Good machine for my projects

[PapaWolf]

I have seen a lot of talk about sewing machines on here, and A LOT of the terminology goes right over my head. I am looking for a sewing machine good for 8-9 oz leather as that will be probably the thickest I will be dealing with. I just need something that will hold up and hopefully not cost me an arm, as I need that to do the leatherworking...any ideas?!

[gunfighter48]

Hi PapaWolf,

Is 8oz the total thickness or will it be 2 layers or more of 8 oz leather. For a total of 8 oz or less there are a bunch of good machines for under $800 new that would meet your needs. If it's for 2 or more layers of 8-9 oz then the price will start pushing $1000-2000. A walking food machine is preferable but I have a bottom feed (uses feed dogs like a home machine) machine that will go 4 8oz layers like it's going thru butter. It costs $900 new with a table and servo motor. The servo motors can be slowed way down to make stitching more controllable, very nice when you are new.

I just bought a Consew CP206R portable walking foot machine to use on light weight projects. It will sew up to just short of 1/4 inch of leather but it's much happier with 10oz or less leather. I'm using it for wallets, book covers, gun bags, etc.

There are a lot of used machines out on the market but unless I can personally inspect the machine I stay away from used machines. The exception being machines offered for sale here on Leatherworker,net. The folks here won't steer you wrong!!!!

John

[Art]

High PW,

If a lot of stuff is over your head, please stop us and ask what the heck we are talking about. The nomenclature of sewing machines is something we all have to learn, and when we talk specifics, well, we just have to get specific. It is a lot easier to say "shuttle shim" than "the thingie that goes behind the shuttle to adjust the needle/hook clearance".

OK, so judging by some of your other posts, you will be using 8-9oz leather to do bag work, among other things. This kind of work is right at the top range of a medium duty machine like the Highlead GC22618, Artisan 2618-1B, Pfaff 345, etc. These are all cylinder arm machines which will make it easier to sew gussets into bags, I'm not saying you can't do it with a flat bed machine, but life is easier in bag world with a cylinder arm. If you want to put a welt in something at this thickness, it adds another 3-4oz to your sandwich and you might have to make a few adjustments as you are right at the top of the range. An advantage to these machines is "cheap feet", well not for the Pfaff, but the Highlead and Artisan machines use 111 feet which are plentiful.

The next step up is the Juki 441/Adler 206 class machines which can handle most anything or adjusted to handle almost anything. Keep in mind that Industrial (not "Industrial Strength") sewing machines can be adjusted or modified to sew darned near anything, but are "happiest" doing what they were designed to do, which may be a narrow range as most of the industrial sewing machines are designed and adjusted to do one thing all day every day and not really for "general" sewing.

About "Chinese" machines. Taiwan or Mainland, the Chinese are turning out pretty good machines from the "Notable Trademark" ISO factories. Whatever you buy, you need to trace it back to the factory it was made and hopefully engineered in. This might require several "hops" because there are a lot of companies doing consolidation (taking product from several factories and marketing them under one name), e.g. SunSew, and then companies over here doing that same thing. Some Chinese factories are good enough to be making machines for prominent Japanese companies, this does say something for quality, a lot of Consew and Mitsubishi machines are made in Mainland China factories.

About German machines. Pfaff and Adler are truly the best machines around. I will only ever own a used one as I can't afford a new one. Parts aren't inexpensive either, but they seldom need replacing. They are also like American cars in that you can get almost any option known to man to make them truly unique, or fill a desired place on your production line.

About money. Dollar is not doing well against the Euro, bad for us when buying German Iron. The Chinese currency is linked somewhat to the Dollar and this is good for us. However they are having a little inflationary spiral over there and their energy is costing more so things have been and will be going up on Chinese machines too. This can be good and bad. As the economy suffers some downturn, there will be a slowdown here in machine sales which may cause prices to go down after going up from the Chinese inflation. This kind of deflationary trend may or may not happen but could. Then again the prices might go up and keep going up. You really need a good crystal ball for this. None of this is good for the guys who sell these machines. They might have a couple of lean years.

About the used market. Eyes open, ears up, there are going to be some really great deals out there in the coming months. As money tightens, cash will rule in these markets. A little mechanical and sewing machine knowledge, and ability to evaluate the condition of a machine will pay off with great deals; buy the machine you need for yourself, don't try to be a dealer and resell it unless you really know what you are doing, there was a reason you got it for that good price.

Now it's your turn PW, ask us some questions.

Art

I have seen a lot of talk about sewing machines on here, and A LOT of the terminology goes right over my head. I am looking for a sewing machine good for 8-9 oz leather as that will be probably the thickest I will be dealing with. I just need something that will hold up and hopefully not cost me an arm, as I need that to do the leatherworking...any ideas?!

[Crystal]

Dito for me, Papa Wolf. I have the same questions and am only familiar with a "regular" sewing machine. Considering the same leather weight of 8-9 oz, probably doubled. I have been scouting some of the older machines like the Singer 29-4 and Singer 51W54 Hi post. Would either of these work for general tack and gun accessory projects with the previous stated leather weight? They are used machines and probably need some tlc - but I have looked and it seems like there are parts available for them. I would rather get something that will work the first time around, rather than spend a little money now only to have to dive in deeper after I learn that it isn't what I needed. Question on feed dogs - I have noticed that these machines do not have upper or lower feed dogs - how does that affect the stitching? I am guessing that you have to be rather consistant with your hands to get an even stitch. (I have done free motion quilting on quilts without the dogs - it isn't easy to get nice stitches.) Do the feed dogs on other machines leave impressions in the leather? Can this be corrected with tensioning or filing the dogs smoother? I am also quessing that there is a reason for all those pictures of SEVERAL sewing machines that folks have posted in their "workshop" photos! (One machine does not fill the bill.) I would just like to make sure that whatever I start out on will at least do what I need it to do for the time being.

Thanks-

Crystal

[Art]

Hi Crystal,

The Singer 29-4 has a feed dog, it just happens to also be the presser foot. The foot moves and the needle doesn't. The foot can also be orbited on its axis to change direction. Leather thickness 6-8oz single layer, not a lot more. Good shoe patching machine and good for sewing patches and emblems on sleeves. This is not a general leatherwork machines and was and still is a staple in the shoe repair industry for shoe tops. When you want to sew 18-24oz veg tan, I don't like the 51W54 either. Save up enough money to buy the machine to do the kind of work you do the most. Buy new if you don't have a clue.

Art

Dito for me, Papa Wolf. I have the same questions and am only familiar with a "regular" sewing machine. Considering the same leather weight of 8-9 oz, probably doubled. I have been scouting some of the older machines like the Singer 29-4 and Singer 51W54 Hi post. Would either of these work for general tack and gun accessory projects with the previous stated leather weight? They are used machines and probably need some tlc - but I have looked and it seems like there are parts available for them. I would rather get something that will work the first time around, rather than spend a little money now only to have to dive in deeper after I learn that it isn't what I needed. Question on feed dogs - I have noticed that these machines do not have upper or lower feed dogs - how does that affect the stitching? I am guessing that you have to be rather consistant with your hands to get an even stitch. (I have done free motion quilting on quilts without the dogs - it isn't easy to get nice stitches.) Do the feed dogs on other machines leave impressions in the leather? Can this be corrected with tensioning or filing the dogs smoother? I am also quessing that there is a reason for all those pictures of SEVERAL sewing machines that folks have posted in their "workshop" photos! (One machine does not fill the bill.) I would just like to make sure that whatever I start out on will at least do what I need it to do for the time being.

Thanks-

Crystal

[Crystal]

Hi Crystal,

The Singer 29-4 has a feed dog, it just happens to also be the presser foot. The foot moves and the needle doesn't. The foot can also be orbited on its axis to change direction. Leather thickness 6-8oz single layer, not a lot more. Good shoe patching machine and good for sewing patches and emblems on sleeves. This is not a general leatherwork machines and was and still is a staple in the shoe repair industry for shoe tops. When you want to sew 18-24oz veg tan, I don't like the 51W54 either. Save up enough money to buy the machine to do the kind of work you do the most. Buy new if you don't have a clue.

Art

Thanks, Art. That's what I needed to know.

Crystal

[PT Tack]

Dito for me, Papa Wolf. I have the same questions and am only familiar with a "regular" sewing machine. Considering the same leather weight of 8-9 oz, probably doubled. I have been scouting some of the older machines like the Singer 29-4 and Singer 51W54 Hi post. Would either of these work for general tack and gun accessory projects with the previous stated leather weight? They are used machines and probably need some tlc - but I have looked and it seems like there are parts available for them. I would rather get something that will work the first time around, rather than spend a little money now only to have to dive in deeper after I learn that it isn't what I needed. Question on feed dogs - I have noticed that these machines do not have upper or lower feed dogs - how does that affect the stitching? I am guessing that you have to be rather consistant with your hands to get an even stitch. (I have done free motion quilting on quilts without the dogs - it isn't easy to get nice stitches.) Do the feed dogs on other machines leave impressions in the leather? Can this be corrected with tensioning or filing the dogs smoother? I am also quessing that there is a reason for all those pictures of SEVERAL sewing machines that folks have posted in their "workshop" photos! (One machine does not fill the bill.) I would just like to make sure that whatever I start out on will at least do what I need it to do for the time being.

Thanks-

Crystal

Hi Crystal I have a singer 51w54 I am not using that I am looking to sell but I am in Florida

[LTC]

it's been six years since they posted that. betting they already bought one since then. lol