Breaking Into The Industrial Market

[taliah]

Hi there.

I've been reading through a lot of the forums discussing various machines and what they're used for . . . and to be honest (and perfectly blunt) I'm so NEW to leather working (and sewing) most of it is just Greek to me. Can you help? I'm very eager to learn.

Here's my story:

I make leather book covers and simple leather bags from scrap upholstery leather. Totally self-taught. I use a home machine (Brother SE 400) which has served me well for the past 5 or so years. Recently I've begun creating flat-bottom bags that require my machine to sew through about 4 layers of thin leather . . . and my machine is none too happy. I'd also like to branch out and start to use thicker leathers, but that's never been an option with this machine. I'd also like to sew zippers without the fear of dying..but I'm not sure that will ever happen.

What I'm looking for:

I have about $1,200 to spend (including shipping, handling and all additional things).

I'm looking for a new machine. Maybe a 'starter' machine.

That's easy to use/learn for a newbie.

That will sew thin upholstery leather (let's say four layers of 1.1mm) but also give me the chance to try something thicker for strapping or wallets.

Does this exist?

Brand names you trust?

Where do you buy them? Online?

How much does shipping usually run for these large heavy machines?

(All the technical talk of bobbin and thread size have my brain wobbling around in my head - I know I need a walking foot machine, but that's really all I know.)

Your help is so much appreciated.

Thanks!

talia

[Wizcrafts]

From your work description I believe that a decent upholstery grade walking foot machine will suffice. Let me use a Chandler 406 RB as an example (there are many other brands similar to it).

This machine was designed for use in the upholstery trade. It has triple feed that ensures that multiple layers stay aligned. This machine has a large bobbin, style M, that holds about 50% more thread than most industrial machine bobbins. It has a heavy upper tension spring to properly tension thicker thread than any home machine can handle. Best of all, the presser feet can walk to a height of at least 1/2 inch, or slightly higher. This allows the machine to actually sew 3/8 inch of compressed material.

The next difference between upholstery grade machines and home or garment machines is the strength of the ciol spring that holds down the presser foot (feet). The Chandler in my example has a strong enough spring to hold down 3/8 inches of leather as the threaded needle ascends. Should the leather overpower the presser foot and lift with the needle, it will skip stitches and may bend or break the needle.

The Chandler sells for about $1200 shipped, so it is within your budget.

I hope this helps.

When you gain more experience and take on work that is circular, you will need to move up to a cylinder arm machine. That is a whole nuther story.

[JLSleather]

I have the Consew 206, which I think is comparable to the chandler Wiz refers to. No problems (well, that one time, which Wiz was able to fairly quickly walk me through).

And I've spoken with people who own the Cobra 18 and really like it.

[Techsew Ron]

From your work description I believe that a decent upholstery grade walking foot machine will suffice. Let me use a Chandler 406 RB as an example (there are many other brands similar to it).

This machine was designed for use in the upholstery trade. It has triple feed that ensures that multiple layers stay aligned. This machine has a large bobbin, style M, that holds about 50% more thread than most industrial machine bobbins. It has a heavy upper tension spring to properly tension thicker thread than any home machine can handle. Best of all, the presser feet can walk to a height of at least 1/2 inch, or slightly higher. This allows the machine to actually sew 3/8 inch of compressed material.

The next difference between upholstery grade machines and home or garment machines is the strength of the ciol spring that holds down the presser foot (feet). The Chandler in my example has a strong enough spring to hold down 3/8 inches of leather as the threaded needle ascends. Should the leather overpower the presser foot and lift with the needle, it will skip stitches and may bend or break the needle.

The Chandler sells for about $1200 shipped, so it is within your budget.

I hope this helps.

When you gain more experience and take on work that is circular, you will need to move up to a cylinder arm machine. That is a whole nuther story.

Here are some other machines in the same category and price range:

Consew 206

Techsew 106

Cobra 18

And here are some cylinder bed walking foot machines which are convenient for sewing bags:

Consew 227

Cowboy 227

Techsew 2700

Ron

Edited February 5, 2014 by Techsew Ron

[taliah]

Thank you so much for your quick responses!!! Such a great help you are! I was lost in a sea of possibilities (kinda like Starbucks) and now I have an idea!

Thanks!

[BigGriff]

I'm pretty much in the same boat. I want to make wallets, belts, guitar straps, rifle slings, messenger bags and duffel bags. Is there one machine that can handle all these? I was thinking Cowboy 3200, but I would love some input. There's a Techsew matine that is pretty similar. Not trying to hijack this thread, but would love some input.

[Wizcrafts]

I'm pretty much in the same boat. I want to make wallets, belts, guitar straps, rifle slings, messenger bags and duffel bags. Is there one machine that can handle all these? I was thinking Cowboy 3200, but I would love some input. There's a Techsew matine that is pretty similar. Not trying to hijack this thread, but would love some input.

Your work list falls mostly up to 1/4 inch of leather, which any flat bed, compound feed, walking foot machine can handle. However, your last two items are circular or shaped bags, which are best sewn on a cylinder arm machine. Let's analyze the thread range requirements.

Wallet interiors are usually about 1 or 2 ounces per piece and doubled up. So, you need to be able to sew down to 2 or 3 ounces minimum. This calls for no larger than #69 bonded thread. The correct needle size for #69 thread is either #16 or #18, leather point.

Wallet backs are typically about 4 or 5 ounces thick. Add this to a 2 to 4 ounce interior package and you get between 6 and 9 ounces total. This can be sewn with #92 bonded thread, using a #19 or #20 leather point needle.

Belts and lined guitar straps are usually range between 8 and 12 ounces total, which is best sewn with #138 thread and a #23 needle.

Lined, padded leather rifle slings have two separate parts that overlap where the tail attaches to the body. If each lined piece is about 6 to 8 ounces, the maximum thickness at the overlap area would be between 12 to 16 ounces, which #138 sews together nicely. If you have carved or stamped veg-tan bodies, that adds about 3 or 4 more ounces, for a total package of about 20 ounces (5/16 inch). These are best sewn with #207 bonded thread, using either a #23 or #24 needle.

Messenger bags made from 5 ounce leather would have about 10 ounce seams to sew inside out. #138 thread will do fine.

Synapsys

Your work will range from 2 or 3 ounces up to about 20 ounces. Your thread requirements range from #69 through #207, but #138 will do. The Techsew 2700 or Cowboy CB227 are the best machines for these items, thicknesses and thread sizes. Both are cylinder arm machines, with 10.5" arms. They use the standard walking foot system 135x16 leather point and 135x17 regular point needles, available everywhere industrial sewing machines are sold. This needle system is available in sizes from 12 up to 25. Your work would require needles in sizes 16 or 18 through 23 or 24.

The aforementioned machines max out at 3/8 inches under the feet. They are medium duty, triple feed, walking foot machines, with reverse. They take all manner of presser feet.

If you decide that you want to sew holsters, weight belts, gun belts, knife sheathes, motorcycle saddlebags, and horse tack, that class of machine will be underpowered and incapable of sewing the thickness of material or thread required. This is where the CB3200, 3500, 4500, or 5500 come into their own. Ditto for the Cobra Class 3 and 4 and the Techsew 4100 and 5100. These are known as 441 clones, based upon the design of the Juki TSC-441, but at 1/3 to 1/2 the price. They sew items ranging from about 6 ounces, up to about 50 ounces (7/8"), with thread sizes #138 through #415, using needle sizes 23 through 27. While some people have success sewing lighter leather, with thinner thread and non-leather point needles, it requires a major readjustment to dumb them down for light work and thin needles-thread, then smarten them up for heavy work, needles and thread. Tis best to have one machine for light work, with thin thread and short needles and another for heavy work, with long, large diameter needles and thick, taut thread.

[wlg190861]

Cowboy

[MsMaggie]

Hi, I'm pretty much new to sewing and sewing leather (like the first post). I've done some hand sewing of leather and bought tools but now I want to sew leather on a machine and make wallets, handbags, tote bags mainly in leather, then eventually canvas. Eventually I will want to do messenger bags (rectangular- nothing where I would need a circular machine...at least not yet). I will use different leathers, not upholstery grade, but I might use a vegetable tanned leather which sometimes can be thicker.

My question is I'm debating whether to buy a Juki LU562 that is used (but was told it was made in Japan), a new Consew 206 made in China, or a new Highlead GC0618-15C also made in China.

I hear the older Juki's are great, especially the ones made in Japan. My concern is that because I'm new to sewing, I'm not sure which dealer to turn to (I'm in NYC). It's really all a gamble (honest/not honest?). If I buy a new one, I'm concerned that I won't get a better quality than the Juki. I don't want to get hung up on popular names. I just want something reliable that will last and grow with me until I'm ready to upgrade to another machine, if need be. With the older machines, I could be getting a better quality but then I'm wondering how much "milage" it has (I wouldn't know how many hours it had of usage and want type of usage). Would it need regular maintainance? Would I have to lug it on public transportation to get it serviced or have someone come service it?

I don't want to over complicate this, but it seems the older machines and the newer machines can sometimes cost the same. I'm risking my hard earned money to take a shot at my creative ability and love for quality to design a beautiful end product. Any suggestions? Thanks for all your help. I'm still reading through the forum.

Maggie

[leatherjo]

I suggest you take material similar to what you are going to be using down to Keystone sewing in Philadelphia, and try out their machines. See which one you like best on your material. They are very knowledgeable and helpful. They also carry a wide variety of machines. It might be best if you called first to make an appointment just so you both can find a good time and day for what will probably be a lengthy visit. Have fun!