DenverLeather Report post Posted May 28, 2011 After 2-3 days of building and setting up my Singer 153, I sewed about 10 lines on leather........ and managed to get thread jammed under the bobbin case..... A simple google search revealed that this can tend to be a terrible, and sometimes expensive, problem. Hurray for stupidity!! I should have just taken a handful of hundred dollar bills and burned them in the grill, as a Memorial Day celebration...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amuckart Report post Posted May 28, 2011 Threads under the bobbin case shouldn't be a horrendously expensive problem to fix. Whip the bobbin case out and clean the birdsnest out. Can you see what caused it? Sounds like either the top tension is going wonky or the timing of the thread take up is off. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 28, 2011 Threads under the bobbin case shouldn't be a horrendously expensive problem to fix. Whip the bobbin case out and clean the birdsnest out. Can you see what caused it? Sounds like either the top tension is going wonky or the timing of the thread take up is off. I'm assuming I pulled the bobbin thread with slightly too much pressure, when finishing a run. I'm trying to take the bobbin case out now, but am assuming that I'll end up throwing off the timing (if I haven't already).... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 28, 2011 Birdsnest cleaned out..... Now the bobbin won't turn.... This might have been the issue prior to the birdsnest.... Clueless... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amuckart Report post Posted May 29, 2011 I get the impression you're fairly new to sewing machines? The basics of timing a machine are actually quite simple, and largely transferrable from machine to machine, so don't stress too much about that. Do you have pictures of the bobbin/shuttle area? When you say the bobbin won't turn, is it not rotating in the bobbin holder, or is the shuttle itself jammed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 29, 2011 I get the impression you're fairly new to sewing machines? The basics of timing a machine are actually quite simple, and largely transferrable from machine to machine, so don't stress too much about that. Do you have pictures of the bobbin/shuttle area? When you say the bobbin won't turn, is it not rotating in the bobbin holder, or is the shuttle itself jammed? "New to sewing machines" is an understatement, unfortunately... I suppose I was referring to the shuttle. Here's a picture? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 29, 2011 Anyone - Are these things lined up correctly? Or are they 180 degrees off? (see picture, with arrows pointing to "yellow" parts of the machine) Thanks.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amuckart Report post Posted May 29, 2011 I'm not specifically familiar with that machine, but they look right to me. I'd say the lower-left one in the picture is to stop the bobbin spinning around, and the upper right one in the picture is the hook that should pick up the top thread to build the stitch. If you remove the bobbin and the top thread and turn the machine over by hand is the hook turning? Have a look at the Singer Manuals there are manuals for various 153s in there. The quality isn't great but with the machine in front of you it's easy enough to figure out what's what. I don't know what sub-model you have, but the manual for the 153k101, 102, 103 and 154k101 has a section at the end for adjusters that is probably quite useful to you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 29, 2011 I'm not specifically familiar with that machine, but they look right to me. I'd say the lower-left one in the picture is to stop the bobbin spinning around, and the upper right one in the picture is the hook that should pick up the top thread to build the stitch. If you remove the bobbin and the top thread and turn the machine over by hand is the hook turning? Have a look at the Singer Manuals there are manuals for various 153s in there. The quality isn't great but with the machine in front of you it's easy enough to figure out what's what. I don't know what sub-model you have, but the manual for the 153k101, 102, 103 and 154k101 has a section at the end for adjusters that is probably quite useful to you. When I remove the bobbin & top thread, and turn the machine over by hand, the hook doesn't seem to turn completely every time... Sometimes it just barely turns.... On some turns, it seems to get "stuck" - or "mis-fire" if that makes any sense... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amuckart Report post Posted May 29, 2011 When I remove the bobbin & top thread, and turn the machine over by hand, the hook doesn't seem to turn completely every time... Sometimes it just barely turns.... On some turns, it seems to get "stuck" - or "mis-fire" if that makes any sense... I'm working off general principles here. If there's someone out there with direct experience with this model of machine, they may be able to point you to more specific things that relate to this exact machine. That makes sense, yes. Can you feel any resistance in the mechanism when you do this? It helps to slip the belt off the flywheel when you test this. If it's all smooth but the hook just doesn't go round it sounds to me like the screw that holds it in place is completely undone. If there's 'chunks' of resistance it's probably still there, but loose. If this is the case you need to remove the hook (instructions are in the PDF I linked to above) and see what the screw looks like. If it isn't stripped and the thread it engages with isn't damaged, then it should be a fairly simple case of putting the hook back in and tightening the screw up. You'll probably have to re-time the machine again, but that isn't as difficult as it sounds. If nothing else it sounds like this machine will be a good learning experience (kinda like my 45k which still isn't back together but has taught me a lot). I'm pretty sure everyone has had these, not even Bob and Wiz were born knowing this stuff so be patient and you'll get it working eventually. If you want to learn how sewing machines work in a general sense, I'd recommend getting hold of an old domestic Singer, models 201, 66, 15 or 99 are good, and completely stripping and reassembling it. They're simple machines that pretty much only go back together one way and there's good information online about how to work on them, set the timing etc, and the principles are directly applicable to other machines, even big industrials. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
machinehead Report post Posted May 30, 2011 Maybe when the thread jam happened the safety clutch disengaged. Its purpose is to disengage when there is stress on the hook so as to prevent damage to the machine. To see if this is what happened, go into the link for adjusters that amuckart provided and scroll down until you see info about the safety clutch. It will be a fairly easy diagnosis and if that is what is going on with your machine the safety clutch should be easy for you to engage again. What size needle and thread are you using? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted May 30, 2011 Maybe when the thread jam happened the safety clutch disengaged. Its purpose is to disengage when there is stress on the hook so as to prevent damage to the machine. To see if this is what happened, go into the link for adjusters that amuckart provided and scroll down until you see info about the safety clutch. It will be a fairly easy diagnosis and if that is what is going on with your machine the safety clutch should be easy for you to engage again. What size needle and thread are you using? Here's video........ If anyone can advise.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amuckart Report post Posted May 31, 2011 I think machinehead has it right and the safety clutch has disengaged. The very last page of that PDF I linked to above has instructions on resetting it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anne Bonnys Locker Report post Posted June 3, 2011 That machine needs a bloody good clean out before you go too much further. Remove whatever bits come out easily then get in there with a good cleaning brush or even a tooth brush. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DenverLeather Report post Posted June 3, 2011 Ok everyone.......... Amuckart had it right --- the safety clutch disengaged (and the machine is apparently also missing a spring on the safety clutch).. Anyway, I had a guy come out yesterday..... Problem resolved & machine is sewing! Thank you all for the help --- but this was too big of an initial problem for me to conquer, only just learning the art. That said ---- because of this problem, I DID take much of the machine apart, myself, and am starting to learn how this thing works. Again, thanks all. ALSO --- the Technician said that my "Servo Motor with Gear Reducer" is awfully loud for being a Servo Motor... It's a brand new motor from Toledo Industrial...... Would anyone agree with this?? You can CLEARLY hear the noise on the video I posted. The Technician said it sounds like metal grinding against metal.... Any thoughts on THIS issue would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Art Report post Posted June 3, 2011 The Chinese have started producing brushless motors, they tend to whine a lot, almost a new pump (that's all I can think of) kind of sound. I don't know if it gets any better with wear either. Art Ok everyone.......... Amuckart had it right --- the safety clutch disengaged (and the machine is apparently also missing a spring on the safety clutch).. Anyway, I had a guy come out yesterday..... Problem resolved & machine is sewing! Thank you all for the help --- but this was too big of an initial problem for me to conquer, only just learning the art. That said ---- because of this problem, I DID take much of the machine apart, myself, and am starting to learn how this thing works. Again, thanks all. ALSO --- the Technician said that my "Servo Motor with Gear Reducer" is awfully loud for being a Servo Motor... It's a brand new motor from Toledo Industrial...... Would anyone agree with this?? You can CLEARLY hear the noise on the video I posted. The Technician said it sounds like metal grinding against metal.... Any thoughts on THIS issue would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CowboyBob Report post Posted June 4, 2011 The problem is this particular motor is the metal gears in the reducer part of the motor,they have a gear whine that usually quiets down as you use it more. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimsaddler Report post Posted June 4, 2011 Well my latest shipment of Chinese Servo 550 watt Motors make no real noise at all. In fact they are as close to perfect as I could wish. Running from 300 revolutions to 3.600 max. They can be set at any max Speed in between and operate from 300 to the set speed. They run so quietly and efficiently I can't understand why anyone would use anything else. Especially when they have excellent torque at all revolutions. Sewing 7/8" of Harness at 300 revs is a snack. Kindest Regards. Jim Saddler. The problem is this particular motor is the metal gears in the reducer part of the motor,they have a gear whine that usually quiets down as you use it more. Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CowboyBob Report post Posted June 4, 2011 (edited) Jim, The reason that anyone would want to use anything different is this motor(w/builtin gear reducer)is it goes down to almost 10 rpm(output speed) & still has torque,top speed is 800,we also have the same motor as you have but since it only goes to 300 rpm this is still to fast for most leather machines,unless they put a speed reducer on it which cost more $$ & is not easy to install for most people. Cheers, Bob Edited June 4, 2011 by sewmun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimsaddler Report post Posted June 4, 2011 Sorry Bob actually I was referring to Clutch Motors, my mistake. I put 1 1/2" Pulleys on all my Motors so this reduces speeds considerably, especially when a reducer is used. Please have a Happy day. Kindest Regards. Jim. Jim, The reason that anyone would want to use anything different is this motor(w/builtin gear reducer)is it goes down to almost 10 rpm(output speed) & still has torque,top speed is 800,we also have the same motor as you have but since it only goes to 300 rpm this is still to fast for most leather machines,unless they put a speed reducer on it which cost more $ & is not easy to install for most people. Cheers, Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anne Bonnys Locker Report post Posted June 5, 2011 Jim, The reason that anyone would want to use anything different is this motor(w/builtin gear reducer)is it goes down to almost 10 rpm(output speed) & still has torque,top speed is 800,we also have the same motor as you have but since it only goes to 300 rpm this is still to fast for most leather machines,unless they put a speed reducer on it which cost more $ & is not easy to install for most people. Cheers, Bob All of this effort to run a machine at the speed of a treadle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Art Report post Posted June 5, 2011 Hi Darren, I have used a treadle patcher and more than a few bigger treadle machines. I'll go with the new motors every time now. Since the advent of the modern and cheaper servos (as opposed to the German ones that really are good) the motor industry has been coming up hill and produces a pretty good product. With the new (about a year since they were readily available) brushless motors (which do make a little more noise), the torque available throughout the speed range makes them a joy to work with. Very seldom do I have to wheel the machine, like almost never, I can creep the needle up and down and keep both hands on the work. I am not totally sold on the internal reduced motors for big machines, but they work great on medium and small machines like 5550s and 618s. When I said that the new brushless motors whine a bit, I was serious, however it is not a negative. They are just a little bit noisy and you shouldn't go looking for something wrong with the machine. I have a Metabo grinder that I bought in 1974 that has the same whine or noise in it that it has had since I got it. Best grinder I have and it's got a LOT of miles on it. It's nice to have another hand when sewing, especially heavy stuff, give me the new motors every time, if I want to crank, I'll use the ol' No.9. Art All of this effort to run a machine at the speed of a treadle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KAYAK45 Report post Posted June 5, 2011 GOOD NEWS! Thats the easiest thing to solve you could have. Get Bob on the phone to listen and talk you through some diagnosis and your problem will go away, one way or another. The main thing you get from Toledo Industrial is Bob! He also could/would/will, talk you through almost any problem with you machine. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
