question about covering stirrups

[Duke]

ok so in my quest to build up my skills enough so that I can begin to make a saddle, I am starting small. going to be covering a set of stirrups. the stirrups are wood, wrapped on the outside with metal, and has a carriage bolt through the top, with a pipe as a spacer. my question is this: what is the ideal weight leather to use? is lighter leather better? I'm not going to be tooling the stirrups, as I will be making a set of tapaderos to go over them, so I dont need heavier leather. pros and cons of light weight leather? any and all suggestions on this would be taken to heart. thanks in advance to all who respond.

[greg gomersall]

ok so in my quest to build up my skills enough so that I can begin to make a saddle, I am starting small. going to be covering a set of stirrups. the stirrups are wood, wrapped on the outside with metal, and has a carriage bolt through the top, with a pipe as a spacer. my question is this: what is the ideal weight leather to use? is lighter leather better? I'm not going to be tooling the stirrups, as I will be making a set of tapaderos to go over them, so I dont need heavier leather. pros and cons of light weight leather? any and all suggestions on this would be taken to heart. thanks in advance to all who respond.

Duke if you are putting the stirrups in a set of taps why would you cover the stirrup as well? Why not just wrap the treads and use a rollar chafe? When I cover stirrups I use 9/10 oz on the outside and 7/8 oz on the liners. Greg

[Duke]

well I was worried about the metal rubbing agianst the taps and eventually wearing through it.that and it looks alot better.

[Bob]

I do the same as Greg said, 9 oz on the outside, 7-8 oz on the inside. The liners on the inside are sew to the outside wet. the outside is dry. The outside is cut to fit around the edges, except the bottom, it's about 1 inch too long, the liner is cut large and wet, like i said. Sew them together, with a bubble. You do that when sewing the second half. trim the inside liner and edge both sides now.

Use a hammer handle and push it into the top end to open it as much as possible. Some folks use glue or liquid saddle soap, put some inside. Or nothing at all. A bench mounted vise is now handy. clamp the long end of the outside piece thats dry, into the vise at the bottom. fold it over and insert the sturrip and push it in. Use a hammer to drive it on up to the top, if you don't have a vise, you'lll have to do this by hand. Trim the excess off at the bottom and push out the bubbles on the inside liner. Do the same for the other side, trim the ends off to butt together at the bottom and cover with the tread. Dip the whole thing into the water and rub the edges, use an awl to locate the bolt holes, drill it out, put in your bolt and spacer, let it dry.

Cut your threads to fit, only cut them about 1 inch long. For a better fit, use a french edger to trim a 45 degree angle off the bottom side of the tread only on the top side where the thread starts to rise, only to the edge of the stirrup, on both sides. It'll lay flat. punch holes and lace together at the bottom.

[Duke]

thanks bob, thats what I was looking for. I appreciate it. good thing I have a good imagination, hels to try to imagine what youre talking about, and try to follow along.

[Bob]

Duke, here are some pictures of work I did today. This should help you out to understand what I'm talking about. Sorry if it seems confusing.

[Bob]

Here again is another couple pictures. Tomorrow when they're finished I'll post some more pictures.

Please note, once you put the tag end in the vice and whale on it with the hammer, be gentle. It's not hard to break stirrups without the bolt in them. Espesially a small 1 inch like this. You should have a 3/8 inch seam allowance around the edge. More if you useing heavy leather, Less for thinner leather.

One more thing, if you run into troubles and the leather is too tight. Dip the whole thing into the water. It helps get things moving along.

Edited April 3, 2008 by Bob

[Duke]

oh wow!!!!!! ok, I got it now! the light bulb just came on upstairs, lol. what a huge help bob. I am in debt to you, for your generous amount of help. I will look forward to the rest of the pics. please explain how you keep the pieces from sliding off before you put the tread on, do you glue it, or nail it, or stitch it? thanks a million

[ryan]

Bob,

Thanks for posting those pics. I've often times wondered if anybody did it that way. I now feel kind of foolish for buying the stirrup plate for my adler 205. I haven't covered any stirrups with it yet but your system makes more sense. I guess I still can use my stirrup plate for holsters!!

Ryan

[Duke]

never feel foolish about buying a tool. its just one more thing that increases your ability to do something.

[D.A. Kabatoff]

Hi Duke,

guess everyone does things a bit differently... stirrups take a heck of a beating, especially for guys working around chutes, and fences and the sort. If you think Bob's explanation was hard to follow, this should give you a good laugh!

I use about 13 oz leather on the outside and 10 oz on the inside of my stirrups. I like good, tight grain leather for the outsides and the best cut you can find from the belly for the insides of the stirrups. I only handsew my stirrups cause that's the way I was taught and if you see some stirrups that have been abused for a year, you'd probably want to do the same.

I start by removing the stirrup bolt and spacer and make a paper pattern that runs from about an inch over the top of the stirrup to the middle of the bottom of the stirrup tread. You can use a couple spots of glue to hold the paper to the stirrup and then use a pair of calipers to trace the outside edge of the stirrup so that your paper pattern is about 1/4" wider all around then the stirrup. I do the same for the inside of the stirrup but I leave about 3/4" overhang all the way around. After I have my paper pattern I cut all four pieces (remember the pattern is only for half the stirrup). For the inside pieces I skive the whole edge down to about 6 oz and about 3/4" in from the edge. You will have to do a trial and error type fitting to get the stirrup bolt holes in the correct position on your inside leather pieces... if you measure carefully, you should be able to find the right spot. There are no holes on the outer leather pieces.

If your stirrups have galvanzied metal, try to rough it up a bit with 80 grit sandpaper. Start by covering the complete outside of the stirrups with glue and apply glue to your four pieces of leather... I like to let it all sit over night and really cure, then add a second coat of glue in the morning. For the inside pieces of leather, I give them a quick dunk in a bucket of water so that they have just a bit of moisture in them... I put the second coat of glue on after I have wet these two pieces. I then carefully stick on the two inside pieces, lining up the holes you punched for the stirrup bolts. If you made your paper pattern right and you apply the leather carefully, you should have about 3/4"s overhanging the edge of the stirrup all the way around. Once the insides have been applied you can put your bolt spacer (pipe) and stirrup bolt back on and secure it... just a side note, I sometimes take the stirrup bolt nuts and hold them in a pair of pliers and grind them to half their original thickness so that they don't create as much of a lump under the leather (they will be covered by the outside piece of leather). After the bolt is back on, I take a piece of leather (6 or 7 oz) about 1 1/2"s x 1 1/2"s and skive the edges paperthin. I glue this piece over the nut of the stirrup bolt so that the nut's shape will not show through the outside piece of leather. I now carefully apply one of the out side pieces of leather so that the 1/4" overhang is even all the way around the stirrup. Press down the inside piece of leather so that it sticks to the outside... this is why I wet the inside... so it will bend down the edge of the stirrup... I then use a pair of cantle pliers and press all along the edge of the stirrup so that it is glued down as tight along the edge of the stirrup is possible (I hold a thin piece scrap leather on the perimeter of the outside leather so that the cantle pliers don't leave marks on the outside piece of leather.... This is where I fault the other method of applying the leather... If the leather is loose enough to be pulled down around the stirrup, it simply will not be as tight and as permanent a fit as doing it this way (no offence meant to anyone doing it the other method). Using the cantle pliers will pull the inside, wet, softer, belly leather down creating a 90 angle where your stitching will lay.

Put the second outside piece on and you are almost ready to start handsewing... yes it will take a long time to sew these buggers but these stirrups will standup well to abuse. After all four pieces are glued down and you have pliered along the edges, you can take a stitchgroover and make a stitching groove around the perimeter of the stirrup on the outside layer of leather. I usually start my handsewing at the center of the tread and work up and around one side of the stirrup and end it in the middle. Then I do the same to the other side of the stirrup. When your sewing is done you can trim the excess overhanging leather of the inside pieces, sand the edges and run an edger all the way around the stirrup... nice touch if you burnish the edges as well.

After all this is done, I make a paper pattern for the tread. I cut the tread out of the heavy part of the neck that is a bit pulpy... this softer leather is a little easier to mold around the stirrup and the 16 - 17 oz neck will last along time... It also covers the small space in the middle of the tread (top and bottom) between your two outside pieces and your two inside pieces. I usually use rawhide lace to lace the tread together on the bottom of the stirrup.

Incidentally, I agree with Greg that covering stirrups that will have taps is a waste of time... It'll also make them extremely heavy and bulky.

Edited April 4, 2008 by D.A. Kabatoff

[bruce johnson]

I do them pretty much like Darcy with one exception. I make the inside from one piece, and the outside from one piece. No particular reason why I do them in one piece other the same reason we do a lot of stuff - that's the way I saw the first guy do them. Other than that, same basic technique as Darcy. I crimp them with cantle pliers, and use the crimp line as a guide for my stitch line groove. I want that line right next to the wood. I handsew them too for the most part. I will admit I have cheated on two pairs playing since I got the new machine. The stirrup plate from Ferdco has a really narrow left ledge. A lot thinner than some of the other ones I have seen, or had with my previous machines. It gets in there pretty tight. We'll see how it holds up.

[Duke]

awesome, thanks for the information guys. I like the look of that stirrup kabatoff, I was leaning more towards lacing up the outside of my stirrup, but the pic of yours has me wondering of I made the right decision.and bruce, what I wouldnt give for a ferdco.*drools* maybe once I start makin more money at doin this, then I can afford one. or maybe even next tax season. hhmm, theres a thought.also, about covering stirrups with taps, I was thinkin about using 3/4 oz leather, just so it doesnt look crappy. still think its a bad idea?

[D.A. Kabatoff]

Hey Bruce,

about the only reason I can see for doing them in four pieces other than two like yourself is that it's easier finding the smaller pieces in the scrap bin... other than that, it'd probably be a bit easier doing it your way.

Duke,

regardless of leather weight, I still wouldn't cover them myself, you'd be suprised at the weight of leather covered stirrups ... even light weight leather will be significant by the time you get oil and conditioner in them... If you're worried about appearance, use some nice brass bound or monel bound stirrups, that's what I use in all my taps.

Darc

[Bob]

OK well here's the promised stirrups, finished a couple weeks ago. Finally got around to posting them. These are sewn on a machine. Look at the earlier posting and see how it's done. Without a stirrup plate. 1.5 hours work into these.

[SCOUTER]

Wow! Amazing "tutorial"! Beautiful stuff! Can I ask a foolish question? Why are stirrups made this way? Is there a reason why many stirrups are not made of metal? Also- Why do so many stirrups seem a little small? I used to joke that Western boot makers designed stirrups to keep them in business! Is it that real cowboys would never wear construction boots!?

[Crystal]

Wow! Amazing "tutorial"! Beautiful stuff! Can I ask a foolish question? Why are stirrups made this way? Is there a reason why many stirrups are not made of metal? Also- Why do so many stirrups seem a little small? I used to joke that Western boot makers designed stirrups to keep them in business! Is it that real cowboys would never wear construction boots!?

Hi Scouter- You don't want to slip through the stirrup and get a leg caught up. Not a fun thing to get dragged. (Never happened to me - the drag part - but the slip part, yep, when I was a kid.) Cowboy boots have smooth soles and heels - the heels to help keep your foot from sliding through, the smooth soles to help get your foot back out. Now, the pointy toe thing with the cowboy boot - I could do without that. But I am sure there is a reason for that other than to cramp up toes. The metal? Not sure. Could be a weight issue (but there is aluminum)... don't know.

Crystal

[Duke]

being dragged by your horse has always been a fear for alot of people.that is why an invention that recently came out on the market eases some of that fear. they are breakaway stirrups, so if you do get hung up, the stirrup comes off the saddle.whoever invented that gets a blue ribbon

[bruce johnson]

Scouter,

Some stirrups are all metal, some forged iron and others aluminum. Some have a concave bottom and are called "oxbows", although oxbows can also be wood, plastic, or fiberglass. The metal ones tend to be heavy and unforgiving when they whack you in the head cinching up or the shin unsaddling. The shape of the oxbow bottom fits the curve of tha shank area of some boots. and with the foot buried to that level, will be pretty secure. Most other styles of stirrups have a flat bottom, (some with wide treads will have a cleat installed). They will fit either the flat part of the sole if you don't bury your foot, or the flat shank area on some of the "shoe sole boots" like many of the roper style boots. There are oversized stirrups available, they are called overshoe stirrups and are wider to accomodate winter footgear. Different riders prefer one style or the other, and they all can be had with different tread widths as well.

[SCOUTER]

Thanks much Crystal, Duke and Bruce! I know all too well about the "slipage"... After not riding for years I decided to take some lessons so that I can learn the "right" way. I like Western style just because .

Most stables here in the North East teach English. My Sister is taking lessons in that style and when she asked me why I want to ride Western I tole her "Cowboys rule"

[Duke]

I agree, western is better, since my butt looks too girly and out of place in an english saddle. that an I dont like wearing the breechs that they wear. spandex is not a good idea, an the guy that invented it needs to be shot.j/k

[Timothy]

I decided as a rider I'd speak up about the boot/stirrup issue.

Pointed toes were designed for broncy colts and cold mornings. Sometimes you need that right stirrup right now!

I thought work boots were designed not to fit stirrups because they aren't safe to ride with. Mud treads and stirrups don't mix. I have been drug. Ten yards can seem like ten miles. Don't take that chance.

Timothy