the each adjacent strand and to wall you are going up between the cross you made in crowning. Vaya con Dios, Alan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rawhide1 Report post Posted October 7, 2009 I apologize for any confusion I may have caused by my miss use of terminology. Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KnotHead Report post Posted October 7, 2009 hey mate , thank you for that.. Iv got a handle on the wall and crown 4 strand and the 5 strand 4 bight turks head.. Iv tried twice now to tie a gaucho knot from a 7 strand 6 bight turks head but i get just about there and things don't seem to line up.. Mybe on my third try all get it.. It makes me wonder how these knots were thought of in the first place.. Thanks again.. Bluebeard(rawhide1, you are right to say graybeard because it quickly becoming that...) Why not start learning the Gaucho by first doing it from a 5part 4bight turks head first. Make your 5part 4bight base turks head first. I have the instructions here, Gaucho Knot - From a 5x4TH My friend and colleague whom is now passed away make this tutorial. In post #13 above; I don't quite understand the reason behind making a few 5x4 turks heads and then bumping them against the terminal knots. I'm having an absent minded moment and just wondering why is all. Brian... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rcsaddles Report post Posted October 7, 2009 Glad to see there is another aspiring braider out there. As much as I love my Bruce Grant book, IMHO, the Ron Edwards books are easier to understand adn follow. You should be able to find them almost anywhere in Australia. Also check out the Australian whipmakers and plaiters assoiation web site. Good info there also. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bluebeard Report post Posted October 8, 2009 Welllll boys, where are we at... O yea ,,THs..Actully the fisrt TH I learned to tie was a 5part 4bight.. Mind you that was after trying to tie it at least, no less than 50 times, no joke..sad testamony to my brain power.. still, it could have taken 100,,So, the reason I started this thread was to learn how to tie a button knot.As I was looking thru Bruce Grants book, "leather braiding" there it was, how to tie a Pineapple or Gaucho button knot.. As mister Grant said ,, "If tightened around a small spherical core it makes a beautiful button knot.. ahaaah ,button knot, thats the knot for me..Mister Grant starts with a skeleton knot(TH) of 5part 4bight ... He then raises it to a 7part 6bight TH and then gos on to show how to make the GBN..Im able to go from the5/4 to the7/6 ..I then work my way up to around step 11 or 12 and then.. bang-go.. what im supposed to be looking for is knot there... I do know that at some point i will prevail.. It's just a matter of knowing what to look for... As for the 5/4 TH up against the terminal knot.. they where on a knive lanyard that I saw and liked so thats how I did it.. Thank you all for your comments.. In many ways its a great world we live in, folks to talk to, things to do,,Still, in many ways its going to hell fast..signs of the times "A" (canadan thing,,,"A") anyway,May God bless you all and to all a goodnight...or morning, where ever you may be....(down under its goodnight) Bluebeard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
