TXAG Report post Posted January 17, 2014 Still don't know how to get the other passes "centered", but oh well. Guess I'll never know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIS Leads Report post Posted January 18, 2014 I like it! I'm still working on much smaller knots with just one color! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 20, 2014 Thanks...you will get better...It took many, many hours of practice and frustration, coupled with setting it all aside occasionally to get to this point...keep at it and you'll be tying better than me before you know it... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leatherpownder Report post Posted January 21, 2014 Gettin' fancy now Texan. Looks good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bucksnort Report post Posted January 21, 2014 Nice job. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
King's X Report post Posted January 21, 2014 You can try one of two things. Do as I have done and take it apart OR gently massage it back to center especially as you tighten it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 21, 2014 Thanks, Bret and Buck...that means a lot coming from y'all... King's X...I probably didn't explain what I'm trying to do very effectively...here is the knot I'm trying to make: http://leatherworker.net/forum/uploads/gallery/album_1990/med_gallery_29082_1990_61216.jpg I've tried doing the first and second pass one color and the third and fourth another color and cannot get it to look like that. I guess I probably never will...not smart enough. Thanks again for the encouragement everyone... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
King's X Report post Posted January 22, 2014 With time and practice you will get it. As you tighten them down it will straighten out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) I appreciate the sentiment, but it isn't something that is going to straighten out. I'll post a pic in a minute since I cannot explain what I mean correctly...it'll make sense then.... Edited January 22, 2014 by TXAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Ok, so here's the pic...first two passes are brown...passes 3 and 4, white... See how at the top there is just one brown lead? And at the bottom there are two (or three?) brown leads? I want it instead to have two brown on top and two brown on bottom. Does that make more sense? I guess I do not communicate well without pictures... If I counted right, this final knot has 13 parts, right? I guess that's why it will never be able to have the same number of one color on top and bottom...is that right? Edited January 22, 2014 by TXAG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 22, 2014 <crickets> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
megabit Report post Posted January 22, 2014 Looking at the picture Alan posted I can't tell for sure that he has more than one strand on top. Maybe you have it right? Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GrampaJoel Report post Posted January 22, 2014 I too, think you have it right. The example is shot in such a way as to hide the end you are trying to outwit. Tighten one of your up and the photo it like the example. I'll bet they look the same. Joel Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 23, 2014 Well, I appreciate that...you're both probably right...I just wish I could figure out if there's a different knot I could tie that could get it...balanced? Same number of colored leads on both ends... I don't think it is possible with this specific knot... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bucksnort Report post Posted January 23, 2014 Not sure without taking the time to try it, but my guess is you do the 1st & last pass the same color & if you want an even number of each color you need a n even number of parts. Hope this helps. Buck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyout Report post Posted January 23, 2014 If you tie a 32p x32b, 4 Pass, Type 2 Pineapple Knot instead of a 30p x 32b, 4 Pass, Type 1 Pineapple Knot, I think it will be what you're looking for. Your 1st and 2nd brown leads will both consist of a 9 part x 8 bight, then follow with the 3rd and 4th white passes of 7 part x 8 bight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 24, 2014 I appreciate your help, but I am confused...you said, "instead of a 30L x 32B"...the knot I tied and had pics of on the first page was a 13L x 8B...so I would not even know how to tie a 30L x 32B knot...not a 32L x 32B one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyout Report post Posted January 24, 2014 (edited) To me it looks like this: The double line in this drawing is a 9p x 8b TH. The single blue line is a 7p x 8b TH. Notice there are 4 red dots on the 9p x 8b drawing that match the 4 red dots on your 1st brown pass in your pic. The green dots on the 7p x 8b drawing match the green dots on your 2nd brown pass in your pic. The 3rd and 4th white passes would also be the same as having green dots. This would mean you have one (the 1st brown pass) 9part x 8bight TH and three (the 2nd brown pass plus the 3rd and 4th white passes) 7part x 8bight TH's. If you add all the parts together it equals 30 parts. Do the same w/the bights and you get 32 bights. This would make it (following Tom Halls' way of naming PK's) a 30 part x 32 bight, 4 pass, Type 1 Pineapple Knot w/a 9 part x 8 bight base knot. Great job on it by the way! Edited January 24, 2014 by skyout Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 28, 2014 Thanks for the detailed diagram. I will try to understand what you wrote...it will probably take a while... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyout Report post Posted January 29, 2014 I hope it helps. Don't hesitate if you have any questions, I'll try to help as many others here will too. Tom Hall's Introduction to Turk's Head Knots is one of the best books for understanding Pineapple Knots. jmo It's free in pdf format on Facebook in "The mighty turkshead knot" group in the files section. I was actually trying to tie the 32p x32b, 4 Pass, Type 2 Pineapple Knot but my mandrel was too small so the 4th interweave was getting way too tight. I'll have to take it apart and try again later. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tracym Report post Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) I've been trying to find a tutorial for a type 2 pineapple knot with no success - anyone have one? Edited January 29, 2014 by Tracym Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TXAG Report post Posted January 29, 2014 I hope it helps. Don't hesitate if you have any questions, I'll try to help as many others here will too. Tom Hall's Introduction to Turk's Head Knots is one of the best books for understanding Pineapple Knots. jmo It's free in pdf format on Facebook in "The mighty turkshead knot" group in the files section. I was actually trying to tie the 32p x32b, 4 Pass, Type 2 Pineapple Knot but my mandrel was too small so the 4th interweave was getting way too tight. I'll have to take it apart and try again later. Yes, I have had that book for a while now. It is helpful...but I still don't understand parts of it...like that way he says to name pineapple knots...oh well... Are you tying the 32L x 32B knot from an over/under pattern somewhere? I'd really like to find the pattern to do that... I've been trying to find a tutorial for a type 2 pineapple knot with no success - anyone have one? I thought those were covered in the tom hall book, Tracym...I don't like the type 2 ones very much because they don't seem as well-contained as the type 1 ones...they don't "close down" on the ends like the type 1 and don't look very "finished" to me. I doubt I will use them in any of the items I make, but I guess it is good to know how to tie them anyway...if I find it in the tom hall book, I'll let you know which page it's on... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyout Report post Posted January 29, 2014 The late Dan Alaska helped me a lot but he used a different way of naming knots than Tom Hall. I like Hall's way better because you know exactly what Turks Head knots go into the Pineapple knot. Dan has run lists for what he calls a Type 3, 4 Pass, but it is really a Type 4 according to Hall. It has a 7part x 6bight Primary (base) knot. You may be able to figure out how the Type 2 for a 9p x 8b is tied by following it. You just have to follow the same pattern one more time in the center for the larger knot. The top and bottom will be the same with 2 extra bights for the larger knot. This is the run list for the 2nd string using the 7p x6b TH: http://pineappleknotstutorials.over-blog.org/article-type-3-4-pass-pineapple-knot-2nd-string-90281932.html We lost a lot of tuts when he passed, but someone saved a lot of them and you can see them here: http://pineappleknotstutorials.over-blog.org/articles-blog.html I love the larger Type PKs. The more bights you have the larger the "pucker" effect is at the poles of knot. Any knot with a bight count larger than 4 will have a hole at the ends, the more bights, the larger the hole. Here are some beautiful larger Type PK's by Barry Brown. He helped me understand PKs more than anyone else. Unfortunately, a lot of Barry's diagrams on The Pineapple Knot Forum (http://pineapple.myfunforum.org/index.php) disappeared when Dan passed away. Check out Barry's awesome work here: http://ropeandcanvas.blogspot.com/p/miscellaneous.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyout Report post Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) Here's the one I was working on straight off the dowel w/o any dressing/tightening. I pulled the 4th pass out (not seen in pic) because it got too tight. Mine is black and gold for my daughters school, University of Central Florida, where she's graduating in April w/honor's. Whoo Hoo. Anyway, this is a 25 part x 24 bight, 3 Pass, Type 2 Pineapple Knot with a 9p x8b Turks Head Primary knot. This means there are two (black) 9p x 8b THs and one (gold) 7p x 8b TH. Edited January 29, 2014 by skyout Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
