Reversing Oscillating Hook Machines

[amuckart]

Hi all,

I've got a Singer 45k25 that I finally got mounted up and running yesterday. The manual for the machine says not to run it in reverse, and only to turn the hand wheel towards the operator, but watching the action of the hook with the foot up and no thread I can't see why it wouldn't build stitches running backwards as well as forwards.

Am I missing something? Is it actually bad for the machines/needles to run them backwards?

Cheers.

[Wizcrafts]

Hi all,

I've got a Singer 45k25 that I finally got mounted up and running yesterday. The manual for the machine says not to run it in reverse, and only to turn the hand wheel towards the operator, but watching the action of the hook with the foot up and no thread I can't see why it wouldn't build stitches running backwards as well as forwards.

Am I missing something? Is it actually bad for the machines/needles to run them backwards?

Cheers.

The point on the oscillating shuttle is only designed to pick the thread off the needle when it moves in one direction. After picking off the loop it allows it to flow around the shuttle and bobbin housing, forming the lockstitch. If you run it in reverse, the timing will be wrong, the point will not pick up the loop on the needle and no stitch will be formed.

[amuckart]

The point on the oscillating shuttle is only designed to pick the thread off the needle when it moves in one direction. After picking off the loop it allows it to flow around the shuttle and bobbin housing, forming the lockstitch. If you run it in reverse, the timing will be wrong, the point will not pick up the loop on the needle and no stitch will be formed.

Thanks Wiz. I figured there wasn't much I could do to actually damage the machine so I had a go and I see what you mean. The shuttle hook picks up the thread but the timing of the takeup arm is all wrong when the machine is running backwards.

Looking at the mechanism though I'm now wondering how difficult it is to convert one of these old machines so it will feed in reverse. It looks like a matter of being able to push the pivoting axle for the stitch length adjuster in the head past bottom dead centre, and if I do this with no needle in the machine and the needle plate removed the feed dogs do feed backwards while the rest of the machine runs forwards.

I'm guessing it's not actually that simple and I'm missing something because if it were that simple to make them feed in reverse, why didn't they come from the factory with the capability?

Can anyone set me straight? Is it actually a fairly simple modification, or do lots of bits need changing to add reverse to a machine like a 45k? If it is simple, I'd like to give it a go.

Cheers.

[jimsaddler]

Thanks Wiz. I figured there wasn't much I could do to actually damage the machine so I had a go and I see what you mean. The shuttle hook picks up the thread but the timing of the takeup arm is all wrong when the machine is running backwards.

Looking at the mechanism though I'm now wondering how difficult it is to convert one of these old machines so it will feed in reverse. It looks like a matter of being able to push the pivoting axle for the stitch length adjuster in the head past bottom dead centre, and if I do this with no needle in the machine and the needle plate removed the feed dogs do feed backwards while the rest of the machine runs forwards.

I'm guessing it's not actually that simple and I'm missing something because if it were that simple to make them feed in reverse, why didn't they come from the factory with the capability?

Can anyone set me straight? Is it actually a fairly simple modification, or do lots of bits need changing to add reverse to a machine like a 45k? If it is simple, I'd like to give it a go.

Cheers.

Hi Al

It's not worth bothering to do it as you can buy a clone that has reverse for what it would cost to convert it.

Kindest Regards.

Jim Saddler.

[amuckart]

Hi Al

It's not worth bothering to do it as you can buy a clone that has reverse for what it would cost to convert it.

Kindest Regards.

Jim Saddler.

Really? Either clones can be had way cheaper or it's vastly more complex a change than I thought, or are you talking about paying a mechanic to do it for me?

Most of the point of the exercise for me right now is to figure out how to do it seeing as I've realised that I have to take the machine completely apart anyway to re-drill and tap the screws that hold the big-round-bit-I-don't-know-the-name-of[1] onto the drive shaft because right now they're stripped and the timing only stays right for about 2 stitches.

Of course, I can probably figure out how reverse works by taking one of my wife's 66ks apart, since they have fundamentally the same mechanism, but that might not be a long-term survival strategy .

Cheers.

[1] round bit in front of the head, attached to the front end of the top drive shaft, that the needle bar con-rod connects to and that actuates the thread take-up lever.